In addition to being full of screens, China now wants its cars to be packed with AI.
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There’s a lot of hype about Chinese EVs—is any of it true?
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^This needs more up votes.
People complain that USA manufacturing is gutted but that's because of product dumping. China subsides the crap out of things to crash competition.
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I've been wanting to buy an EV since I saw my first one in the early 1980s. But every time I investigate, I find the EV I want to buy doesn't exist yet. My personal checklist:
- Compact car with decent safety rating
- Parts availability for self-repair or a local mechanic
- Four seats that can seat a 6' adult comfortably for a 3 hour trip (yes, I know this is challenging with #1, but the Honda Fit pulled it off)
- Single charge for a 3 hour trip
- Ability to link my phone
- Ability to disable built-in telematics (and use my phone instead for anything infotainment related)
- Physical hardware for items I need to interact with while driving
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Maybe it differed across generations of the Fit but as someone 6ft tall but fairly long legs the one time I drove one I was unable to get the drivers seat into comfortable position for the driver. Even then the seat behind the driver was basically unusable behind me.
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Is this achievable with any car in the US market, regardless of drivetrain?
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It probably did differ; I regularly get 4 6' people in a 2013, and at the time I bought it, it was the only vehicle short of SUV or minivan in which this was possible -- and the SUVs often didn't have enough head space!?
Honda changed the dash and the interior alignment with the 2014 I believe; it's the 2007-2013 models (2nd gen) that seemed to hit the sweet spot. Of course, there's zero room for a battery pack in that design, which is part of the problem for compact EVs -- you have to lose something somewhere.
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who are the major regional automakers in africa, south america and australia?
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Marques Brownlee's video about driving the Xiaomi SU7 Max leads with the title "Are we cooked?" I think it's fascinating, and I'm also glad I'm not in the auto industry.
View: https://youtu.be/Mb6H7trzMfI?si=YM6e-60wykoIyF2H
View: https://youtu.be/Mb6H7trzMfI?si=YM6e-60wykoIyF2H
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What that guy knows about cars you could write on the back of a postage stamp.
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Most importantly, those people are in the extremely labor intensive parts of the supply chain, like extracting and refining raw materials, and manufacturing the parts that feed into the relatively manual labor efficient final assembly plant. And the Chinese government subsidizes all of them, whether through direct subsidy, investment/loans, government ownership, lax environmental regulations (or simply looking the other way when its convenient), or offshoring and exploiting near slave labor in places like Central Africa.
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He did, however, actually drive one of these, whereas you haven't. So someone could throw basically the same at you regarding Chinese EVs, with some credibility.
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Thanks for this. I too have been wondering how much is hype. And to me, there is enough of it that this isn't something I should be clamouring for.
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General Motors (in particular), Ford, and Jeep throwing away their hard work and market advantage in EVs to kiss the behind of a fascist dictator, well, when they wail at the reaping 3-10 years from now I hope they remember who did the sowing (themselves).
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The 2 things most interesting to me, and I think many of us here, regarding Chinese EV's are the battery and charging tech, both of which are many miles ahead of anything we have in the West. I didn't notice you discussing either of those in your article, unless I missed it? This is far more irritating to me (regardless of price) when it comes to the lackluster development attitude of western automakers, who have been happy to sit on their collective asses since the dawn of EV's (excepting Tesla, ofc).
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I really appreciate this article. That Reuter's headline pissed me off the other day when I saw because it so blatantly ignored the situation that it bordered on CCP propaganda.
Now, I don't have a lot of love lost for US OEMs. They absolutely got us in this situation of absurdly large vehicles, and high MSRPs by forever chasing profit and engaging in trimflation. Years ago Ford literally gave up on making cars (Mustang excepted) to focus on trucks and SUVs, so they lost my vote there. GM sells only the Corvette and you could maybe stretch the definition of the Bolt to a bloated wagon. Stellantis is Stellantis and I wouldn't touch any of their products with a 10 ft pole. The Japanese and Korenans will at least still see you a reasonably priced sedan, but that's about it here.
I also don't necessarily blame non-car people from not understanding this situation. No one does thorough research about every topic they see online, and all those folks see are cheap prices and high ranges. Now, the ones who are wowwed by BIG SCREEN are excepted; those people probably shouldn't be allowed to drive because they are probably the ones watching Reels while driving we speak.
I know I saw other commenters mention it, but the parts availability is another concern. I suggest looking into CFMOTO because that's one of the few Chinese brands to get a foothold in the US, as a motorcycle manufacturer. The prices on the 2nd hand market are quite low, and I think part of it is constantly coming out with a new/revised model. For those of us who don't think vehicles are disposable, I worry about long-term support from a company that is only ever focused on the next shiny bauble.
Now, I don't have a lot of love lost for US OEMs. They absolutely got us in this situation of absurdly large vehicles, and high MSRPs by forever chasing profit and engaging in trimflation. Years ago Ford literally gave up on making cars (Mustang excepted) to focus on trucks and SUVs, so they lost my vote there. GM sells only the Corvette and you could maybe stretch the definition of the Bolt to a bloated wagon. Stellantis is Stellantis and I wouldn't touch any of their products with a 10 ft pole. The Japanese and Korenans will at least still see you a reasonably priced sedan, but that's about it here.
I also don't necessarily blame non-car people from not understanding this situation. No one does thorough research about every topic they see online, and all those folks see are cheap prices and high ranges. Now, the ones who are wowwed by BIG SCREEN are excepted; those people probably shouldn't be allowed to drive because they are probably the ones watching Reels while driving we speak.
I know I saw other commenters mention it, but the parts availability is another concern. I suggest looking into CFMOTO because that's one of the few Chinese brands to get a foothold in the US, as a motorcycle manufacturer. The prices on the 2nd hand market are quite low, and I think part of it is constantly coming out with a new/revised model. For those of us who don't think vehicles are disposable, I worry about long-term support from a company that is only ever focused on the next shiny bauble.
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Tesla hasn’t had the best range and charging in several years, even among western automakers.
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It would have been better to look at Chinese EVs that are made for export, vs their local ones. If their export models were not what anyone wanted, they wouldn't be having any success in Europe, Australia, etc.
The point about cost in China vs Europe/etc is good - it doesn't get mentioned enough. However, I doubt it is all about meeting western standards and expectations. I bet they are also targetting higher margins since competition is not as cutthroat.
In Canada, there are still a lot of hatchbacks (Civic, Mazda 3, Golf, Corolla, etc) as well as quite small SUV/CUVs. But where are all the EVs of that size? When I was looking 2 years ago, there was nothing worth buying. There is still very little. Something needs to give the incumbent manufacturers a kick.
The point about cost in China vs Europe/etc is good - it doesn't get mentioned enough. However, I doubt it is all about meeting western standards and expectations. I bet they are also targetting higher margins since competition is not as cutthroat.
In Canada, there are still a lot of hatchbacks (Civic, Mazda 3, Golf, Corolla, etc) as well as quite small SUV/CUVs. But where are all the EVs of that size? When I was looking 2 years ago, there was nothing worth buying. There is still very little. Something needs to give the incumbent manufacturers a kick.
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There are a lot of models in those sizes available in Europe.
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They exist. I just don't think they're sold in North America, including Canada. There are plenty of good small hatchback, compact SUVs now that are not Chinese.
F.eg the new ID Polo:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25OfJS-gb0U&t=50s
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Anyone who has driven cars for some time, or even just rode one as a passenger, is entitled to give their honest opinion.
Generally, a long-time tech reviewer who also drives cars is in better position to give an informed opinion on EVs than many so-called "car enthusiasts" whose culture was built around ICE cars.
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I refused to buy a Tesla long before Elon went crazy. I didn't trust his hype and emphasis on flash, his development methodology, his "full self driving" lies or the death door handle design.
For similar reasons I don't trust cars made in China: who knows what hacks the Chinese government has put in these cars, given their history with hacks in other computer hardware?
For similar reasons I don't trust cars made in China: who knows what hacks the Chinese government has put in these cars, given their history with hacks in other computer hardware?
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What can we build a simple EV for here in the US? I am talking a complete startup, from scratch. Here's what I am thinking:
Form: It will be small obviously. But we need to make it SUVish cause Merica. Basically a hatchback that looks like a small SUV. Ok ground clearance. Front wheel drive.
Power/Range: The thing will be built for efficiency. No 0-60 on this thing. It will not be fun to drive. I am thinking 250-275 miles is the goal. Able to tow small boat, pop up camper etc, ready for hitch.
Goodies: No goodies. Just a small backup camera. No connection to the internet. Radar based safety: collision avoidance, blind spot, backup, etc only. No lane keeping. That shit is dangerous. You have to drive this thing, except: Advanced cruise control for efficiency.
Options: No options. Every car is the same except color.
Infrastructure: I think we keep the plants as small as possible. Allows us to start small, reduce shipping costs later on. I am thinking an employee owned type of business structure. Perhaps each plant will be its own self contained enterprise of sorts. Few engineers: the vehicle will be the same for x number of years, planned ahead before new design
Sales/distribution: We sell directly or through dealerships. The markup is set in stone. There is only one price for this vehicle at a given time. This allows us to sell directly while still utilizing dealerships so they choose.
Let's do it ars!
Form: It will be small obviously. But we need to make it SUVish cause Merica. Basically a hatchback that looks like a small SUV. Ok ground clearance. Front wheel drive.
Power/Range: The thing will be built for efficiency. No 0-60 on this thing. It will not be fun to drive. I am thinking 250-275 miles is the goal. Able to tow small boat, pop up camper etc, ready for hitch.
Goodies: No goodies. Just a small backup camera. No connection to the internet. Radar based safety: collision avoidance, blind spot, backup, etc only. No lane keeping. That shit is dangerous. You have to drive this thing, except: Advanced cruise control for efficiency.
Options: No options. Every car is the same except color.
Infrastructure: I think we keep the plants as small as possible. Allows us to start small, reduce shipping costs later on. I am thinking an employee owned type of business structure. Perhaps each plant will be its own self contained enterprise of sorts. Few engineers: the vehicle will be the same for x number of years, planned ahead before new design
Sales/distribution: We sell directly or through dealerships. The markup is set in stone. There is only one price for this vehicle at a given time. This allows us to sell directly while still utilizing dealerships so they choose.
Let's do it ars!
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I think most people answer questions without really thinking about it. Of course everyone wants 500 miles of range and 10 second charging, and buttons, all for $10k. They also want a house that requires no maintenance and costs $50k. I mean, it is certainly human nature. I sure think the article was useful in terms of pointing out the variance between what people actually buy and what the Chinese are ostensibly offering.
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Slate Auto is basically doing this. It has Jeff Bezos money. So, it may actually make it to market.
Its seems that in non-Chinese markets, a new auto entrant into the market requires billionaire backing. This is inherently a sign that western auto markets are broken, and western governments should pursue policies that make it possible for smaller companies with less capital to be able to manufacture and sell vehicles.
The startup EV market in the USA has been a death march. A lot of hopefuls, but only 3 or 4 that actually made it to market. Tesla: Musk's innate skill is getting investor money at billion dollar levels. Rivian: Amazon EV truck order really was the thing that got them to market. And Ford collab helped Rivian? Lucid: Saudi PIF. Anyone else? Polestar? Does it count as it is a Volvo and Geely collab?
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Don't several EVs meet your check list?
Bolt EV/EUV meets all of your bullet items: compact size (Honda Fit size or just about), will seat 4 6-ft people in it, have 250 mile range (3 hours at 70 mph), supports CarPlay or Android Auto, don't subscribe to OnStar, basically all hardware controls. 2027 model is Android Auto only? But 2023 models and prior worked for both CarPlay and Android Auto.
Kia Kona EV? And hopefully the Kia EV3.
The hardest part of your list is "self-repair". That ship may have sailed for all vehicles now. You probably can do it, but parts serialization may limit all but the simple repairs.
Not sure how much longer we have left for cars not to have telematics or the ability to turn it off.
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I mean, startup companies are generally, in any field, death marches. You expect maybe 10% to survive 5 years.
In manufacturing the gulf between usable prototype and volume production is pretty vast. You can hire a company to produce widgets; not so much with cars.
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And this is different, how from American MBA business practices? What's good for GM is good for America, and you will like it or else.
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TheWerewolf
Ars Scholae Palatinae
When an article starts by admitting the author has zero direct experience with the subject and is basically going off the feels he reads on social media... then, as an American author, spends the rest of the article trying to point out all the negatives and risks with the Chinese market (while ignoring the many equal or worse issues with the US market)...
Well, if nothing else, it's entertaining as someone in a country that's actually allowing limited imports of Chinese EVs to read this from an author who is usually so over the top gung-ho about everyone getting an EV.
I guess even he has lines, even if they're mostly imaginary....
Well, if nothing else, it's entertaining as someone in a country that's actually allowing limited imports of Chinese EVs to read this from an author who is usually so over the top gung-ho about everyone getting an EV.
I guess even he has lines, even if they're mostly imaginary....
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But... We were told that tariffs are bad and that presidents don't have that power.
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When your car can cover 98% of your driving you can rent a vehicle for the remaining 2%. You're way ahead on cost, you get the best vehicle for the 2%, and you're not driving a suboptimal compromise the remaining 98%.
We do exactly this. My car is for me to get to work and to the store. It's small and nimble, seats us two comfortably, and the range and loading capacity is well beyond what we normally ever use.
When my brother, his family, and my dad came to visit we rented a Toyota HiAce for five days. Big and comfortable for everyone. Cost way less than owning one, and the van would ve completely impractical for us as a daily vehicle.
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Here in Australia the Chinese cars are popular because they're well specced, well built and well priced. They are not wildly different from European ones and the tech in the Japanese ones is seriously lagging.
Here's an English comparison of three normal, city cars:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4iIrXamoFw
My 80+ year old mother has just ordered the MG as it was the nicest and best priced (US$26,000 on the road for the top spec with the big battery - there's no discounts for EVs in Australia but this is exactly in line with the cheapest Toyota Corolla at absolute base spec) car here in Australia that meets her needs. Also the interface is perfectly fine for her and it has physical controls where appropriate as you'll see from the comparative review.
It's actually the most staid of the designs there by the way and offers greater practicality.
And we're seeing a lot of Zeekr's cars sell here too - the local car reviewers have a very, very different take on their design and tech to this article. This one here is very much the outlier.
Of course the local media have actually driven the vehicles and keep coming back with glowing reviews. 'Quirky' is not a word used, however 'refined' and 'advanced' feature prominently.
Why is there no mention that Chinese EV makers have now started branching into their own chip development at a fairly astonishing rate? That would be of interest to ARS readers I would have thought.
(Just thought I'd add an edit to mention that the 'cheap Chinese' car is the only one of the three to score 5 stars on the Euro NACP rating system, the Kia and Renault only scored 4 stars. Yet lots of people here are questioning safety in these cars.)
Here's an English comparison of three normal, city cars:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4iIrXamoFw
My 80+ year old mother has just ordered the MG as it was the nicest and best priced (US$26,000 on the road for the top spec with the big battery - there's no discounts for EVs in Australia but this is exactly in line with the cheapest Toyota Corolla at absolute base spec) car here in Australia that meets her needs. Also the interface is perfectly fine for her and it has physical controls where appropriate as you'll see from the comparative review.
It's actually the most staid of the designs there by the way and offers greater practicality.
And we're seeing a lot of Zeekr's cars sell here too - the local car reviewers have a very, very different take on their design and tech to this article. This one here is very much the outlier.
Of course the local media have actually driven the vehicles and keep coming back with glowing reviews. 'Quirky' is not a word used, however 'refined' and 'advanced' feature prominently.
Why is there no mention that Chinese EV makers have now started branching into their own chip development at a fairly astonishing rate? That would be of interest to ARS readers I would have thought.
(Just thought I'd add an edit to mention that the 'cheap Chinese' car is the only one of the three to score 5 stars on the Euro NACP rating system, the Kia and Renault only scored 4 stars. Yet lots of people here are questioning safety in these cars.)
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FWIW, that's like 1 shipping container, so you might if you don't use your living room much.
Not real useful, and I suspect the amusement value of a room full of lids with some tunnels to get around would wear off pretty quickly...but possible.
(And maybe you'd come out of it with the much more useful container.)
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Most EVs are going to have at least one good sized screen to help with finding a charger while driving.I bought a Honda Civic hatchback a couple years ago, and friends have commented on how clean and basic the interior is with very little in the way of distracting screens (for a newer car). Here doing my partAnd I would love my next car to be an EV but I wish they had fewer screens in general
Now, the trend for the whole dash to be a screen is just right up fugly.
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Which woud make Dr. Gitlin's stance conservative (optimistic) rather than excessive (pessimistic). Which is contrary to most of the vitriol about the article.
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The problem is that even if the US, EU and Japan block Chinese imports to protect domestic vehicle manufacturers those companies require exporting to other countries to make money and those secondary markets like Central and South America, Africa, South and South East Asia, the Middle East, UK and Australia are going to let Chinese manufacturers in and they are going to reduce sales of legacy automakers in there markets enough to hurt.
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It is extremely difficult (and expensive) to rent a vehicle that is able to tow any kind of trailer, and has a trailer wiring harness.
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We have to give the Chinese some credit that are actually looking at banning some of the nonsense.
Retractable door handles
https://carnewschina.com/2025/09/24...handles-released-for-public-comment-in-china/
Physical controls
https://carnewschina.com/2026/02/16...-reducing-reliance-on-central-control-screen/
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The cheap Chinese cars don't meet US or European crash safety standards, which is part of why they are cheap. The rest is down to low wages and government subsidies. For that matter cheap European cars are made in low wage places too like Poland, Romania and Czechia and US makers moved production to Mexico for the same reason.
Apparently Chinese gasoline cars sell like hotcakes in Mexico, where they undercut locally produced cars. I'll also point out that Vinfast which builds cars in Vietnam was a hot mess for several years with atrocious build quality and glitchy software.
Apparently Chinese gasoline cars sell like hotcakes in Mexico, where they undercut locally produced cars. I'll also point out that Vinfast which builds cars in Vietnam was a hot mess for several years with atrocious build quality and glitchy software.
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