This new charger lets all EVs plug in without an adapter
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We aren’t moving to J3400 for elegance. We’re moving to J3400 because there are business deals in place for the move.
Elegance is an optional (and unimportant) side effect to manufacturers.
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Ars Legatus Legionis
My bad. Yeah confusing they are doing it for both L2 (AC charging) and Fast DC and using the name for both. More confusing the article is talking about Fast DC charging and then showing L2 photo.They're actually doing it to both types. The one in the photo is a L2 charger, and is a retrofit to a model that I use on a regular basis.
https://www.chargepoint.com/businesses/stations/cp6000
They are also doing this for CCS1 as well on the other model.
But the photo is for an L2 station. I have no idea why Ars choose to feature the L2 plug on their article's headline image. Its also in the file name: ChargePoint_Omni_AC-copy.png
Given how ubiquitous and cheap AC (L2) NACS to CCS adapters are I think the Fast DC will be more important. I have had a J1772 to NACS adapter in my glove box for almost a decade now. I never really use it because I rarely charge at public L2 chargers.
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It's ChargePoint's version of the Tesla's 'Magic Dock', but in reverse. The cable itself has a CCS connector on it. Then there's an adapter to NACS that the receptacle holds. Depending on which connector you select on the screen, it either dispenses only the cable or the cable with the adapter attached. Presumably you can't manually disconnect the adapter from the cable.
Seems like a reasonably elegant solution. Certainly compared to their existing solution of having a dedicated connector for each protocol on each station (CCS, CHAdeMO and Tesla/NACS)
The headline is also a bit misleading ('This new charger lets all EVs plug in without an adapter') - this solution doesn't work for CHAdeMO.
Would have been helpful for the article to show those photos (or a clip from the video) to make it clearer.
(Also, the reference to J1776 should probably read J1772).
Seems like a reasonably elegant solution. Certainly compared to their existing solution of having a dedicated connector for each protocol on each station (CCS, CHAdeMO and Tesla/NACS)
The headline is also a bit misleading ('This new charger lets all EVs plug in without an adapter') - this solution doesn't work for CHAdeMO.
Would have been helpful for the article to show those photos (or a clip from the video) to make it clearer.
(Also, the reference to J1776 should probably read J1772).
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I’m also in BC, and I don’t think I’ve ever encountered a dual charger. Lots of Tesla superchargers, though.
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Ars Legatus Legionis
But a better nicer plug is a nice bonus for consumers well for consumers not using the omni plug which looks like a portable heavy pulse rifle from a scifi movie.
Pew pew pew. The guy is looking at it confused like I am not sure I am licensed to operate high output energy weapons am I?
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It will likely ironically be far more important for chademo users, as the pressure to remove the chademo cable on existing chargers to add an NACS one would likely be pretty big.
Built in adaptors are just more convient for both types of chargers. Most people for a while will be carrying around both most likely.
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Ars Legatus Legionis
One more nail in the coffin for Chademo. I will use this a reminder for how sleazy it is that Nissan continues to sell the Leaf in 2024 with Chademo port.
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You had dual Tesla and CCS1 chargers? Tesla and J1772 dual/combo chargers existed here, but I can't think of any combo DCFCers.
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"Omni" actually made me thin they support every standard out there (for example also CHAdeMO), and the "new charger works without an adapted" made me think of some fancy morphing plug that somehow works in all connectors. The innovation seems to be they automatically give you the adapter as needed. I like simple, old school solutions but somehow the title and message of the article oversell the importance and innovation of the charger.
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Leaf owners who need ubiquitous quick charging now have a couple CCS->ChaDeMo adapter options on the market. They are around $1,000 since they require active electronics and expect relatively low-volume sales, but they are available and found to work with many current networks.
https://www.autoblog.com/2024/02/06/chademo-ccs-charging-adapter-nissan-leaf/
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This article reminded me, GM was supposed to offer me a NACS adapter I thought as early as May. It's well in to August now. Not a shock, GM has had about as good a track record as Boeing in recent years, and breaking promises to Bolt owners just seems to be what their corporate team does to pass the time.
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Okay now THAT makes good sense.
So the adapter returns to "inside" the charging machine and it basically rotates or attaches the proper adapter already attached to a single cable.
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Might be able to place the blame on that at Tesla's door. The Ford adapter has seen some delays, though they are making it out to owners, because of lower production than anticipated. It's supposed to be sources from Tesla.
Not sure if GM is getting theirs from Tesla or someone else.
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Even Nissan recognizes the port is dead. But from a public good standpoint we need to keep those ports around for a long while. Especially without any sort of vendor approved adaptors. I don't think we should leave people behind in the transition.
I would really hope Nissan at some point will release a first party adaptor for them.
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But not quite as innovative as a pump with three buttons for 89, 91, and 95, and just a single hose.
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The real news is chargepoint finally increasing their cable length. Even with ports on the front drivers side locations using chargepoint are often problematic.
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This is likely a problem is with Tesla, which is far less reliable. The delays occurred immediately after they fired the entire fucking supercharger division of the company.
Without access to super chargers right now there is no reason to have an adaptor.
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It really isn't that complicated.
Can you handle this?
Congrats, you can handle plugging in your car. If you can't, then you should not be driving a car.
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Wrong. Not a pair of cables, it is exactly the opposite of this sentence. They created a nesting plug interface that is "chosen" upon starting the charge process.
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magnetic latch relays for high current charge applications are mature and cheap technology (pretty standard in marine battery charging solutions). it would be simple to engineer a reliable solution that connects / disconnects the appropriate connector off a simple 12v signal wire using nothing but off the shelf retail parts.
Here is a marine version intended for 12-24v 500A applications, but rated for up to 700V. It retails for around $300
https://www.bluesea.com/products/76...rging_Relay_with_Manual_Control_-_12V_DC_500A
this would be a drop in ready off the shelf part for $300 (retail) that could be used to turn on & off the different cables coming out of the charger. I'm sure you could buy them in bulk for a LOT cheaper
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I think the key is the ability to retrofit existing chargers with it.. I would hope any future solutions designed from the ground up would be NACS first.
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The point is these units are already in the field. They can be retrofitted with this rather than replaced and serve more cars easily.
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J3400 is an open standard.. the business deals you're mentioning are for access to the Tesla supercharger network and plug-and-charge billing.
Access to superchargers is a huge consumer win regardless.
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The article text is quite misleading IMO. It talks about 2 connectors, a pair of cables, and a selection process that releases the correct one. It never explicitly mentions there being an adaptor on the end.
Maybe the 'like magic dock ... Pair of cables' sentence is a typo? Because magic dock Tesla stations don't have a pair of cables.
Maybe the 'like magic dock ... Pair of cables' sentence is a typo? Because magic dock Tesla stations don't have a pair of cables.
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I know some people won't agree but I really don't think much is being lost for CHAdeMO users. Gen 1 Leafs are almost pointless to quick charge. Relatively slow quick charging and limited range make quick charging really unpractical even if you do actually have the charging port, which was optional for the entire life of the Gen 1. Even the Gen 2 Leaf + just make it up to the passable level in good situations. 200+ nominal range so 150+ mile quick charge stops are possible but topping out at ~70kW it's still going to be 30 -45 minute stop for that charging.
Leafs have a lot more limitations in quick charging than just the availability of chargers and an adapter doesn't solve any of those. Low max charging rate makes for a pretty slow, quick charging experience and the ratio of drive time to charge time pretty poor. It's pretty much the road trips sucks example, along with the Bolt, that EV haters use. Add on top of that the lack of thermal management for the battery and you are both risking battery damage long term from the heat of quick charging and potentially even pushing the car into turtle mode (limited power) while driving and/or ending up with your second or third quick charge stop for the day maxing out at 20kW or something low like that to keep battery temperature happy. The slow quick charge stops are bad enough but when they get even slower because of battery temperature it's even worse.
IMO if you are even considering the 1k adapter you have vehicle really poorly suited for your needs. You don't spend 1k on something you might use at some point or just in case you need it. You spend 1k because you know you will need it and use it with some regularity which means somewhat regular fast charging and the Leaf just isn't a great car for that. We love ours. It's a great little car and perfect for our local needs but it is a local only car.
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Poe's law. People seriously say shit as stupid as what you said, even if you meant it in jest.
Speaking of taking a joke, I literally posted a picture of a baby playing with a toy to demonstrate how simple plugging in an EV is.
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Imagine that the somewhat clickbaity nature of the title "now without an adapter!!!" accompanied the understanding that... "it comes with 2 cables", which is probably the least innovative way to solve this problem. At least the fancier "attached adapter as needed" is a bit more interesting.
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“I select what I want and it releases the cable I need” sounds like exactly the sort of solution that works great on installation and then breaks a couple years later and never gets fully fixed.
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One complaint regarding the CCS Combo 1 plug and socket was that the weight of the cable could cause poor connectivity with the control pins, resulting in various errors. Both the Tesla and CCS Combo 2 plugs and sockets use a better locking mechanism, so they have fewer connectivity problems.
Given how common Tesla chargers are in Canada, Mexico, and the US and how rare residential three-phase AC power is in much of North America, that was a big factor driving the change to NACS instead of Combo 2.
edit: clarification
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Nope, I don’t think you are missing anything. The state of the EV ecosystem in America has been hamstrung by a weak federal government (by slave-state founder design!) Thanks to Musk and the Japanese refusing to adhere to the standard here the way they did in Europe we have a mishmash of crap payment systems and three charging plugs. Charging stations have been allowed to get away with malicious compliance, minimal viable product, and zero maintenance.
Notice it’s also news that the chargers have cables long enough to reach the cars’ plugs.
Talking about malicious compliance, all the car makers have been sabotaging their own EV sales by producing ugly overpriced econoboxes, selling only in certain states, removing stalks and buttons and handles, even reinventing the wheel.
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The "road trips suck" is FUD for vehicles like the Bolt. While I don't think you'd want to take it for a coast-to-coast trip, most trips aren't that. I took mine to see the eclipse and to a wedding. Both trips didn't involve that much charging time, outside not having a hotel with a L2 charger for the eclipse.
I know it adds about 20 minutes on a trip to my parents, where I start full, and end with 10% left. I have one charging stop in the middle, which replaced a refueling and bathroom stop. Sometimes more coming back, but that is because I only have L1 charging at my parents, so I can't always get a 100% charge on a weekend trip. So for something like this a Leaf I'm sure does fine.
Now, the lack of better thermal management is a problem for the Leaf. But if it is good enough for someone's long distance needs, then it is good enough for their long distance needs. Not everyone can afford multiple vehicles.
There is nothing else new right now in that price range, at least until the generation 2 Bolts come out.
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CCS2 is the "other CCS charging standard". Both CCS1 and CCS2 are 2 DC Fast charging pins added to the local fast AC charging standard. Europe's AC charging standard is different because 3 phase power is common and AC charging needed to support that which means more pins for AC charging.
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That is probably going to be a problem with NACS cables once they get longer. A lot of the weight issues with CCS1 cables comes from the fact they're significantly longer than the Tesla cables. Sadly EV's don't have a standard charging port location.
Really I wish this is something the industry could have standardized.
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I don’t really see the innovation. We’ve had the Tesla universal wall connector https://shop.tesla.com/product/universal-wall-connector and it’s less bulky.
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