In depth with Windows 11 Recall—and what Microsoft has (and hasn’t) fixed
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They never will fix the trust issue, given their previous bad behavior.
If I can, I'm deleting Recall anytime it shows up on my machine.
If I can't delete Recall, I may be forced onto another system despite myself.
If I can, I'm deleting Recall anytime it shows up on my machine.
If I can't delete Recall, I may be forced onto another system despite myself.
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I have already transitioned 100% to something else (MacOS). Windows is dead to me.
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I may even go as far as f'ing with the registry to remove it if possible.
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Microsoft has lost so much trust that I will no longer use windows at all except for work. (i've been using linux as my main boot drive for years so no big deal for me)
some of the reasons I can't deal with them anymore
some of the reasons I can't deal with them anymore
- the fact that someone thought recall was a good idea at all and by default
- windows 11 tpm requirement making millions of perfectly fine pcs worthless
- windows 11 Edge aggression/nonsense
- windows 11 MS account requirement
- ads ads ads
- constant shipping of features no one asked for while neglecting to fix things people use every day
- just a completely user hostile product philosophy
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Stop the service, write an applet to kill the processes, mess with the files on disk, whatever it takes there will be no Recall spying on me.
Sadly I do need to stick with Windows for work.
Sadly I do need to stick with Windows for work.
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Besides the botched roll out and lack of trust, who actually wants this? It's yet another AI thing shoehorned into something no one asked for because these companies have to try and create use cases for AI because it serves no purpose.
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Recall is the perfect answer to a manager's loss of control on remote workers.
Fuck everything about that and the horse it rode in on.
Fuck everything about that and the horse it rode in on.
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Well… employers would love to check up what the employees were doing, and governments would love to have a back door to activity. Spy after the fact is very nice.
The problem here is that well… they’re going to push everyone to not use windows if this becomes mainstream.
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Gentle reminder that having a Microsoft account to sign into Windows was opt-in at first as well. Now it's mandatory unless you like custom install images and registry hacks.
Consider this as opt-in for now, almost certainly mandatory eventually.
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Well, I may be too cynical and/or pessimistic but I think I know where this whole thing is going:
Did I miss anything? Because otherwise developing this giant clunky horror show wouldn't be worth over just improving normal on-system dynamic search.
- Gradual ramp up of reminders to turn on Recall for every single eligible system, with eventual "we're switching to opt out as our users love it!"
- Microsoft demanding that all new laptops be Copilot+ compatible or "no windows license for you, evil manufacturer!"
- Microsoft adding "we're improving things that you can do with Recall by giving access to Recall database to trusted partners' software!" with whoever throws money at MS getting "our plug in can rummage in user's data"
- Opting out becomes no longer possible, default set of "data partners" auto-installed via Windows Update
- Microsoft using Recall data to "improve relevance of ads shown to users on the system"
- Aggregation of recall data becomes auto-exported to MS infrastructure and linked to overall online ad systems, all that juicy scraped data is now in web advertising systems and data brokers
Did I miss anything? Because otherwise developing this giant clunky horror show wouldn't be worth over just improving normal on-system dynamic search.
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When they announced they were bringing back Recall, it finally pushed my into installing Linux.
Linux Mint is pretty great, y'all.
Linux Mint is pretty great, y'all.
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Am I the only one thinking how this being tied ONLY to a fingerprint/face scan makes it ridiculously easy for a physical attacker (being it a malicious actor or law enforcement) to gain access to all your extremely sensitive data that will clearly be stored with just a little pointing at the camera towards you or literally using your finger on a reader real quick?
Probably a bit of an extreme example, but I feel something that is in your head will always be much more secure than biometrics.
Probably a bit of an extreme example, but I feel something that is in your head will always be much more secure than biometrics.
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The feature that broke the camels back. I installed Linux as my daily driver late last year so I'd have time to work out issues before Win10 was retired, have only had to boot back into Windows once and only to grab some URLs I needed.
Every release post-Win7 has been increasingly user hostile and an absolute disaster (win8 tiles anyone? Win10's absolute mess for system config/forced telemetry? Win11 Microsoft account requirement/forced UI changes/factory installed spyware?).
Every release post-Win7 has been increasingly user hostile and an absolute disaster (win8 tiles anyone? Win10's absolute mess for system config/forced telemetry? Win11 Microsoft account requirement/forced UI changes/factory installed spyware?).
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I already knew that I wasn't going to run Windows 11 when the news about Recall came out. I had been planning to ride-or-die on Windows 10 and then migrate to Linux, but then my Win10 key suddenly got invalidated in 2023, which expedited my migration plans.
So far I've been really happy on Linux. It may not be for everyone, but if you want to get out from under Microsoft's aggressive "promotion" techniques in Windows, it's either this or Apple.
So far I've been really happy on Linux. It may not be for everyone, but if you want to get out from under Microsoft's aggressive "promotion" techniques in Windows, it's either this or Apple.
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Well I was going to comment that I still don’t see the use case for this…and then I read your comment, thought back to all the originally optional “features” MS has introduced since Win 3.x and thought, “Well f*ck me if he ain’t spot on — that’s literally been their playbook since 1994.
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So, in order to be able to take advantage of "Recall" (why can't they give it a creative name?) I have to:
1) Have a Microsoft account. Yes, Recall may not require one, but installing and using Windows does now. To use MS Hello, you have to be signed into Windows using a "secure" MS account (last time I used it).
2) Get a camera of fingerprint reader for my PC.
3) Get a new CPU that meets the (arbitrary) requirements.
4) Get an NPU.
5) Encrypt my drive(s) with MS provided tools. I don't trust those tools, since MS has been shown to bend to government pressure to backdoor their software. I also don't need to take the performance hit.
6) Dedicate a non-trivial amount of storage to Recall.
7) And last, but definitely not lease, trust MS with every bit of activity I perform on my PC.
Or, and this is the choice I made when Recall was first pushed on us:
1) Exit the MS insider program.
2) Switch to Linux.
1) Have a Microsoft account. Yes, Recall may not require one, but installing and using Windows does now. To use MS Hello, you have to be signed into Windows using a "secure" MS account (last time I used it).
2) Get a camera of fingerprint reader for my PC.
3) Get a new CPU that meets the (arbitrary) requirements.
4) Get an NPU.
5) Encrypt my drive(s) with MS provided tools. I don't trust those tools, since MS has been shown to bend to government pressure to backdoor their software. I also don't need to take the performance hit.
6) Dedicate a non-trivial amount of storage to Recall.
7) And last, but definitely not lease, trust MS with every bit of activity I perform on my PC.
Or, and this is the choice I made when Recall was first pushed on us:
1) Exit the MS insider program.
2) Switch to Linux.
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I don't think I've come across any techy that thinks Recall is a good idea. Glad I switched to Linux as my main OS when Windows 8 came out.
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It's a solution to their "data mining efficiency".
If the data is captured by the system, you have to assume someone is going to use that data.
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Recall's biggest security flaw is that any stolen database can fall victim to a HNDL attack. If someone steals your hard drive or laptop or Recall database now, they can wait until future encryption-cracking hardware/software can defeat the encryption protecting your Recall data. The danger is in how easily navigated, thorough, and centralized that data is, and in how things that would normally never get saved on your computer can get swept up in it. Delete Recall. Period. No matter who you are.
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The hardware requirements for Copilot+ PCs require at least 16GB of RAM, 256GB of storage, and a built-in NPU capable of at least 40 TOPS. AMD, Intel, and Qualcomm are all planning to (keep) pushing NPUs throughout their product stacks.
It may be that we'll still see some NPU-equipped systems fail to qualify as Copilot+ PCs due to <16GB RAM, but the 256GB SSD requirement isn't a significant one. Older systems without NPUs will keep shipping for a few years, especially at the lower end of the market, but it looks like the majority of mobile PCs will be Copilot+ compatible without Microsoft having to officially mandate it.
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Where is the part of the review where we talk about any relevant usecase for actually using recall in the first place? Maybe the one last thing Microsoft forgot to figure out was what problem in the universe is recall supposed to solve?
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Okay, keeping in mind that I don't do Windows anymore, never did 11 and have been up longer than I usually am, I read that headline from an entirely different perspective.
I didn't catch the capitalization of "recall" in it, so that factors into my interpretation.
I read that as Microsoft was recalling Windows 11, and fixing it on an item by item basis. And my thought was, "Oh, this is going to suck for them!"
My joy was short lived once I realized they're forcing this bullshit on their users and my thought became, "Oh, fuck, this is going to suck for us!" instead.
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I went Mac for the desktop, and a separate Linux/Proton machine for gaming. Recall was the feature that finally pushed me to the other camp. The ads and constant fighting with the windows registry to undo all of Microsoft's 'features' it just became too much.
I'd rather deal with Apple's lack of ability to separate screen resolution from UI/Text resolution than deal with MS constant intrusions into my workflow/usage.
I'd rather deal with Apple's lack of ability to separate screen resolution from UI/Text resolution than deal with MS constant intrusions into my workflow/usage.
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I fully expect Recall to be used by companies to make sure their employees never walk away from their computer. God forbid we take a 10 min break every 3 hours.
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Yup, migrated to Linux. Was already running all my servers on it, so was easy enough to migrate my desktop, too.
Lack of games support used to be the thing that stopped me from going to Linux, but with Proton that's not an issue anymore.
The "innovation" in Windows these days is all about ME being the product instead of Windows. I.e. MS thinks "How can I extract more money and sellable info from this user?" instead of "How can I make Windows better for my customers?"
OTOH Linux is actually doing some pretty great interface stuff that makes my workflow faster and easier. And, importantly, isn't interested in having big AI brother watching everything I do. The though of cleaning all my customer data out of Recall is just way too daunting, esp for such little benefit.
Recall is clearly a product solely based on MS having blown a bunch of cash on AI and wondering how to see any benefit from their sunk costs.
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Ha! You must be a youngling! Anybody who lived through the 80s and 90s never had trust of Microsoft to begin with, so I’m not particularly shocked.
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I’d like the resources of the computers that I use be applied to the problems I’m working on, rather than to fine-grained tracking and recording of what I’m doing. Is there something difficult to understand about that?
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talking of the registry and trust, the left over shrapnel of everything you've ever done is a personal privacy and security nightmare in itself, or if ur a security servifce, the gift that keeps on giving. I like ray tracing, im stuck with windows for games, but i try to live in linux as much as possible because i don't like being spied on, advertised to and generally abused in exchange for paying for a commercial product, f microsoft, im hoping steam + mac can grow to the point where their api's are first class targets for game releases in time so i can finally ditch windows
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Since I don't have a webcam or fingerprint reader, don't use a MS account, and don't use device encryption, and have no intention of getting any of those things for my desktop PCs I guess I'll be safe for now.
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Probably not for personal use, but there is also the inevitable "Enterprise" features that force-enable the functionality, store data on centralized corporate servers (along with analysis and reporting modules), and allow executive/IT browsing of per-user histories. I remember how excited former corporate owners were that they could browse employee mailboxes using Exchange.
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The problem is that Apple is not immune to this sort of crap. They are less annoying, but I still have ~10 GB of AI model installed on my computer with no possibility to remove it without disabling the security features of the OS. This is despite the fact that I have "Apple Intelligence" disabled.
E.g., try deleting image playground, or any system–installed app. You can't, because these reside on a separate partition that is protected. This is in contrast to, say, iMovie or Pages that we are allowed to delete.
Granted, 10 GB is nothing compared to spying on you, but still, it's 10 GB that I would rather have back. The way I put it in another article was that, in the race for enshittification, Apple is losing. However, they are still competing.
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The idea of an always-on backup solution for everyday users is reasonable and even good... in theory. This isn't that however, and nothing will convince me recall wasn't created primarily for mass employee tracking.
All of that is gross and off-putting alone. Then consider the massive and glaring security implications and this quickly turns from bad to nightmare.
There is a 100% chance this will be exploited by law enforcement, in some way, at some point. Given the abysmal state of government in the U.S., I can guarantee this functionality is being salivated over by the bad guys dreaming of a 1984.
All of that is gross and off-putting alone. Then consider the massive and glaring security implications and this quickly turns from bad to nightmare.
There is a 100% chance this will be exploited by law enforcement, in some way, at some point. Given the abysmal state of government in the U.S., I can guarantee this functionality is being salivated over by the bad guys dreaming of a 1984.
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