Florida’s new surgeon general skeptical of vaccines, opposes masks

Ladapo signed the Great Barrington Declaration and suggests embracing "the reality of viral spread."

Read the whole story

 

[daveishereagain]

He doesn’t believe in what was taught so, maybe UCLA should revoke his degree.

His degrees are from Harvard. He just had a professorship at UCLA.

Edit- And, as far as I know, degrees don't get 'revoked'. You complete the criteria and earn the sheepskin.
He earned an MD and a PHD but whether he is board certified to practice medicine I do not know.
I've met a few MD's I wouldn't let walk my dog if I had one.

 

[Lt_Storm]

Since I am somewhat sick of this debate about whether thing X is really socialism or not, let's do a little real political philosophy here, specifically let's define this term.

Socialism is a branch of political philosophy originating in the 1800s that focuses on collective over individual action and deals with class issues, labor rights, inequality, and the failures of capitalism and liberalism at the time to deal with these problems. As such, it can be said to include a great many different philosophies including but not limited to: communism, Leninism, Marxism, the labor and union movements, various forms of anarchism, progressivism, and, yes, both Social Democracy and Democratic Socialism.

As such, it is entirely reasonable to say that countries like Sweden and Norway are, to some degree or another, socialist countries. Just as one could argue that countries like the USSR and Venezuela are (failed) socialist countries. Or, as one could argue that America was circa 1950 with the new deal.

 

[daveishereagain]

Since I am somewhat sick of this debate about whether thing X is really socialism or not, let's do a little real political philosophy here, specifically let's define this term.

Socialism is a branch of political philosophy originating in the 1800s that focuses on collective over individual action and deals with class issues, labor rights, inequality, and the failures of capitalism and liberalism at the time to deal with these problems. As such, it can be said to include a great many different philosophies including but not limited to: communism, Leninism, Marxism, the labor and union movements, various forms of anarchism, progressivism, and, yes, both Social Democracy and Democratic Socialism.

As such, it is entirely reasonable to say that countries like Sweden and Norway are, to some degree or another, socialist countries. Just as one could argue that countries like the USSR and Venezuela are (failed) socialist countries. Or, as one could argue that America was circa 1950 with the new deal.

Great. However, we're drifting way off-topic. In my view (personal opinion) there's nothing more boring than discussions on political purity.

Edit- Especially so since you really missed the boat on the New Deal being 'circa 1950'.

 

[DarthSlack]

By that logic I suppose that it is safe to take up smoking.

That's what the celery in a Bloody Mary is for. Veggies are magical health shields. The difference between Jimi Hendrix and Keith Richards is Keith Richards ate some broccoli one time, true story.

Actually, like Hendrix, Keith Richards ODed at the age of 27. It's just that the drugs haven't worn off yet, but when they do...

Keith Richards will become more powerful than we can possibly imagine?

 

[Papewaio]

By that logic I suppose that it is safe to take up smoking.

That's what the celery in a Bloody Mary is for. Veggies are magical health shields. The difference between Jimi Hendrix and Keith Richards is Keith Richards ate some broccoli one time, true story.

Actually, like Hendrix, Keith Richards ODed at the age of 27. It's just that the drugs haven't worn off yet, but when they do...

Keith Richards will become more powerful than we can possibly imagine?

Username is the one we are looking for.

 

[pnellesen]

DeSantis's 2018 election margin of victory was 32,462 - 0.4% of votes, Current Covid deaths in Florida exceed 50,000. Going with the plague doctor's plan to address viral spread, we can expect 100% of the unvaccinated population to become exposed to, and contract some level of disease from the virus. Current mortality rate in florida is about 1.5% of cases result in death.

So, with a population of 24.5 million, and 56% fully vaccinated, there are 13,720,000 million future infected. That in theory will result in over 2 million deaths.

Nurgle is pleased.

1.5% of 13M is about 200K, not 2M.

I must have put a decimal point in the wrong place or something. Shit! I always do that. I always mess up some mundane detail.

Happens to all of us, Mr. Bolton.

 

[Ozy]

I really thought we were over the erroneous, and historically used to persecute innocent people "Spanish" flu moniker now. I mean, didn't the racist and cringe-worthy "China Flu" and "Kung Flu" from last year show us that we're not supposed to be perpetuating slanderous adjectives regarding a pandemic's ground zero? I really thought we were only to "the 1918 flu". It tells everybody when and what, and it doesn't have the lying, racist adjectives involved.

Sorry, that just really irked me, as it's irresponsible branding in a journalist.

You are correct that generally it is preferred not to refer to it as the Spanish Flu. However, I would say that the two things you're laying down are a false equivalence.

The Spanish Flu as a name was more an accident of wartime censorship of bad news. This ironically meant most of the reporting on the pandemic focused on Spain.They couldn't report on the flu locally.

That would be as opposed to the "China Flu" and "Kung Flu" which were intended to incite racial hatred and xenophobia while laying blame on Asians in general. (This type or xenophobic rhetoric doesn't really tend to acknowledge there are multiple national or ethnic groups in Asia.) This type or rhetoric is a direct cause of a significant increase in hate crimes against those of Asian heritage.

Yeah, I don't think referring to the 1918 flu epidemic as the 'Spanish flu' will unleash hate crimes against Spaniards. They seem to have that well in hand themselves at the present time.

Also, it is likely due to how it has been taught in the past that including that language helped to add clarity to the article. Something that will never apply to using the "Kung Flu" name when COVID-19 was already well established globally as the name of the disease.

Indeed so. I was taught that my maternal grandmother died from Spanish flu leaving my mother an orphan as my maternal grandfather had drowned on Christmas Day duck hunting on Chesapeake Bay.
I never once had any animosity to Spaniards or Marylanders.

What about ducks?

 

[Random_stranger]

DeSantis has already killed more people with Covid than his margin of victory in his 2018 election to office. You can bet that 90% of those deaths are people who voted for him.

Looks like Florida will get a Democrat governor next year.

There is already a conspiracy theory doing their rounds on the right wing media that Democrats are goading Republicans into not taking the vaccine so that they die off quicker and win the election.

https://www.breitbart.com/entertainment ... ters-dead/

The people of Florida not only voted for a GOP governor but also a GOP majority in both houses in their state - it is difficult to feel sorry for a population who have signed their own death warrant (I do however feel for those who get out and vote against the GOP, see sanity of their state slip away but lack the funds/means to be move out of the state).

Damn, that link needs a NSFL tag. The stupidity burns so bad.

 

[Lt_Storm]

Edit- Especially so since you really missed the boat on the New Deal being 'circa 1950'.

While the specific policies described as the new deal were specific to the 1930s, New Deal liberalism was the consensus for decades thereafter until, roughly, the 1970s. This era truly and thoroughly ended in 1980 when Ronald Reagan stupidly took it out back and shot it.

Edit: though, given Social Security and Medicare, I suppose you could argue that it's zombie corpse is still shambling about.

 

[Bernardo Verda]

To be clear, while losing weight, exercising, and eating fruits and vegetables are generally good for health, they will not prevent SARS-CoV-2 infection or transmission.

To be clear, vaccines do not prevent infection or transmission either. It would have helped it the writer mentioned this, since his intention is to be clear. Vaccines reduce transmission and infection, which is definitely not the same as preventing it.

Anti-lock brakes/ABS "do not prevent" traffic accidents, either.
Nor do seat-belts "prevent" automotive injuries or fatalities... warning labels on household chemicals don't prevent..., drunk-driving laws..., life jackets..., pilot certification..., etc..., etc.

See how dumb that kind of context-free word-quibbling can be -- assuming it was even offered honestly in the first place?

 

[Rob1n]

How in the absolute hell considering florida is one of the largest places for people to retire to do these people think this is a good idea. This idiot should of been kicked out of research and should never be cleared as a surgeon general anywhere.

He should never be cleared to be a doctor anywhere, never mind a surgeon general

 

[daveishereagain]

I really thought we were over the erroneous, and historically used to persecute innocent people "Spanish" flu moniker now. I mean, didn't the racist and cringe-worthy "China Flu" and "Kung Flu" from last year show us that we're not supposed to be perpetuating slanderous adjectives regarding a pandemic's ground zero? I really thought we were only to "the 1918 flu". It tells everybody when and what, and it doesn't have the lying, racist adjectives involved.

Sorry, that just really irked me, as it's irresponsible branding in a journalist.

You are correct that generally it is preferred not to refer to it as the Spanish Flu. However, I would say that the two things you're laying down are a false equivalence.

The Spanish Flu as a name was more an accident of wartime censorship of bad news. This ironically meant most of the reporting on the pandemic focused on Spain.They couldn't report on the flu locally.

That would be as opposed to the "China Flu" and "Kung Flu" which were intended to incite racial hatred and xenophobia while laying blame on Asians in general. (This type or xenophobic rhetoric doesn't really tend to acknowledge there are multiple national or ethnic groups in Asia.) This type or rhetoric is a direct cause of a significant increase in hate crimes against those of Asian heritage.

Yeah, I don't think referring to the 1918 flu epidemic as the 'Spanish flu' will unleash hate crimes against Spaniards. They seem to have that well in hand themselves at the present time.

Also, it is likely due to how it has been taught in the past that including that language helped to add clarity to the article. Something that will never apply to using the "Kung Flu" name when COVID-19 was already well established globally as the name of the disease.

Indeed so. I was taught that my maternal grandmother died from Spanish flu leaving my mother an orphan as my maternal grandfather had drowned on Christmas Day duck hunting on Chesapeake Bay.
I never once had any animosity to Spaniards or Marylanders.

What about ducks?

They're free from blame. His high boots got stuck in the marsh mud and he had no way to free himself as the tide came in. They may have watched the whole affair.
As the tale goes, (my mother was a child when she became orphaned) a companion went for help. The rest is academic.

Edit- Can't imagine a worse way to die. Just wanted to hunt a few ducks on Christmas......

 

[daveishereagain]

To be clear, while losing weight, exercising, and eating fruits and vegetables are generally good for health, they will not prevent SARS-CoV-2 infection or transmission.

To be clear, vaccines do not prevent infection or transmission either. It would have helped it the writer mentioned this, since his intention is to be clear. Vaccines reduce transmission and infection, which is definitely not the same as preventing it.

Anti-lock brakes/ABS "do not prevent" traffic accidents, either.
Nor do seat-belts "prevent" automotive injuries or fatalities... warning labels on household chemicals don't prevent..., drunk-driving laws..., life jackets..., pilot certification..., etc..., etc.

See how dumb that kind of context-free word-quibbling can be -- assuming it was even offered honestly in the first place?

It wasn't offered in good faith. As is none of the obvious ploys to move the discussion off-topic.

 

[balthazarr]

Joseph Ladapo, a UCLA researcher known for opposing evidence-based mask mandates, vaccine mandates, and lockdowns.

Another fucking idiot.

Haha, you are calling a Harvard Med school graduate, with a PhD in public health policy, and trained at a top tier center an idiot. Your Kool Aid must be tasty.

Yeah, we are. Because this idiot is clearly not going with science, and clearly doesn't give a shit for the lives of people in the state he's going to serve. He was clearly just hired to regurgitate DeSantis' talking points.

He's far, far more dangerous than just affecting his own state. Others will use him as an example, pointing to his credentials, and further undermine the vaccination/masking/distancing efforts.

 

[daveishereagain]

Edit- Especially so since you really missed the boat on the New Deal being 'circa 1950'.

While the specific policies described as the new deal were specific to the 1930s, New Deal liberalism was the consensus for decades thereafter until, roughly, the 1970s. This era truly and thoroughly ended in 1980 when Ronald Reagan stupidly took it out back and shot it.

Edit: though, given Social Security and Medicare, I suppose you could argue that it's zombie corpse is still shambling about.

Since both programs keep me and my wife alive, that 'zombie corpse shambling about' is fine with me. Unless you wish to return to the topic at hand, we're done sharing here.

 

[s73v3r]

DeSantis has already killed more people with Covid than his margin of victory in his 2018 election to office. You can bet that 90% of those deaths are people who voted for him.

Looks like Florida will get a Democrat governor next year.

There is already a conspiracy theory doing their rounds on the right wing media that Democrats are goading Republicans into not taking the vaccine so that they die off quicker and win the election.

https://www.breitbart.com/entertainment ... ters-dead/

The people of Florida not only voted for a GOP governor but also a GOP majority in both houses in their state - it is difficult to feel sorry for a population who have signed their own death warrant (I do however feel for those who get out and vote against the GOP, see sanity of their state slip away but lack the funds/means to be move out of the state).

Damn, that link needs a NSFL tag. The stupidity burns so bad.

I'm unwilling to subject myself to that filth, but how many stories has Breitbart done promoting getting vaccinated? How many stories have they done coming from an anti-vaxxer perspective?

 

[Bernardo Verda]

How the fuck does someone like this earn a medical degree? It's like Boeing hiring a Chief Engineer that doesn't believe in the principles of aerodynamics....oh, wait, maybe that explains it all.

I just looked it up, Dr. Ladapo also holds an MD from Harvard Medical School and a PhD in Health Policy from Harvard Graduate School of Arts and Sciences.
Wow, I was not expecting that

And Desantis has a Law degree from Harvard (on top of a History degree (magna cum laude) from Yale.

Yes. It's infuriating. And disgusting. And depressing.

 

[cyberjudge]

I'm absolutely OK with FL and TX seceding from the rest of us, and just letting them spiral down to their inevitable conclusion. Sorry (not sorry).

Make sure we keep the subs and Nukes.

 

[Papewaio]

I'm absolutely OK with FL and TX seceding from the rest of us, and just letting them spiral down to their inevitable conclusion. Sorry (not sorry).

Make sure we keep the subs and Nukes.

So that is why Australia is getting US nuclear powered submarines…

 

[Bernardo Verda]

Meanwhile, in Vermont, the Delta wave is barely a ripple. They sure must eat their vegetables there!

It's well known maple syrup offers protection from many kinds of virus.

Though the key is to snort the syrup, after swallowing a zinc supplement. It does no good if you swallow it.

Rats!
And here I was all set to volunteer for the Phase 1/Phase 2 trials...

 

[Oldnoobguy]

DeSantis has already killed more people with Covid than his margin of victory in his 2018 election to office. You can bet that 90% of those deaths are people who voted for him.

Looks like Florida will get a Democrat governor next year.

There is already a conspiracy theory doing their rounds on the right wing media that Democrats are goading Republicans into not taking the vaccine so that they die off quicker and win the election.

https://www.breitbart.com/entertainment ... ters-dead/

The people of Florida not only voted for a GOP governor but also a GOP majority in both houses in their state - it is difficult to feel sorry for a population who have signed their own death warrant (I do however feel for those who get out and vote against the GOP, see sanity of their state slip away but lack the funds/means to be move out of the state).

Towards the beginning of the Trump administration, I snarkily posted in a different forum that Trump supporters should do a GoFundMe if they wanted their stupid wall. A few days later I read a report about Build The Wall Awhile ago in this forum I recall making a snarky comment about how maybe a conspiracy theory could be started about "leftists" fomenting vaccine resistance in Trump supporters in order to change the country's demographics. Now you post that Breitbart link. Damn. Snarky comments aren't supposed to be actual action plans.

 

[daveishereagain]

I'm absolutely OK with FL and TX seceding from the rest of us, and just letting them spiral down to their inevitable conclusion. Sorry (not sorry).

Make sure we keep the subs in Nukes.

The subs are the property of the people of the United States. If a foreign power attempts to claim them sink the fuckers.

That's the problem with the 'STATES RIGHTS!' argument. The citizens of South Carolina broke into and robbed the property of The United States and then fired on citizens of their nation with captured ordnance.
OR
They broke into and robbed the property of a foreign power and used that ordnance against armed forces of a foreign power.

Either way, the Confederate States of America were an armed insurrection against the legally elected government of the United States of America and dealt with accordingly.
I have no problem with any state wishing to secede as they would starve within a month. They'd come to their senses a bit quicker than the last time.

 

[kerbaldroptest]

So I just banned the person who said:

"For every person saved by the vaccine 2 people are dying because of the vaccine."

Because clearly they're not very bright and are trying to spread FUD and I'm sick of it.

But I did get a dark chuckle out of it. I mean, do the math. We'd be climbing over corpses in the streets. We're talking about what? Something like 40% of the population being killed? Story checks out.

As I said, not very bright.

So, correct me if I'm wrong, but does that mean 2/3rds of everyone who got the vaccine is dying from it? So, 2/3rds of 5.98 billion administered vaccines? So, there would be close to 4 billion dead people on the planet?

Or am I doing the math thingy wrong?

Presumably 'people saved' is not 1 to 1 to doses administered. Still completely idiotic..

 

[Bernardo Verda]

I mean, Europe achieved herd immunity against the plague without the help of vaccine, amiright?

Not herd immunity. It's estimated the plague killed about 25 million people or about half of Europe's population at the time. The vast majority of people survived because they either quarantined themselves and waited till everyone around them that was sick had died or if they could afford it moved to an area wasn't densely populated.

It took nearly 300 years for Europes population to reach the numbers from before the plague.

And according to what I read, the plague kept resurfacing throughout that period of about 300 years. Not sure if that's what people mean when they talk about herd immunity.

Also, the plague is caused by a bacterium, not a virus. Does herd immunity even exist for a bacterial disease? I'm not a doctor.

I'm going out on a limb and state/claim that until we had vaccines there was no such thing as herd immunity.

And yes we can create herd immunity to bacteria, see Tetanus. But that is generally not so much against the bacteria as what they dump into the body, for Tetanus that is the toxin that is being released by Clostridium Tetani.

Wait, if we have herd immunity against tetanus, why do I get a tetanus shot every time i impale myself on a rusty nail?

The rusty nail isn't part of the herd, and you're not going to pass it on to other members of the herd.

 

[Wheels Of Confusion]

He doesn’t believe in what was taught so, maybe UCLA should revoke his degree.

A degree shows that he CAN exercise the necessary skills and knowledge to solve problems in his chosen field.

Everything after that is not a matter of "can," but a question of "will he/won't he?"

 

[bernstein]

Joseph Ladapo, a UCLA researcher known for opposing evidence-based mask mandates, vaccine mandates, and lockdowns.

Another fucking idiot.

I mean, Europe achieved herd immunity against the plague without the help of vaccine, amiright?

Partially yes and it only took about 5000 years of natural selection with uncounted millions of deaths (which at that time meant double digit percentages of dead). He's not an idiot, but has no empathy (EDD). Nature is brutal.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 114827.htm

 

[C64 raids Bungling Bay]

It's not so bad. Herd immunity as a strategy for a pandemic in God's Waiting Room may keep Social Security solvent for an extra 5-10 years.

 

[babydocmd]

I mean, Europe achieved herd immunity against the plague without the help of vaccine, amiright?

Not herd immunity. It's estimated the plague killed about 25 million people or about half of Europe's population at the time. The vast majority of people survived because they either quarantined themselves and waited till everyone around them that was sick had died or if they could afford it moved to an area wasn't densely populated.

It took nearly 300 years for Europes population to reach the numbers from before the plague.

And according to what I read, the plague kept resurfacing throughout that period of about 300 years. Not sure if that's what people mean when they talk about herd immunity.

Also, the plague is caused by a bacterium, not a virus. Does herd immunity even exist for a bacterial disease? I'm not a doctor.

I'm going out on a limb and state/claim that until we had vaccines there was no such thing as herd immunity.

And yes we can create herd immunity to bacteria, see Tetanus. But that is generally not so much against the bacteria as what they dump into the body, for Tetanus that is the toxin that is being released by Clostridium Tetani.

Wait, if we have herd immunity against tetanus, why do I get a tetanus shot every time i impale myself on a rusty nail?

Well actually that whole 'science thing' led to new research showing it is likely people don't need tetanus-diphtheria boosters in adulthood. Our bad. The first study in 2016 suggested completing the childhood/adolescent series protected you for 30 years. More recent data pushed that out to lifetime.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 075120.htm

 

[bernstein]

Personally, I think those who refuse the vaccine are making a poor medical choice. However, I do appreciate the concepts of individual responsibility and states' rights.

Sure, i couldn't agree more. However i do also believe in protecting the weak(er) (like children, grandparents, ...). There are a ton of freedom sacrifices we all make just for them (like having to buy more expensive car's because they have to have seat-belts, airbags, pass crash tests).

That's why restrictions only apply to locales where we can inadvertently harm others. So the only silly mandates i see are month's long country wide stay-at-home orders (like spain, australia, china, ...) or mask everywhere in public (like when hiking in spain's wilderness)

 

[balthazarr]

Joseph Ladapo, a UCLA researcher known for opposing evidence-based mask mandates, vaccine mandates, and lockdowns.

Another fucking idiot.

But he's a well-educated idiot. Every time someone highlights the clear evidentiary failures of Florida public health policy, De Santis will say, "Dr. Lapado says differently and he's got an MD/PhD from Harvard. You're just some reporter repeating the fake media paranoia and fear."

Odds are today or tomorrow, Florida will have 400 deaths in a day (yesterday was 398). Their surgeon general's response, "there's a lot of good pathways to health, and vaccination is not the only one. So, we support measures for good health—that's vaccination, losing weight, it's exercising more, it's eating more fruits and vegetables, everything. We support it all."

One irony is that his research specialty is on health economics (cost-effectiveness). So I wonder if he's compared the $2100/infusion for monoclonal antibodies versus $20/shot vaccine?

https://people.healthsciences.ucla.edu/ ... id=5473418 UCLA SOM still has his page up.

https://www.uclahealth.org/providers/joseph-ladapo UCLA Health ran for the hills.

It's remarkable how closely Ladapo's speech patterns match Trump's - more eloquent, sure, but the pattern is the same. *shudder*

 

[babydocmd]

Joseph Ladapo, a UCLA researcher known for opposing evidence-based mask mandates, vaccine mandates, and lockdowns.

Another fucking idiot.

Haha, you are calling a Harvard Med school graduate, with a PhD in public health policy, and trained at a top tier center an idiot. Your Kool Aid must be tasty.

Yeah, we are. Because this idiot is clearly not going with science, and clearly doesn't give a shit for the lives of people in the state he's going to serve. He was clearly just hired to regurgitate DeSantis' talking points.

He's far, far more dangerous than just affecting his own state. Others will use him as an example, pointing to his credentials, and further undermine the vaccination/masking/distancing efforts.

Except when the debate is about 'facts' as opposed to appealing to authority/credentials. Epidemiology, virology, immunology, and physiology aren't aligned with political parties or ideology. Any 'data' he utilizes to support specious arguments will be easily refuted. The 7 states currently consuming 70% of the national supply of monoclonal antibodies are FL, LA, TX, TN, MS, GA, AL. Hmm what do those states have in common?

 

[dcp123]

How the fuck does someone like this earn a medical degree? It's like Boeing hiring a Chief Engineer that doesn't believe in the principles of aerodynamics....oh, wait, maybe that explains it all.

What do you call someone who graduated medical school at the bottom of their class?

Doctor.

Ideally, you don't call him a professor at a UC medical school.

C'mon, UCLA, you're dragging down the whole UC system hiring a guy like this. I shouldn't tease though. I have a vague memory of a Berkeley professor being about this far in denial. Maybe he was arguing that he'd invented a perpetual motion machine, or denying that global warming is a thing, I don't really remember, but every good school occasionally hires a loon.

 

[The Dark]

Ladapo will also be leaving his position at UCLA

Congratulations, UCLA!

I echo that. And you know what the best part is? He has to live in Gainesville.
Heh.
He's in for a fucking shock.
LMFAO

Edit- They don't call the Florida Gators football stadium 'The Swamp' for nuthin'.

Does he have to live there or in Tally for his government work? Tally might be even worse because that's where FSU is located and there is precisely zero love lost between those two colleges.

 

[Auguste_Fivaz]

How the fuck does someone like this earn a medical degree? It's like Boeing hiring a Chief Engineer that doesn't believe in the principles of aerodynamics....oh, wait, maybe that explains it all.

What do you call someone who graduated medical school at the bottom of their class?

Doctor.

Ideally, you don't call him a professor at a UC medical school.

C'mon, UCLA, you're dragging down the whole UC system hiring a guy like this. I shouldn't tease though. I have a vague memory of a Berkeley professor being about this far in denial. Maybe he was arguing that he'd invented a perpetual motion machine, or denying that global warming is a thing, I don't really remember, but every good school occasionally hires a loon.

Berkeley has the famous John Choon Yoo who wrote the torture memos for Bush. Wikipedia says he's the Emanuel S. Heller Professor of Law at the University of California, Berkeley, School of Law. Empathy isn't taught in law school.

Edit - possessives vs plural, again

 

[dcp123]

I'm absolutely OK with FL and TX seceding from the rest of us, and just letting them spiral down to their inevitable conclusion. Sorry (not sorry).

Make sure we keep the subs in Nukes.

The subs are the property of the people of the United States. If a foreign power attempts to claim them sink the fuckers.

That's the problem with the 'STATES RIGHTS!' argument. The citizens of South Carolina broke into and robbed the property of The United States and then fired on citizens of their nation with captured ordnance.
OR
They broke into and robbed the property of a foreign power and used that ordnance against armed forces of a foreign power.

Either way, the Confederate States of America were an armed insurrection against the legally elected government of the United States of America and dealt with accordingly.
I have no problem with any state wishing to secede as they would starve within a month. They'd come to their senses a bit quicker than the last time.

Why, exactly, would California starve if we were ever so lucky as to develop the political will to peacefully secede from the US? I wholeheartedly agree that it's important not to try to secede by attacking U.S. military bases and shooting US soldiers. Just start negotiations about what share of the national debt we take with us and what federal assets get transferred to us. If there was consensus in California in favor of secession (there isn't), I'm pretty sure Congress would eventually pass a law blessing it.

 

[balthazarr]

Joseph Ladapo, a UCLA researcher known for opposing evidence-based mask mandates, vaccine mandates, and lockdowns.

Another fucking idiot.

Haha, you are calling a Harvard Med school graduate, with a PhD in public health policy, and trained at a top tier center an idiot. Your Kool Aid must be tasty.

Yeah, we are. Because this idiot is clearly not going with science, and clearly doesn't give a shit for the lives of people in the state he's going to serve. He was clearly just hired to regurgitate DeSantis' talking points.

He's far, far more dangerous than just affecting his own state. Others will use him as an example, pointing to his credentials, and further undermine the vaccination/masking/distancing efforts.

Except when the debate is about 'facts' as opposed to appealing to authority/credentials. Epidemiology, virology, immunology, and physiology aren't aligned with political parties or ideology. Any 'data' he utilizes to support specious arguments will be easily refuted. The 7 states currently consuming 70% of the national supply of monoclonal antibodies are FL, LA, TX, TN, MS, GA, AL. Hmm what do those states have in common?

I agree - but since when have facts been allowed to get in the way of the antivax agenda?

You can imagine some pollie in Texas or Alabama or wherever pointing out that Ladapo - the esteemed Dr Ladapo with an MD from Harvard and a PhD - agrees with their position - don't listen to the so-called experts. Here's an expert (even though he's not - there's those pesky facts again) - Surgeon General of Florida, no less - not just some influencer claiming something for likes and follows - that tells the truth that the Libs don't want to hear. MAGA!

Or something similar.

 

[dcp123]

How the fuck does someone like this earn a medical degree? It's like Boeing hiring a Chief Engineer that doesn't believe in the principles of aerodynamics....oh, wait, maybe that explains it all.

What do you call someone who graduated medical school at the bottom of their class?

Doctor.

Ideally, you don't call him a professor at a UC medical school.

C'mon, UCLA, you're dragging down the whole UC system hiring a guy like this. I shouldn't tease though. I have a vague memory of a Berkeley professor being about this far in denial. Maybe he was arguing that he'd invented a perpetual motion machine, or denying that global warming is a thing, I don't really remember, but every good school occasionally hires a loon.

Berkeley has the famous John Choon Yoo who wrote the torture memos for Bush. Wikipedia says he's the Emanuel S. Heller Professor of Law at the University of California, Berkeley, School of Law. Empathy isn't taught in law school.

Edit - possessives vs plural, again

I was thinking of someone else, but if he'd been there when I was in law school, I would have spit in his face.

The torture memos were worse morally but his memos on warrantless surveillance were completely devoid of anything that could be mistaken for a legal basis. They were lies intended to give lawbreaking criminals the cover of saying "gee, but our lawyer said it was OK." He should be disbarred. There is no possible way that a sane man could have believed that what he was writing was true. I genuinely hate that guy.

I thought he was currently working elsewhere as a visiting professor somewhere like the Hoover Institution. Maybe I'm deluding myself.

 

[Bvds2007]

Florida, meet Alberta.