The speech police: Chairman Brendan Carr and the FCC’s news distortion policy

KGFish

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I still encounter people who believe that Muslims, “woke cancel-culture”, trans children, and immigrants are the most dangerous things America faces.

This was always a lie.
Look around, swing voters. Look at your stock market and your government. Look at Bezos, Musk, and Zuckerberg. Look at the unmarked vans spiriting away college students. Look at the book bans and the threats directed at law firms.

Ask yourself again: what is the greatest threat to America?
Muslims, woke cancel-culture, trans children, and immigrants.

Obviously.

And obviously /s, because some people actually say this.
 
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In the UK, the BBC is required to be impartial, as such it's really one of the few trusted news sources here. Enforcing impartiality isn't necessarily bad.

Though in this climate it does seem that this is being politically motivated, so rather than ensuring impartiality, it'll have the exact opposite effect.

The USA is way too polarised at the moment for this work. Even if it was being done in good faith, nobody would agree.
BBC and the word "trusted" together is quite laughable lol. Their infamous BBC china filter or their pro-israel coverage only means they serve some greater interest and you should take their articles as "maybe" believeable.
 
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Pro Israel coverage? Every month they get caught in new scandals with articles full of lies written by Hamas PR teams and even documentaries omitting crucial details like the subject is the son of a Hamas government official.

You live on the same make believe planet as Trump supporters.
it's a nice scandal that make every child suffering story there seems like a hamas propaganda.
 
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Adopting communism (or Bolshevism or Marxist-Leninism as you prefer) as a nominal organising principle had very little impact on the way the Soviet Union acted geopolitically compared to other iterations of the Russian state. The main difference was that it wound up the Americans, who for some reason seem to believe that Russian history started in 1917, and their fear of communist ‘contagion’ made them view the strategic threat on Europe‘s eastern flank in the same way that Europeans (especially east Europeans who had borne the brunt of Russian expansionist ambitions) had for centuries.
Bulgaria. i do not agree with the "little impact" of adopting communism. they used it as an excuse, as a bible and as a tool for poisoning the minds of people.
 
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Bulgaria. i do not agree with the "little impact" of adopting communism. they used it as an excuse, as a bible and as a tool for poisoning the minds of people.
The point being told to you is that there's no guarantee any ideology can't be used to justify atrocity.

Hell, in the real world everyone has to live in and try to ignore, the 'slippery slope' is supposed to be a thoughtful reminder not to push things that far, and avoid hypocrisy to maintain the moral high ground in the right-to-rule behind any government peaceful transfer of power, but all too often it keeps the victims' hands tied behind their backs when an ideology has had a century to become an oppressive cult.

American MAGA conservatism is just ramping up toward the nerve to kill 65k+ dissenters, they are just waiting for a 10 million Democrat March on the White House to do it.

They also don't have enough control of the military to ensure enough bootlickers won't disobey orders at the last second despite the existence and willingness to use drone technologies on US civilians.

You'll see a mass casualty event from US Maga in the next 10 years, then it'll be proven it's not just Communism in Eastern European countries but mostly the wealthy manipulating propaganda in ways beyond their understanding.

Consider how much the wealthy are lamenting Trump's economic protectionism now, they won the culture war and got rid of what they felt were social shackles they were forced to operate under to maintain their identities but were too fucking stupid to understand that without operating under those rules they handed the keys to an insane monster and will now lose their businesses over it. Everyone that is not working in the defense industry is at risk of this including the AI companies themselves if, and when, tariff protectionism causes a Great Depression shortly after the 2026 mid-terms in the USA.

The wealthy just aren't nearly as smart as they hope their wealth indicates they are, there simply isn't enough bandwidth in a human life to master enough of a well rounded education to BE that smart and still remain wealthy. It's why there are no ethical billionaires because they just aren't smart, empathetic people. If they're smart and empathetic they probably aren't rich for good reason.

For example consider how many atrocities in Asia between China, North Korea and India/Pakistan, not even considering Afghanistan, that all have had nothing to do with Communism being a murderous ideology in and of itself to force out capitalism or religion as controlling factors for governance.

And of all of the above, religion by far has done admittedly the most good for the world, but also the most evil, and as far as evil goes it's not even remotely close. It's about to do it again when MAGA drags it's capitalist and AI/crypto bro factions along for the ride.

Yet for good in the world, there's a lot of more recent inventions and liberal governing policies in the running improving quality of life more than religion if the economics of distribution could only be controlled to below at-market values.

The American phrase 'The Tree of Liberty must be watered by the blood of Patriots and Tyrants from time to time' is a distinct reminder of what it costs to rectify exactly the type of cult propaganda the US Republican Party has been pushing since America's first Civil War in the 1800's and the Reconstruction Era afterward. It's a reminder that words and democracy fail from time to time and there must be violent conflict to remind everyone every century or so why violent conflict is a REALLY BAD IDEA for all the world's economies because no matter how much the GOP tears apart the US economy, globalization isn't going away and neither are it's negative second order impacts on the poor and middle class in the US competing against rising middle class in other countries.

Protectionism is no protection against globalization either which is the core economic argument of MAGA cult behavior, they will commit as much violence as it takes to try to implement protectionism to attempt to recreate a manufacturing and agriculture dominated middle class in the Information Age and it will 100% fail while they need fascist Information Age allies.

Communism isn't unique in any of these regards whatsoever in terms of how it fails or the violence with which it ejects its political dissenters, that's a management problem not an ideology problem. It's also an inevitable part of every country's history to explode in violence every century or so to address income inequalities or political influence inequalities.
 
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Hmnhntr

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What if we're the bad guys? No, it's the children Democrats that are wrong!

I assume they don't actually believe what they're saying there, but if they do it's some impressive cognitive dissonance.
It's incredible that they claim this as though it were some obvious fact, yet the only instance they reference was literally a republican appointee doing it. Says everything about this.
 
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Hmnhntr

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This belies the last 30+ years of Republican behavior, but I do love a good “no true conservative” argument.
Have people forgotten that conservatives previously founded the House UnAmerican Activities Committee, basically the American gestapo? Known for secretly disappearing citizens under 'communist' accusations like being gay, not being Christian, being too nice to gay people or non-Christians, etc? This isn't theoretical, they've literally already done it.
 
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Hmnhntr

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The ultimate hypocrisy, after showing such concern for the Biden Administration's non-repression of free speech being such a major concern for Trump's sycophants.

Now the shoe is on the other foot, they're ready to strip anyone who disagrees with them of the right to free speech.
Man, I'm jealous of how easy it is to be a politician when your followers need no examples or proof of your claims. You just say "the Biden administration was repressing the speech of Conservatives" and they all shout in agreement because, I dunno, someone got mad at them when they talked about how much they hate trans people one time.

How long until the MAGAs realize they've been played, and their speech as well will be silenced once they figure out they've been lied to?
Around when the bullet from the firing squad enters their brain.
 
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Hmnhntr

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I must confess a certain weary amusement observing the fervent defenders of censorship here at Ars suddenly recoiling at the sting of their own venom. I've watched you applaud every creeping advance of "content moderation," every cheering embrace of state-sanctioned "fact-checking," and every bureaucratic incursion designed to suppress inconvenient voices under the sanctimonious banner of combating "misinformation." How earnestly you championed the arbiters of "truth," confident that power would always rest in benevolent hands—yours, naturally.

Now Chairman Carr’s heavy-handed revival of FCC censorship has, unsurprisingly, invoked your righteous horror. Suddenly, the First Amendment, that ancient parchment so long neglected, is brandished once more as sacred scripture. Where was this principled outrage when you eagerly clamored for speech codes, when you cheered social platforms for their censorship, or dismissed warnings about "slippery slopes" as hysterical hyperbole?

Your newfound devotion to free speech is heartening, if disingenuous. Indeed, "weaponizing government" was once a gleeful pastime when you felt secure in the belief that your opponents alone would be silenced. But history, as ever, holds a lesson: powers granted to suppress the speech of your adversaries inevitably turn against you.

May this sobering spectacle remind you, belatedly, that the pendulum you set in motion has no mercy and favors no faction. Perhaps now, chastened by your own hypocrisy, you'll recognize the wisdom of defending liberty universally, lest it vanish altogether.
Okay, so what censorship actions did the US government take under the Biden administration? Apparently it was a rampant behavior back then, so just toss us a few articles about events when the government was using its power to censor people or punish them for their legally protected speech. It should be easy, right?

And no, vague references to things you claim happened don't count. Nor does "I shouldn't need to spoon-feed this to you, the evidence is out there." You're making the claim, so provide a little proof.
 
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Hmnhntr

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So in other words, like practically every other Reddit sub except they're right leaning and not left.
Except, Conservatives are completely allowed on other subreddits. Their opinions just aren't liked and people downvote them. Being unpopular and being censored are not nearly the same things. Except, apparently, to conservatives.
 
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Hmnhntr

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I love how easily you conflate government censorship of media with platforms who chose to engage fact-checkers or use their own standards of content moderation. The beauty of the First Amendment and Section 230 is that it gives every platform the right to determine their own standards. Ars can have theirs; Facebook can require clickbait and rage content and Truth Social can ban truth entirely. The key factor is that people can choose to engage with those platforms or not.

There is only one US government, and we're stuck with it. That's why government censorship is far more pernicious than a platform who won't let you use slurs on their servers or on their pages. Government seeking punishment for disagreements about what "truth" is are precisely the kind of nonsense that is explicitly banned by the 1A and Carr should be tossed for it. Facebook taking down your post isn't in the same league at all, and your dishonest joining of the concepts is ridiculous.
Anyone who has been on this site for any amount of time and paid any attention will have noticed that any call for the government to actually use its power to punish people for speech gets downvoted to oblivion the vast majority of the time.
 
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ranthog

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Except, Conservatives are completely allowed on other subreddits. Their opinions just aren't liked and people downvote them. Being unpopular and being censored are not nearly the same things. Except, apparently, to conservatives.
It is also not censorship when you get thrown out of an AA meeting for trying to promote drinking as harmless fun or talking about "the Jewish problem" in a synagogue.

They also don't understand it is censorship when you start banning every age apropriate book from a library because you don't like it.
 
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Sajuuk

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Have people forgotten that conservatives previously founded the House UnAmerican Activities Committee, basically the American gestapo? Known for secretly disappearing citizens under 'communist' accusations like being gay, not being Christian, being too nice to gay people or non-Christians, etc? This isn't theoretical, they've literally already done it.
Most of us have, yes. I imagine 2/3+ of Americans would give nothing more than a blank stare when asked about the HCUA or McCarthy. A majority of us are incredibly privileged, comfortable, and think we're far-removed from any government involvement. This has continued to work because the foundations laid by FDR/Bretton Woods have continued to mostly work for most people, and is reinforced by a deeply rooted culture of considering politics a taboo topic of polite conversation.

All of that to say Americans will have to be slapped in the face with consequences because we can only learn lessons firsthand.
 
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close

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Seeing the constant ignorant replies of: "Europe has no free speech" and "We fund your healthcare", "knife stabbings in the UK"... on any comment section that shits on these fascists.

It really does feel like the 'Russia Today' people/bots we had before.
I was originally thinking of the other flavor of person (not bot) who when faced with their failings or those of the system they're part of will quickly find a whatabout targeting the countries you never want to be compared with in that context. "Sure we arrest people for having the wrong opinion about the Gaza conflict but whatabout China/Russia doing even worse". These days the trend for the US is solidly towards that "worse" so the comparisons became pointless. These aren't bots, they're regular red-blooded Joes suffering through a cognitive dissonance, unable to process the decay happening around them and that they play a role in that.

The Russian bots are clearly here to stay. It was a winning strategy on both sides of the pond, and a resounding success on one side in particular. So why change a winning combination?
 
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Selethorme

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A modest proposal:

Hypocrisy no longer matters, both to the electorate and the GOP.

So taking their broken rule of law and corrupt precedent should be the natural response to the MAGA GOP's self face-shooting, ensuring there is no pendulum and permanently knocking their political party out of viability entirely, with some vindictive taxation and citizenship stripping of rich conservative voters for spice to put the rest of them on notice that they are now taxed without representation as punishment for their sins.

This going through is as good a place to start as any for a Project 2032 balanced between working for the working-class voters and punishing the working-class gaslighters.

It's going to take getting the Democratic Party on the same page or it collapsing first to focus their message and be less worried about freedom of speech and democracy until after the GOP is gone, however...
You write in the language of satire, but this is exactly what this kind of shit is radicalizing me toward:
Ok, fine, republicans want to play games with aid to California wildfires? Got it. So when dems have power, red-states better have taxpayer funded abortions or Florida can recover on its own from the next hurricane. Texas better have police arrest anyone doing open-carry without a permit or no electricity the next time their "independent" energy grid fails because it falls below 50 degrees outside. Kentucky floods? Well then, the republican legislature better pass some reparations for slavery or they're on their own.
What you're advocating for here is censorship of opposing political views.
No, that's what you're defending. But you know what? If that's the way you want to play it, sure. Let's censor every single one of your shitty propaganda channels. NewsMax can't lie anymore or everyone involved gets a decade in an El Salvador work camp. You want to play fascist games? Get fascist punishments.
When the FCC gains authority to regulate cable television? Hint: They don't.
When they do this same dishonest bullshit.
 
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Hmnhntr

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So, if I'm reading this correctly, they claim they sent Abrego Garcia to El Salvador, against direct court orders to the contrary, 'in error' (as they were specifically barred from sending him to El Salvador due to potential unfair treatment), but that:
1. The court cannot demand that he be returned, as that goes beyond the plaintiff's sought relief that the government request he be returned, and involves diplomatic action, which they have no jurisdiction over.
2. Furthermore, the court cannot challenge the removal to El Salvador anyways, as they cannot contest the execution of a removal order, which necessarily includes where he be sent.

All of this despite admitting that they were not allowed to send him to El Salvador in the first place, and only did so """in error""". So basically, "yes we did something illegal against court orders, but you're not allowed to contest it anyways, and even if you could we wouldn't be required to do anything except ask nicely".

They also go on to say that even if the validity of the removal order itself were contested, since Garcia was "charged with removability...and placed in removal proceedings...The removal order that was executed was thus a removal order..." So basically, the fact that he was charged and proceedings were initiated makes it a valid removal order.

Plus, they contest the court's claim that due process was violated and that no official determination that Garcia was a member of MS-13 was made, because an immigration judge/court determined that he was. It should be noted that immigration courts are part of the Executive branch under the DoJ, not part of the typical legal system under the Judicial branch, and that immigration judges are directly appointed by the Attorney General.

So, since they are saying that the removal order cannot be contested, period, even if it (or at least aspects of it) were performed in an illegal manner, and charging someone with removal makes it a valid removal order, and the process for assessing the cause for removal falls entirely within the jurisdiction of an immigration court.....then they could just remove anyone to anywhere, and as long as they were already out of the country, the court does not have any authority to do anything about it, and the Executive branch can, entirely on its own, remove someone from the country with no oversight or recourse.

Holy shit. I thought maybe the "blueprint for disappearing anyone [the government] wants" description was at least a little sensationalized, but this certainly seems to fit the bill. Can anyone with more legal knowledge clarify anything I may have misunderstood?
 
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Hmnhntr

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Most of us have, yes. I imagine 2/3+ of Americans would give nothing more than a blank stare when asked about the HCUA or McCarthy. A majority of us are incredibly privileged, comfortable, and think we're far-removed from any government involvement. This has continued to work because the foundations laid by FDR/Bretton Woods have continued to mostly work for most people, and is reinforced by a deeply rooted culture of considering politics a taboo topic of polite conversation.

All of that to say Americans will have to be slapped in the face with consequences because we can only learn lessons firsthand.
People have been lulled into sense of total security by the idea that "it couldn't happen here". Even though it has, in fact, happened here to many groups of people, and pretty recently, too. Like, did you know that women only gained the right to open their own bank accounts in the 70s? Or that sterilizations were performed on American Indians, in secret, until the 70s?

It has happened here over and over and over again. Just never to straight, white, Christian men (as long as the government agrees that you are all of those things), so apparently no one cares or thinks it's real.
 
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ranthog

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I'm sure this has been said many times by now, but, it's going to suck for them when the shoe is on the other foot and the Democrats decide revenge is a two-way street.
The problem is that Democrats don't want to live in an authoritarian nightmare. This has always been part of why the fight has been asymetrical.
 
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wrecksdart

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C.M. Allen

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The problem is that Democrats don't want to live in an authoritarian nightmare. This has always been part of why the fight has been asymetrical.
Another part is that it's far easier and quicker to destroy a country than it is to build one. And conservatives have been using that asymmetry to undermine and destroy anything that impedes their pursuit of uncontested power.
 
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ZAP!!

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Countering fact and reality with feeling and belief is not at all fair and balanced. "Alternative facts" fall under feeling and belief because they can never be disproven. The Pseudo-christian Nationalist doomsday cults will do anything to prove they are right about their beliefs. Since no one else is doing it, they have decided to start their biblical end of the world on their own. Otherwise, they might start to look foolish. Anyone openly claiming they, and everyone else, is controlled by unseen demons and angels is obviously unfit to hold any position of authority or be any type of public servant. They refuse to make decisions based on fact and reality instead opting for feeling and belief that best suits their narrative at that moment. They are unpredictable and quickly become violent when they feel their belief in the supernatural is in question.
 
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D

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The older I get the more clear it has become to me that terrible people truly believe that everyone else is also a terrible person.
Just like good people truly believe that everyone else is also a good person.

While I believe that there are both good (Fred Rogers) and evil (Amon Goeth) people, 99% of us are just normal people capable of both at the same time.
 
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s73v3r

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I'm sure this has been said many times by now, but, it's going to suck for them when the shoe is on the other foot and the Democrats decide revenge is a two-way street.
Unfortunately (or probably fortunately) Democrats have no interest in revenge.

Actually unfortunately, they also have no interest in prosecution violations of the law by Republicans.
 
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I'm sure this has been said many times by now, but, it's going to suck for them when the shoe is on the other foot and the Democrats decide revenge is a two-way street.
So.... when exactly will Democrats change their behavior to actually fight back against the Republicans? Because I haven't seen it ever since the Republicans used a captured court and a riot to steal the 2000 election, when I was 7 years old. Many of those perpetrators are now themselves on the SCOTUS bench.
 
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I can't tell whether you're taking a huge bong hit before you write this stuff, or if you abuse an LLM by telling it to rewrite the same ancient bog-standard screed about hypocrisy but purpler and more prolix.
In either case, worth only a chortle and a downvote.
If calling out your selective embrace of censorship sounds to you like a tired old "screed," perhaps that's because hypocrisy, no matter how artfully rationalized, eventually reveals itself as rather tedious. Whether under the influence of a bong or an LLM, I’d wager clarity still exceeds that of those who cheered content moderation until it inevitably swung back to bite them. Your chortle is noted, but the irony remains undiminished.
I love how easily you conflate government censorship of media with platforms who chose to engage fact-checkers or use their own standards of content moderation. The beauty of the First Amendment and Section 230 is that it gives every platform the right to determine their own standards. Ars can have theirs; Facebook can require clickbait and rage content and Truth Social can ban truth entirely. The key factor is that people can choose to engage with those platforms or not.

There is only one US government, and we're stuck with it. That's why government censorship is far more pernicious than a platform who won't let you use slurs on their servers or on their pages. Government seeking punishment for disagreements about what "truth" is are precisely the kind of nonsense that is explicitly banned by the 1A and Carr should be tossed for it. Facebook taking down your post isn't in the same league at all, and your dishonest joining of the concepts is ridiculous.
Ah, but you overlook the inconvenient truth that platforms like Facebook were hardly acting out of pure private enterprise. Rather, they bowed under relentless pressure and "guidance" from NGOs and agencies that are effectively extensions of government will, entities you once applauded as noble warriors against "disinformation." This blurred distinction between private moderation and state censorship was precisely the slope I warned against. It's hardly "ridiculous" to call out hypocrisy when your standards seem to shift with political convenience.
 
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You write in the language of satire, but this is exactly what this kind of shit is radicalizing me toward:
Ok, fine, republicans want to play games with aid to California wildfires? Got it. So when dems have power, red-states better have taxpayer funded abortions or Florida can recover on its own from the next hurricane. Texas better have police arrest anyone doing open-carry without a permit or no electricity the next time their "independent" energy grid fails because it falls below 50 degrees outside. Kentucky floods? Well then, the republican legislature better pass some reparations for slavery or they're on their own.
I personally wasn't being satirical.

I've stated it in other threads: The casualties are written in stone. We don't know the specifics but it's a given they will happen regardless of whether, or who, fights or not. Plus, fighting will invariably have to be the default position anyway, as not doing anything even if you're exhausted will be worse.

You won't get to pick exactly who you fight, either. On any given day it'll be the wealthy who lobbied for this and lost control of it, the military who in all likelihood isn't particularly willing, your own countrymen, or the MAGA security details themselves.

Nor will you get to pick whether you fight or not, tariff protectionism is going to cause the next Great Depression and the signs are already starting. The millennials will survive it, they survived the Great Recession already. They'll not only survive it, but savagely remove any conservative-leaning millennials from keeping any wealth after the dust settles. Everyone else older than them? No, they're fucked. Particularly if their net worth isn't seven figures. The inevitability isn't a fascist state, the GOP is too dumb and has too much ground to cover. The inevitability is anarchy, think Irish Troubles for the Civil War then warlords in Afghanistan.

In short, it's very likely that you won't get to choose both progressivism AND democracy, you'll have to choose one or the other and choosing the former first is the only way to get the latter back, because if you try to reset the status quo no matter how much bloodshed there is, you'll get what we're looking at yet again in 20-50 years.

The liberals will need to first decide they're the party of the working class. If they are so, their response will have to be unified, and that will include cutting the shit and ceasing to play morally/ethically in their response to the GOP and quit worrying about shit boomeranging back on them for their own authoritarian movements in kind.
 
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Unfortunately (or probably fortunately) Democrats have no interest in revenge.

Actually unfortunately, they also have no interest in prosecution violations of the law by Republicans.
Yeah, admittedly until liberals are actually interested in vengeance, not justice, this nightmare doesn't end.

That means party leadership seizing power over liberal infrastructure that has the charisma to drag them to Hell kicking and screaming to drive the MAGA cult into the seas itself and strip citizenship.

Unfortunately.
 
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I'm sure this has been said many times by now, but, it's going to suck for them when the shoe is on the other foot and the Democrats decide revenge is a two-way street.
The Democrats not being interested in straight vengeance rather than justice is a large part of why we're in the mess we're in now.

If Obama had pushed some of the boundaries Trump is now against the Tea Party with domestic terrorism charges because of their bad faith pageantry, a lot of this could have been arrested before 2016 because Trump couldn't have tried the same things, the infrastructure wouldn't have existed and the media would have been mitigated.

Taking more direct actions against Sinclair Broadcasting would also have helped, as would have exploring legal action against the Heritage Foundation and Federalist Society prior.

I don't even have to talk about Fox News and how the Dominion suits should have been combed over for criminal proceedings either.

But mostly liberals have sleepwalked blind into the GOP using the ability to lie under the First Amendment with impunity as a way to force their identity markers into cultural conversation as both a cudgel and shield.

Playing the victim falsely generally should land you in prison even if you're just shitposting in public discourse.
 
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