It's really hard to buy a screen-less mac right now. Why? (POLL)
- Thread starter gardenhose
- Start date
Are Apple shipping any non-base Mac Minis? That's the only model with a "normal" delivery time at present
I was reflexively going to say that you always need to filter by competed sales since people ask for ridiculous prices some times. The completed sales for my Studio are even more ridiculous than what's available now! Doesn't even matter if it's used or sealed. It's high enough that I'm almost tempted to just sell it and go to an M5 Max MBP.
Crap, are we going to have bots try and snatch up M5 Studios when they come out for scalping?
I had the same thought. And then I thought… why don’t I buy two and sell one…
Also can we just reflect upon the fact that if you asked any of us two years ago, “guess which Apple product will go into such high demand that they can’t keep up” precisely zero people would have guessed headless Mac desktop.
Perfect time to release an xMac!
"Wait, you mean the new Mac Pro will be in high demand?!"
"No, no, just the little stubby one."
Quite the outcome for a product that picked up the name "Half-AS" while still in the rumor mill.
RAMpocalypse is ironic for me, because my main issue with my M1 Max MBP isn't actually the CPU or GPU, it's memory. I'm finding that 32 GB is usually enough, but once in a while not enough, and I'd really like to double it. Of course, I'd like to do so without paying the retail price for a M5 Max MBP while actually getting a M4 Max one, so I'll have to wait a bit longer.
M4max shipped. The emotions are mixed. Excited, cuz it’s a whole lotta machine, sad because it’s not a random branded n+1 current upcoming hotness. So 85% will be idle instead of 92%
Vincent Hanna
Ars Tribunus Militum
Proof that new, high-end M4 chips are still coming off the line. Analyze that as you will.
Vincent Hanna
Ars Tribunus Militum
Could still mean M5s are a June thing...
There is nothing inconsistent with the M4 Studio's and mini's current low availability, Tim Cook's earning call statement about it taking months to balance desktop supply and demand, and the idea that M5 models were always planned for WWDC and will still be announced then.
If it helps: I have that exact same machine, but with a 2TB SSD instead of 1TB. I assure you, there is nothing I've found in the realm of normal or even advanced use that causes it to break a sweat. It's an astonishing machine in a way no other Mac I've ever used is. I'm sure the M5 version will be even more extra, but at a certain point, the list of workflows where that results in a perceptible, justifiable difference becomes really small.
It would be far from the first time they announced ship times weeks/months after an announcement. (Last Intel Mac Pro went 6 months) Or, it'll be announced Monday, shipping Friday...and then I'll be just like I was when I bought my iPad Pro a week before the M1s were announced. Same as it ever was.
Yeah, there's something special about the Studio that's even more than the Cube or Trashcan. This combination of effortless performance and complete silence and dense bulbousness sitting on your desk. Like someone took a tower Mac and squeezed all the air out. I love it.
Yeah. My expectation is that (a) M5 generation desktops will be announced at WWDC and go on sale a week or so later and (b) they'll be in short supply/long lead time for a while. M5 Max MBPs aren't too bad right now (checking quickly, M5 Max with 128 GB of RAM is a 1-2 week lead time on apple.com), and even assuming that Apple prioritizes the laptops over new desktops, they clearly have some supply of chips flowing. So, they'll sell out whatever the original production run is, and then lead times will stretch to whatever.
Vincent Hanna
Ars Tribunus Militum
I expect exactly that scenario too.
The new Studio had to wait for the M5 Ultra, so the new M5 minis had to wait for the Studios. This was all long-planned for WWDC, but Apple got caught short-handed with the unexpected surge of sales of end-of-life M4s as LLM boxes, so they had to be rationed for three months.
The new Studio had to wait for the M5 Ultra, so the new M5 minis had to wait for the Studios. This was all long-planned for WWDC, but Apple got caught short-handed with the unexpected surge of sales of end-of-life M4s as LLM boxes, so they had to be rationed for three months.
I really hope you're right. If the M5 Mac Studio is announced at WWDC, I'll be ecstatic.
The thing that has me nervous is that Gurman, while sometimes wrong about product specifics, is rarely wrong about timing (and in particular delays).
Vincent Hanna
Ars Tribunus Militum
He's only solid on timing in the 48 hours before an event. He has been wildly wrong numerous times when still months or weeks out.
I pled my case to our vendor and our Apple rep to remind them that the funding for the 28 M4 Max Studios I have on order has a drop dead date of June 30 and it seems unlikely that I'll have the budget to buy the Studios in the upcoming fiscal year. Within about 2 hours of doing that I got confirmation that half of the computers are shipping this week and they should have a more accurate date for the rest in a few days.
I ordered these computers in the first week of April and initially had a mid-May shipping date that had since slipped to June 20. The computers do exist but they are very tightly allocated.
I ordered these computers in the first week of April and initially had a mid-May shipping date that had since slipped to June 20. The computers do exist but they are very tightly allocated.
This is not what I'm seeing here in 981**. Still a 4-week wait for any MBP with 64 GB or 128 GB of RAM. Configurations with 48 GB are on the shelf in the local Apple Stores.
Microcenter has 15-20% off MBP with Pro or Max chips. Picked up a 16" Max 40core/64GB/2TB over the weekend. They had 4 in stock of the space black, but went out of stock the next day.
There are just a few Microcenters that have 128GB/2TB 16" Max in stock at $4,589. I honestly think if there were one within driving distance of me I'd feel compelled to go buy one right now, given the availability situation everywhere else.
I personally call it "Ramadan", or "Ramnarök". I made quite a few of those lately for fun.
With that said, hope to hold a MacBook Pro that is shipping from across the world in my hand in the next weeks.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NgBtkflWSM
It's ok. That's what I'd be telling myself, too, if I had a previous generation supercomputer on my desk.
It is good to see that there is some flow of high end M4 machines still going out the door. I think the "announce, possibly with long lead time, sell out early, catch up eventually" scenario is the most plausible.
At this rate, the mythical M5 Ultra with 512GB RAM will land on my desk just as the Fusion360 project I double-clicked on yesterday actually opens on my 8GB M1 MBA.
Just took a look at the AU store. An M4 Max 14/32 with (default) 36GB RAM has a ship time of 9-10 weeks; a 16/40 with 64GB (only option) is 16-18 weeks, aka "pick up Wed 30th September". I can't really imagine them selling a machine today that they're planning to deliver after they're expecting to launch the new ones. So now I'm thinking they probably won't announce them at WWDC, because that would entirely kill any sales between now and then. There'll be some mention of "this fall" in media engagements. And then they'll make some "shipping ASAP" announcement of the new models in October. And if you're not quick off the blocks, you won't actually get one in your hands until Jan-Feb.
All of which is to say, f me I guess for not buying an M4 Max with 96GB back in February.
All of which is to say, f me I guess for not buying an M4 Max with 96GB back in February.
10am. Package here. Close the thread. 
You can say many things about Apple...but you can't say they drag their feet getting product into your hands ASAFP.
You can say many things about Apple...but you can't say they drag their feet getting product into your hands ASAFP.
Checking a few options in the US Educational store:
M4 Mini: 16 GB 3-4 weeks, 24 GB 10-12 weeks
M4 Pro Mini: 10-12 weeks (irrespective of core count or 24 /48 GB of RAM)
M4 Max Studio: Base configuration: 9-10 weeks. Upgraded 16/40 SOC & 64 GB RAM: 16-18 weeks
M3 Ultra Studio: Both SOC configurations (96 GB is the only option here): 12-13 weeks.
By contrast, looking at a 16" M5 Max MBP, the base unit with 36 GB is in stock for same-day pickup at local store (Los Angeles area for me), and the versions with upgraded RAM range from 3-5 days (48 GB) to 2-3 weeks (128 GB). To me, that says that the shortage is in M3/M4 specific parts, either the SOCs themselves or an older generation of the LPDDR RAM chips, and that by extension the shortages now don't necessarily mean a crippling shortage once the M5 generation is released.
Initial impressions: The M5 might be faster in some theoretical LLM situations, but unsloth/Qwen3.6-35B-A3B-MLX-8bit is teh snappeh...and it's not even the token thruput, it's HOW FAST IT LOADS FROM DISK.
Blink.(load 35Gb of stuff)..to the thing...Blink (unload 35Gb of stuff), reclaim the memory.
Which pretty much tells me that for the memory footprint I was willing to pay for, I probably wouldn't notice the difference.
Blink.(load 35Gb of stuff)..to the thing...Blink (unload 35Gb of stuff), reclaim the memory.
Which pretty much tells me that for the memory footprint I was willing to pay for, I probably wouldn't notice the difference.
I hope this is true. I don’t know enough to know whether the memory on the M4 machines is the same as the M5 series. It’s plausible to me that this could just as easily be caused by them prioritising current gen laptops (which would always presumably be higher demand than desktops). But I hope you’re right and they have different pipelines for M4 vs M5 components and so what we’re seeing with the “screenless Macs” at the moment won’t necessarily continue when the M5s get announced.
I took a quick gander at the tech specs. Assuming Wikipedia can be believed, all of the M4 machines (and the Neo) use LPDDR5X-7500 RAM and the M5 generation use LPDDR5X-9600. Same technology, but a 25 or so percent speed bump. So, in principle Apple could divert memory from an M5 line to the older machines and just down clock it somewhat, but that seems unlikely. Either selling more current laptops or building up a launch stockpile of new desktop machines makes more sense to me.
Actually, the (and the Neo) note has me wondering. Maybe Apple is focusing their supply of the slower RAM modules on keeping the (very popular) Neo reasonably in stock.
Thanks for doing the research I was too lazy to do! I assume they’d keep the faster RAM for what only it can do, and the Neo demand (plus OpenClaw mania) explains the rest of the demand vs forecast discrepancy for the 7500 stuff.
Then the question is the broader RAMocalypse/RAMageddon/RAMpture/book of RAMelations issues re chip fab capacity and competition for production runs on different dies/lines. I am (once again) too lazy to do more serious research but it sounds like essentially anyone who can make RAM has their production schedule booked out for the next 12 months minimum, and even if they auctioned it, all the buyers have very deep pockets. So whether li’l ol’ you & I can actually rank high enough in the tier list to get a new consumer device seems to depend largely on how much Tim Apple is willing to sacrifice consumer margins for market share and future services revenue.
I guess the good news is Apple’s services arm being such a huge chunk of their business—which I am the first to decry them for—may ultimately result in them being willing to take the hardware loss on the accountancy assumption that it will result in more future high margin revenue by letting someone new into the walled garden. Samsung doesn’t have the same calculus.
If it turns out I as an individual can buy a supercomputer at retail because Apple provides f-all base cloud storage and forces people to upsell, renews a second season of Foundation, and brought tap-to-pay to America, then, well, thanks I guess.
Then the question is the broader RAMocalypse/RAMageddon/RAMpture/book of RAMelations issues re chip fab capacity and competition for production runs on different dies/lines. I am (once again) too lazy to do more serious research but it sounds like essentially anyone who can make RAM has their production schedule booked out for the next 12 months minimum, and even if they auctioned it, all the buyers have very deep pockets. So whether li’l ol’ you & I can actually rank high enough in the tier list to get a new consumer device seems to depend largely on how much Tim Apple is willing to sacrifice consumer margins for market share and future services revenue.
I guess the good news is Apple’s services arm being such a huge chunk of their business—which I am the first to decry them for—may ultimately result in them being willing to take the hardware loss on the accountancy assumption that it will result in more future high margin revenue by letting someone new into the walled garden. Samsung doesn’t have the same calculus.
If it turns out I as an individual can buy a supercomputer at retail because Apple provides f-all base cloud storage and forces people to upsell, renews a second season of Foundation, and brought tap-to-pay to America, then, well, thanks I guess.
Tim Cook explicitly addressed this on the recent earnings call. It's availability of the SoCs, not RAM, that is behind the desktop Mac and Neo shortages.
Details here.
Details here.