A thread about parenting

flere-imsaho

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That reminds me, we did an escape room set in a Cold War bunker and one of the puzzles was you had to work out which phone on the desk to use and what number to dial.

My wife & I in our 60s were the only ones on the team who had ever used a rotary phone and according to the staff, they often had to tell people how to use them.

Years ago we rented a vacation home near my folks that had a rotary phone (working). My son, who was probably 14 at the time, had a friend over and I told them I'd give them $20 if they could figure out how to use it to call their Grandma within 10 minutes.

They didn't even get close. Interestingly, they never even figured out that the metal part moved.
 

Jeff J

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Twelve years ago I hid clues in the woods for cub scouts (mostly six-year-olds, but up to age 11) to find and solve. One was a CD player with a message recorded in morse code.

Two kids had parents who were ham radio enthusiasts and could interpret morse code in real time without a key chart.

None of the forty 17 or so kids could independently play track 4 of 8 on a CD to hear the morse code recording instead of Stars and Stripes Forever.

It can be surprising which parts of history are lost more quickly than others.

EDIT: Looks like I posted the same story when it happened, and there were only 17 kids on the trip.
 

Quarthinos

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I remember around 65 years ago being able to pick up the handset, dialing 555 on the rotary and then getting pure soft static over which we could talk to complete strangers with no idea where they were—kinda like shortwave......we used to talk to these disembodied voices for hours......
Sounds like a <color> box, before they were called that and ma Bell fixed it.
 

Da Xiang

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Sounds like a <color> box, before they were called that and ma Bell fixed it.
just a standard Ma Bell issue rotary dial. That's all I know. Just before the time of the what was called "the Princess Phone".

1773846132606.png


circa 1962. Also the common era of the "Party Line" where you could just pick up and after a few moments the dial tone would stop and you would have open air over which you could talk to people in your immediate neighborhood.
 
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gregatron5

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Also the common era of the "Party Line" where you could just pick up and after a few moments the dial tone would stop and you would have open air over which you could talk to people in your immediate neighborhood.
My mom remembers this, and phone numbers that were 2 letters and 4 digits.

I remember long distance calling and long distance calling cards, as well as being able to dial a phone number without the area code.

And while I'm not young, I do know how to use a rotary phone.
 

Quarthinos

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just a standard Ma Bell issue rotary dial. That's all I know. Just before the time of the what was called "the Princess Phone".

View attachment 130837

circa 1962. Also the common era of the "Party Line" where you could just pick up and after a few moments the dial tone would stop and you would have open air over which you could talk to people in your immediate neighborhood.
You're sort of agreeing with me. In ye very olden days, the switches had "secret" numbers you could dial to get into the "special" parts of the telephone system. Looks like you found one of them. Many of these were eventually retroactively given a <color> box identifier, even though many of them (Cap'n crunch whistle, although for touchtone) didn't need any electronics. I don't know all the details, as rotary phones were being discontinued when I was of the correct age. I know that I was able to dial my own phone number, and then hang up during the first ring tone, then pick back up when the ring tone continued. That gave me (I think) a loopback line going to the phone office and back, as speaking into the set would come out of the handset's speaker, which didn't normally happen.
 

Thorvard

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Thus it begins..travel softball season

Arrive 7:30 for warmups (forecasted to be Cold, but this is Northeast Softball). About 1:15 minute ride, which means departing EH/FP by approx 6:15am. Early, but this is typical for tourney softball. 1st game 8:00am 2nd game: 9:30am 3rd game: 12:30pm

Just hit me with a softball bat repeatedly
 

Thorvard

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Nope we've been doing travel for...4ish years now? Normal softball for another 4 on top of that.

We've had seats like those for marching band comps. The only problem is a lot of the softball fields don't have bleachers or if they do they only hold like 20 people. It's just easier to sit in a folding chair along the base line.

I will say those look much nicer than the ones we have.
 

drogin

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Nope we've been doing travel for...4ish years now? Normal softball for another 4 on top of that.

We've had seats like those for marching band comps. The only problem is a lot of the softball fields don't have bleachers or if they do they only hold like 20 people. It's just easier to sit in a folding chair along the base line.

I will say those look much nicer than the ones we have.
Nice! Yeah, I kinda do the same...I just chuck both kinds of chairs in the back of my car and go. Sometimes also an umbrella or an easy up for some sun shade.

Really, going to one of these things, especially a tournament, is kinda like planning a day at the beach...
 
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Thegn

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I'm feeling kind of frustrated about being a parent.

La Petit Sprog, who is ten, often responds if I ask her if she's done a task with a fake cry or cringe. To be clear, I don't yell or act frustrated, in fact I'm very much the epitome of calm. I use "I" statements, I don't react badly or with judgement, I'm just trying to get information. Her mom, on the other hand (my wife, who yes, I am very much in love with) gets frustrated very easily, and also has a history of meltiing down when she feels pressured, which I'm sure La Petit Sprog has noticed and tries to use the same behavior.

La Petit Sprog is also VERY slow at everything. I mean like it takes an hour to eat breakfast or dinner. This isn't slow eating because she can't eat fast - candy/ice cream/whatever disappears near instantly. She just eats... Really... Slowly. She likes the food (you should hear her go on about how fantastic my cooking is, and she will tell me if she doesn't like something) but unless it's sweet will eat like she has all the time in the world.

Same with homework. Math homework (which should take 30 minutes) takes 1-3 hours. She gets it right, but she spends so much time jerking around that there's no time for anything in any given day except for meal times, piano practice, homework, and showers. I want to do other things with her, I've dangled them in front of her, she wants to do them, and nothing gets done. Just slow, grinding, wasted time.

/headdesk

(Yes, the ADHD thing has been checked out. She has medication that she gets upset about taking. She has a short-term medication as well that she flat out refuses to take. It seems to make a difference when she takes it, she just doesn't want to take it and won't tell me why.)
 

nartreb

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I'm feeling kind of frustrated about being a parent.

La Petit Sprog, who is ten, often responds if I ask her if she's done a task with a fake cry or cringe. To be clear, I don't yell or act frustrated, in fact I'm very much the epitome of calm. I use "I" statements, I don't react badly or with judgement, I'm just trying to get information. Her mom, on the other hand (my wife, who yes, I am very much in love with) gets frustrated very easily, and also has a history of meltiing down when she feels pressured, which I'm sure La Petit Sprog has noticed and tries to use the same behavior.

La Petit Sprog is also VERY slow at everything. I mean like it takes an hour to eat breakfast or dinner. This isn't slow eating because she can't eat fast - candy/ice cream/whatever disappears near instantly. She just eats... Really... Slowly. She likes the food (you should hear her go on about how fantastic my cooking is, and she will tell me if she doesn't like something) but unless it's sweet will eat like she has all the time in the world.

Same with homework. Math homework (which should take 30 minutes) takes 1-3 hours. She gets it right, but she spends so much time jerking around that there's no time for anything in any given day except for meal times, piano practice, homework, and showers. I want to do other things with her, I've dangled them in front of her, she wants to do them, and nothing gets done. Just slow, grinding, wasted time.

/headdesk

(Yes, the ADHD thing has been checked out. She has medication that she gets upset about taking. She has a short-term medication as well that she flat out refuses to take. It seems to make a difference when she takes it, she just doesn't want to take it and won't tell me why.)

It sounds like she does have all the time in the world (and there's not necessarily anything wrong with that).

Ten is a tough age, because you need to open the door to letting her make her own choices. She's going to batter through that door in a very few years anway. But she's still young enough for you to put your foot down once in a while. "We've got half an hour for lunch, then I'm going to go do fun thing. You can stay and finish lunch, or you can join me." (Obviously, be very careful with this one, if it means she stops getting enough to eat, you need to find another tactic.) Try setting aside an hour or two for fun_thing , before homework time. See if she's more able to concentrate on homework under those circumstances. Try just insisting on her taking the meds. Maybe with a time limit, some kind of reward at the end, some kind of performance measurement. Or reverse that: not taking the meds is the reward if she gets her homework done on time.
Consult with spouse/teachers/doctor and pick one of those suggestions at a time. (Or half of one. Generally the smaller the step, the easier it will be tolerated. Use your imagination to see if there are small tasks, small rewards, small aids that might help. (A checklist? A timer?)

Are you in the US? "I want to do things with her" sounds like a very US parent attitude. What does she want to do? What do her friends do with their time? [Also, what do you do with your time besides watch her eat lunch slowly?] Get her doing some of those on a regular basis (regardless of whether she's finished her homework that day, missing a few won't do any lasting harm) then see if she's more willing/able to push through the homework in less time.

Also, take this with an iceberg of salt, but your kid doesn't quite sound like typical ADHD. Does your doc know about Cognitive Disengagement Syndrome (formerly SCT)? It's not a very well-established diagnosis, but there's research suggesting ADHD drugs don't work very well for this population, and other meds/therapies have some promise.


Edited to add: somehow on first reading I skipped past the part about cringing, and having a parent who's modeling the cringing behavior. That's not going to be easy to "fix". What do you do when your spouse acts like that, and why isn't that same approach working/appropriate with the kid? Is it something you'd like your spouse to work on too? Do you need a new approach to your spouse when she acts this way? Make sure you're not punishing the kid for something the adults in her life do. (Other than, you know, driving a car...)

Figure out which is more important (in your kid's life/future): the cringing or the dilly-dallying. They're definitely reinforcing each other, but be clear on what your goals are and you will have more clarity on what your next steps should be. Make sure your goal is not "I want her to behave the way I would", it's "X is actually hurting her right now" or maybe it's "I'm afraid it will hurt her in future"... Take stock of those harms. If it's just "she's missing out on fun stuff", maybe it's not the end of the world if she does some fun stuff before her homework is done. If it's "this cringing stuff is manipulative and annoying", I completely agree but it works for some people. You want to encourage her to tone it down, maybe talk explicitly about alternate strategies, but at some point she has to realize things for herself on her own timeline. You don't want to be the cringe police. "Kind but firm, and also calm" is the strategy here. Crying should not get rewarded with an exemption from the rules, but neither should it result in extra drama (which is a form of reward too). If your wife is not on board, that will be an uphill battle, because consistency is key.
 
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Demento

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Sigh.
Parent's evening at the school.
Now we had a discussion at the school a few months back about homework. And how the teachers were to be told that if they don't give him a red mark for the missing homework, we don't know about it and we can't do anything about it. And lo and behold, most of the teachers said he misses homework, but they don't want to piss the Boy off by harping on about it because he's a Good Kid. He has them wrapped around his finger by being articulate and contributing well in class. He just refuses to do work outside of class.

We do, of course, attempt to check on his homework. But we get limited information about the work and expectations, and often just have to take the teenager at his word. At least most of his teachers have reasonable expectations about it. His Physics teacher is a genuine Ph.D and I nearly laughed while she was talking about the Boy making his own flash cards.
 

drogin

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Sigh.
Parent's evening at the school.
Now we had a discussion at the school a few months back about homework. And how the teachers were to be told that if they don't give him a red mark for the missing homework, we don't know about it and we can't do anything about it. And lo and behold, most of the teachers said he misses homework, but they don't want to piss the Boy off by harping on about it because he's a Good Kid. He has them wrapped around his finger by being articulate and contributing well in class. He just refuses to do work outside of class.

We do, of course, attempt to check on his homework. But we get limited information about the work and expectations, and often just have to take the teenager at his word. At least most of his teachers have reasonable expectations about it. His Physics teacher is a genuine Ph.D and I nearly laughed while she was talking about the Boy making his own flash cards.
It's a tough one. I have been there and I know it is frustrating, especially if they are otherwise a good student. It's really just the age, and you'll both get through it.

I always put it more back on the teachers.

At that age you really do need to be learning some life lessons on your own, and that's through mistakes. The teachers don't have a leg to stand on if they aren't arming the parents with the information they need to force compliance OR aren't holding the student accountable via performance impacting things like clear and obvious bad marks.

I remember having a teacher in HS who marked me down significantly on a paper. It wasn't exactly a "bad" grade, just off enough where he knew I slacked. He stopped commenting after the first page, and on the second page just wrote "Wise up" and underlined it.

Another kid in class got a similar grade (but this was a great outcome for them). They had thoughtful comments throughout the paper and note on front page just said something like "Proud of you. Keeping going". That is a teacher.
 

Cognac

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Little Miss Cognac referring to herself as literally "LMC" is now head cannon.
I guess this is as good a time as any. LMC is going to be a Big Sister later this year. So now I need to decide about whether to keep LMC, and go with something else for #2. Or to "promote" LMC to BMC, and shift the LMC title to her little sister.

It's pretty exciting times for everyone, but Ms Cognac has been so incredibly ill with morning sickness that it's kind hampered the celebrations a little bit over the first few months.

Personally I'm going through all of the things second-time parents go through: pretty excited, but also how can anything possibly compare to the little person that LMC has become? I have no doubt that the new arrival will get just as much love, if not more because she'll have an older sister to contribute to the pool, but it just seems so very foreign to imagine the household with another little human in it. But we adapted the first time around, and I'm sure we'll adapt this time around as well!
 

Thorvard

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Sigh.
Parent's evening at the school.
Now we had a discussion at the school a few months back about homework. And how the teachers were to be told that if they don't give him a red mark for the missing homework, we don't know about it and we can't do anything about it. And lo and behold, most of the teachers said he misses homework, but they don't want to piss the Boy off by harping on about it because he's a Good Kid. He has them wrapped around his finger by being articulate and contributing well in class. He just refuses to do work outside of class.

We do, of course, attempt to check on his homework. But we get limited information about the work and expectations, and often just have to take the teenager at his word. At least most of his teachers have reasonable expectations about it. His Physics teacher is a genuine Ph.D and I nearly laughed while she was talking about the Boy making his own flash cards.

I'm not even slightly embarrassed to say for the first couple years of HS I had access to his email and Classroom and I could verify that he did his homework. I would only bring up something if I saw it wasn't submitted yet or anything like that.

By the end of 10th grade I could tell that he was keeping up with everything despite saying that each day was "boring" and he had nothing to do.
 
We do, of course, attempt to check on his homework. But we get limited information about the work and expectations, and often just have to take the teenager at his word. At least most of his teachers have reasonable expectations about it. His Physics teacher is a genuine Ph.D and I nearly laughed while she was talking about the Boy making his own flash cards.
If he's demonstrating mastery of the material without doing homework, is there an actual net benefit to forcing him to do the homework?
 

Demento

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If he's demonstrating mastery of the material without doing homework, is there an actual net benefit to forcing him to do the homework?
He's losing out on method points in the test. Like he will get the answer, but if he'd done the homework he'd have known the full process that's expected of him and got full marks. There's a stark contrast between his grades in subjects that just want an answer any which way, and ones where the process is the answer.

It's one of the ways his 'tism shows, I think. He's mainstream with a learning plan, but he passes well enough that I think they sometimes forget about his 'tism when they deal with these things.
 
He's losing out on method points in the test. Like he will get the answer, but if he'd done the homework he'd have known the full process that's expected of him and got full marks. There's a stark contrast between his grades in subjects that just want an answer any which way, and ones where the process is the answer.

It's one of the ways his 'tism shows, I think. He's mainstream with a learning plan, but he passes well enough that I think they sometimes forget about his 'tism when they deal with these things.
I appreciate the additional details.

Does he understand that demonstrating the process is part of mastery?
 

phoenix_rizzen

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He's losing out on method points in the test. Like he will get the answer, but if he'd done the homework he'd have known the full process that's expected of him and got full marks. There's a stark contrast between his grades in subjects that just want an answer any which way, and ones where the process is the answer.

It's one of the ways his 'tism shows, I think. He's mainstream with a learning plan, but he passes well enough that I think they sometimes forget about his 'tism when they deal with these things.
Urgh! I hated having to write down all 17 steps required to get to the answer when I only needed 3-4 steps, regardless if it was math, science, socials, etc. And writing down just those 3-4 steps always ended up with partial marks. Had quite a few arguments with teachers about it. The questions just said "show your work" which is what I did, not "show the exact sequence of steps that I expect to see here". Had to have several parent-teacher meetings each year to get the point across that I understood the material, that I understood the concepts, but that I had better methods (for me) to reach the answer. The compromise was that I would do at least 1 assignment in each unit showing the full "this is the exact sequence I want you to use" method, before switching to my shortcuts.

Was a struggle for a year or two, but we all came to an understanding that worked. Granted, this was 30-odd years ago, so may not be applicable today. :)
 

Bardon

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Urgh! I hated having to write down all 17 steps required to get to the answer when I only needed 3-4 steps, regardless if it was math, science, socials, etc. And writing down just those 3-4 steps always ended up with partial marks. Had quite a few arguments with teachers about it. The questions just said "show your work" which is what I did, not "show the exact sequence of steps that I expect to see here". Had to have several parent-teacher meetings each year to get the point across that I understood the material, that I understood the concepts, but that I had better methods (for me) to reach the answer. The compromise was that I would do at least 1 assignment in each unit showing the full "this is the exact sequence I want you to use" method, before switching to my shortcuts.

Was a struggle for a year or two, but we all came to an understanding that worked. Granted, this was 30-odd years ago, so may not be applicable today. :)
I had something similar though it was more like 45-ish years ago. I was BORED and what they wanted in math/physics in particular was so drawn out and felt like a complete waste of time. Finally got a deal similar to what you had except I had to do the first answer on the test/exam with the "full method" and the rest my way.

Worked like a treat!
 

Demento

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We could do that as kids. National, standardised testing is a bit less flexible that way. He gets concessions - can use a keyboard, a smidge of extra time, the right to a quiet room if it's too much. Not seen that in practice; it's a good school and they're quiet as a graveyard. But the Test is the Test and they're graded in a standardised fashion.
 
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Jeff J

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Quick note. If you find yourself on a school bus full of second graders on an hour trip to a field trip: they love to play hangman. 2nd graders are just learning how to spell, and enjoy being the one running the game. This is wat we kall hard mowd.
Yeah, for the ten years I taught third grade Sunday School, I used hang man as the filler/review from when I was done with the lesson to when the last parent showed up.

Kids often didn't understand that you have to know how the word is spelled to run the game.

Sometimes the light goes on about what hanging is, and there are tears.
 

Coppercloud

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5yo decided to ride her bike today. I'm convinced she could have done this two years ago - has been killing it on the balance bike and can pedal other things (including a tandem bike) no problem, but just needed time, jealousy of her sister, confidence, a straight and narrow, and to be left alone to do it.

Shes hauling ass now on that little thing.
 

Coppercloud

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Loitering outside while the neighbor kids are on my trampoline because... fuck if someone got in trouble and I weren't here that'd be bad. Am I a helicopter parent? Maybe. I'm not micromanaging them or anything. But I don't really know these kids' parents, they just show up and jump on my trampoline. And they're like 5-8 years I'm not leaving them alone for too long.

I need to be getting dinner ready though.
 

drogin

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Loitering outside while the neighbor kids are on my trampoline because... fuck if someone got in trouble and I weren't here that'd be bad. Am I a helicopter parent? Maybe. I'm not micromanaging them or anything. But I don't really know these kids' parents, they just show up and jump on my trampoline. And they're like 5-8 years I'm not leaving them alone for too long.

I need to be getting dinner ready though.
I mean, they are using it with your kids right? When you say they just show up, I envision them just raiding your back yard and using your trampoline. That's some chase off with a broom stuff right there...
 

phoenix_rizzen

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I mean, they are using it with your kids right? When you say they just show up, I envision them just raiding your back yard and using your trampoline. That's some chase off with a broom stuff right there...
This is why we haven't put our trampoline together yet, even though we've lived here for 5 years. 😂 We don't have a fence around the front yard and that's the only place with enough room for it. I can just see the neighbourhood kids using it at midnight and breaking an arm.
 
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Demento

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Loitering outside while the neighbor kids are on my trampoline because... fuck if someone got in trouble and I weren't here that'd be bad. Am I a helicopter parent? Maybe. I'm not micromanaging them or anything. But I don't really know these kids' parents, they just show up and jump on my trampoline. And they're like 5-8 years I'm not leaving them alone for too long.

I need to be getting dinner ready though.
Trampolines are highly efficient bone breaking machines, even with a fence around them. It is in no way being overprotective. I don't even think refusing to have a trampoline is overprotective.
 

ChaoticUnreal

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He's losing out on method points in the test. Like he will get the answer, but if he'd done the homework he'd have known the full process that's expected of him and got full marks. There's a stark contrast between his grades in subjects that just want an answer any which way, and ones where the process is the answer.

It's one of the ways his 'tism shows, I think. He's mainstream with a learning plan, but he passes well enough that I think they sometimes forget about his 'tism when they deal with these things.
I hated that aspect and vividly remember having a "discussion" with numerous teachers about how if I don't show my work they can't give me partial credit and them seeming to not understand that I would rather not show my work than get partial credit.

Hurray for high functioning autism masking itself (I really hate that term but can't think of a better one so apologizes cause I know it can be triggering) until much later in life (30+)
 
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Thorvard

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Well my daughter lost my old Nokona glove. She had been using it for softball the past couple of seasons because she liked it better than other gloves she tried.

I've had that glove for AGES. After every practice I ask "Have all your stuff? Glove? Bat?" and last week after her practice she was in an especially shitty asshole mood and just said "I always do" while proceeding to complain about having to slide and bunt.

Lo and behold yesterday at rec team practice "Where's my glove?" Isn't in your bag where it always is? "Uh, nope"

And it went from "I always put it in my bag" to "I thought I threw it in the car" to "I'm pretty sure I picked it up"

:mad:

I've had that glove so long that I had to save up to spend the $260 to buy it. Checking now that same glove is roughly $500. Not sure I'll be dropping that on a new glove for myself.
 

ChaoticUnreal

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Well my daughter lost my old Nokona glove. She had been using it for softball the past couple of seasons because she liked it better than other gloves she tried.

I've had that glove for AGES. After every practice I ask "Have all your stuff? Glove? Bat?" and last week after her practice she was in an especially shitty asshole mood and just said "I always do" while proceeding to complain about having to slide and bunt.

Lo and behold yesterday at rec team practice "Where's my glove?" Isn't in your bag where it always is? "Uh, nope"

And it went from "I always put it in my bag" to "I thought I threw it in the car" to "I'm pretty sure I picked it up"

:mad:

I've had that glove so long that I had to save up to spend the $260 to buy it. Checking now that same glove is roughly $500. Not sure I'll be dropping that on a new glove for myself.
Sounds like you know what your daughter will be saving up for with her money.