You’re not getting enough sleep—and it’s killing you
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I couldn't imagine living without being able to put aside 8 hours every night to sleep. I don't even need an alarm clock. In bed around midnight, up between 7 and 8 every morning hitting work at 10.
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I had to give up caffeine (not my first choice) recently to be able to sleep
it worked, go figure
Sure does help a lot to get enough rest
it worked, go figure
Sure does help a lot to get enough rest
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I have this crazy and unorthodox way to make sure I have no problems going to sleep and that I get enough. It's so crazy that it just might work for you!
It's called... brace yourself... exercise.
I wake up between 6:30 and 7 on my own, no alarm needed, drink some coffee, then I go to the gym and do some light weight lifting and an hour on an elliptical machine. I mostly zone out but I read Ars and SA as best I can. Then I go eat breakfast and continue on my day. I'm lucky to to stay up past 11 pm and I'm asleep in about 5 minutes once I lay down. I drink a 96 oz. pot of coffee a day, sometimes even more, yet I still fall asleep like that. What can I say? I like the taste. If I don't exercise, the stress from working a high-level IT job starts getting to me; I view it as a pressure relief valve, and it's not a good idea for me to walk around like a 1960s era pressure cooker that's been left on...
I cannot comment on people with children and/or who let themselves be worked 50+ hours a week. I've straight up walked off jobs where I was told I had to be on call basically forever and that was not told to me during the interview process. Fuck you, I'm a human being, not a robot, and I need sleep.
It's called... brace yourself... exercise.
I wake up between 6:30 and 7 on my own, no alarm needed, drink some coffee, then I go to the gym and do some light weight lifting and an hour on an elliptical machine. I mostly zone out but I read Ars and SA as best I can. Then I go eat breakfast and continue on my day. I'm lucky to to stay up past 11 pm and I'm asleep in about 5 minutes once I lay down. I drink a 96 oz. pot of coffee a day, sometimes even more, yet I still fall asleep like that. What can I say? I like the taste. If I don't exercise, the stress from working a high-level IT job starts getting to me; I view it as a pressure relief valve, and it's not a good idea for me to walk around like a 1960s era pressure cooker that's been left on...
I cannot comment on people with children and/or who let themselves be worked 50+ hours a week. I've straight up walked off jobs where I was told I had to be on call basically forever and that was not told to me during the interview process. Fuck you, I'm a human being, not a robot, and I need sleep.
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I think respecting your body and practicing moderation are key. I try to get a good 7-8 hours a night and have no trouble falling asleep (maybe 3-5 min) and I still enjoy moderate caffeine and alcohol. Again, key operator, moderation.
I was a three cup a day coffee drinker - down to about two and not after 5pm. With the alcohol side of it, if I'm traveling for work, there could be dinners and drinks but I'll stick to a few and call it quits by 10-11 o'clock when at home occasionally a beer or glass of wine.
Another big addition, more water. Now that I drink more water I just feel a lot better.
FWIW
I was a three cup a day coffee drinker - down to about two and not after 5pm. With the alcohol side of it, if I'm traveling for work, there could be dinners and drinks but I'll stick to a few and call it quits by 10-11 o'clock when at home occasionally a beer or glass of wine.
Another big addition, more water. Now that I drink more water I just feel a lot better.
FWIW
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Does anyone else remember what the Discovery Channel and the Learning Channel were like back in the 90s? And then you look at the corrupted caricature that they are nowadays because someone concerned more about profits realized that dimwits don't like watching shows about how a nuclear reactor works, but boy howdy do they love shows about house flipping and aliens building the pyramids?
I don't want to see something else fall victim to that fate.
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yes, I do remember an age when discovery meant science information , maybe not the most in depth , but still pretty good
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Missed opportunity. If you had swapped out the word testicles for penises, you would have single-handedly ended sleep deprivation in men.
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If I start my week off with 5 hours of sleep, then get 8 hours every day after that, I won't feel 100% until Thursday or Friday. As an insomniac I'm very familiar with my sleep cycles and how they make me feel :/
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I can't help but wonder if the people predisposed to attending TED in person are the same people predisposed to the "hustle and grind / work hard play hard" lifestyle I long ago abandoned for these exact reasons.
Sleep is wonderful, a doctor telling me ten years ago to wake up at the same time every day, even on weekends, is probably one of the most impactful moments of my entire life.
But I'm keeping my rum and cokes
Sleep is wonderful, a doctor telling me ten years ago to wake up at the same time every day, even on weekends, is probably one of the most impactful moments of my entire life.
But I'm keeping my rum and cokes
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Your sarcasm is sure to win over any who would think otherwise. Your presumption that your singular physiology is somehow definitive enough that your solution should/would work for every person that struggles to sleep is frustrating at best. Good on you for knowing what works for *you* though!
As with all of the things that we *do* know about the multitudes of ways that human physiology operates along spectrums of physical, mental, and emotional functions, YMMV.
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Has anyone every measured the allostatic load incurred by people obsessing over the fact that their sleep hygiene is not perfect? I've known people whose ability to comfortably sleep seems to go down every time they learn a new tidbit about how not sleeping is killing them.
Meanwhile, we hear things like "wake up at the same the every day" like it's the only gospel, when our modern measure of time is an unnatural rhythm to which we are certainly not fully adapted (see - misery at DST changes and the resultant increase in car accidents after the change).
Like, this is all good advice, and the sentence "sleep is a non-negotiable biological necessity" is definitely going to become my new mantra when facing late-night temptation, but I can't help but feel the inner skeptic in my waking up.
Am I crazy?
Meanwhile, we hear things like "wake up at the same the every day" like it's the only gospel, when our modern measure of time is an unnatural rhythm to which we are certainly not fully adapted (see - misery at DST changes and the resultant increase in car accidents after the change).
Like, this is all good advice, and the sentence "sleep is a non-negotiable biological necessity" is definitely going to become my new mantra when facing late-night temptation, but I can't help but feel the inner skeptic in my waking up.
Am I crazy?
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Many people are looking for "hacks" -- sleep devices, schedules, essential oil diffusers, and so on. The main problem seems to be an accelerated lifestyle that doesn't leave enough space for the person. And also the feeling that space for the person is wasted time.
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A consistent schedule is a must. I go to bed the same time every night and wake up with no alarm clock as well. In bed by 11, asleep by midnight, up at 7-8 as well.
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I used to have immense difficulty going to sleep, wherein I couldn't shut my brain off and I would take 1-2 hours to go to sleep. I know from personal experience that overindulgence of alcohol will fuck with my sleep schedule royally. Anything approaching insomnia went away when I started exercising. Five seconds on googles finds links, including from Hopkins Medicine, CNN, and a NY Times blog post backing this up. But you are free to have a knee jerk response.
...Whatever helps you sleep at night.
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I agree sleep is very important and I notice how much better I feel when I get good sleep. But between work which is normally 8-6 plus an hour of commute each way, spending time with kids, and chores, plus basically being “online” for work 24/7, it just leaves no time for 8 hours of sleep. The problem is I consistently sleep about 5 hours, maybe 6 tops that I never really can sleep more than that even without an alarm. I usually only get more sleep if I’m really sick or slept less than 5 hours a night for a few days and feel like shit.
Modern lifestyles can be pretty shitty.
Modern lifestyles can be pretty shitty.
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Just a thought for anyone having trouble sleeping, who is not sure about why. I was recently tested in a sleep study, wires, imaging, the works. Turned out I was an extreme case, waking on average, 65 times an hour. I had had NO idea of this, just that I was not doing well and that I slept badly. I was prescribed a CPAP, and now average close to 7 to 9 hours a night, with about 1 or 2 wakings per hour. I feel hugely better after two months, and wish someone had followed this up earlier.
You might discuss this with your doctor as it was unnoticed in me for a long time. I still have other issues, but now I feel as if I might be able to deal with it all. Sleep does matter.
Edit: forgot the range of sleep time.
You might discuss this with your doctor as it was unnoticed in me for a long time. I still have other issues, but now I feel as if I might be able to deal with it all. Sleep does matter.
Edit: forgot the range of sleep time.
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The cultural problem is tough for being vulnerable to sabotage à la the "tragedy of the commons". It only takes a small number of people compromising their sleep to be more productive, or to at least appear more productive, to start setting a new and harsher standard for work-life balance. How many companies have thinly disguised a culture that favors this kind of self-sacrifice under the language of "fostering a competitive environment" or similar tales?
It's another way that unions, correctly managed, can prove to be invaluable. Aside from the usual things to do with collective bargaining, they can also curtail the undermining of the whole enterprise by restricting some of the more deleterious ways their members can compete with each other.
It's another way that unions, correctly managed, can prove to be invaluable. Aside from the usual things to do with collective bargaining, they can also curtail the undermining of the whole enterprise by restricting some of the more deleterious ways their members can compete with each other.
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I saw a sleep specialist who helped me greatly, and was surprised when he told me that as an adult I should *aim for only 7 hours sleep*. What I needed was to improve the quality of my sleep and my ability to be sleepy at bedtime. There is no single formula that works for all, but much of what was reported above is supported by sleep studies. The following is what works for me and might help you as a start:
Your bedroom is exclusively for sleep and sex--anything else at all, even reading before bed, happens elsewhere. Got to sleep at a time that allows for 7 hours sleep. Get up at the same time every single day unless sick, but get up within 10 minutes of waking whenever that is. As in the article, if I wake up in the night or can't fall asleep, get up, change rooms, and do some calming activity like reading (book, not screens) until I can sleep again, unless it's within an hour and a half of my get up time, then just stay up and reset the next night.
No work professional work five hours before target bedtime, and no screens except TV two hours before bed.
No caffeine after 10 AM and then only a little, and little to no alcohol, and then not after two hours before bed (that's based on how I react--your body is different so listen to your body). No naps or dozing (get up and move if drifting). Take an hour of exercise a day. Even then be realistic--life will happen and it won't always work out, so I take a 20 minute break with my eyes open but no activity and no phone, if I'm too tired to function. Think meditation.
I think, react, and feel so much better when I do the above, it makes me want to do it (no chore). While at first I didn't think I'd have time to keep to the regimen, I found that I got so much more done in a typical day, and my memory and thinking were so much more effective, that I had more time available to me than when I was tired and brute-forcing through the day (and I have four kids and work full time).
(Edited to fix some typos and make the times more general).
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MilanKraft
Ars Tribunus Angusticlavius
What the exercise guy said. I would bet more than 70% of the people who have persistent sleep issues have one of two variables present in their lives — minimal exercise, too much screen time at night — or both.
Exercise, along with a non-fad diet (i.e. all diets that are all one thing like all proteins, all veggie, whatever are 100% marketing bullshit, oops that's redundant) do a lot to put your body's biochemistry back in balance, which in turn does a lot to help you sleep at night.
The other thing I believe is that getting into a reasonably good routine, helps perpetuate your body's responses (i.e. "ok human time to go to sleep, time to wake up"). Put another way, caving in to douchebag bosses who expect you to answer emails in the middle of the night or on vacations, even if you try to sleep more on other nights, will make it near impossible to have good sleep over time.
Exercise, along with a non-fad diet (i.e. all diets that are all one thing like all proteins, all veggie, whatever are 100% marketing bullshit, oops that's redundant) do a lot to put your body's biochemistry back in balance, which in turn does a lot to help you sleep at night.
The other thing I believe is that getting into a reasonably good routine, helps perpetuate your body's responses (i.e. "ok human time to go to sleep, time to wake up"). Put another way, caving in to douchebag bosses who expect you to answer emails in the middle of the night or on vacations, even if you try to sleep more on other nights, will make it near impossible to have good sleep over time.
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Walker is also a big proponent of restoring a preindustrial "biphasic" sleep cycle - which is a really interesting idea. He talks about it in his book "Why We Sleep" book (excerpted here: https://delanceyplace.com/view-archives.php?p=3524)
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Isn't there an xkcd for this? Can't sleep 'cause somebody is wrong on the internet iirc.
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Great points. I would only add that the societal impulse to "keep up" worsens things. That if you're not always available, you're not good enough. That if you're not good enough, you suck. No middle ground. Feigned sympathy for others. Work harder. Work 3 jobs. You're replacement will do it otherwise. It's a perpetuation of insanity. I'm sure there are many others who espouse such notions.
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I have severe sleep apnea. In addition, I have children. These two things totally disrupted my sleep for the past 15 years.
I got to the point where I felt like I had the onset of dementia - I had no short-term memory to speak of, and I wasn't storing things in my long-term memory. There are whole years of time that are just *missing*. I have no recollection of them.
I got a CPAP machine, and it is remarkable how much better I sleep, and how much better my memory is.
Please, please, please - if you show the following symptoms, don't wait, get a sleep study done ASAP:
* Always feeling tired, even after a full night's sleep
* Falling asleep while driving, especially in the morning after a full night's sleep
* Memory loss, forgetfulness
* Waking up frequently in the middle of the night
I got to the point where I felt like I had the onset of dementia - I had no short-term memory to speak of, and I wasn't storing things in my long-term memory. There are whole years of time that are just *missing*. I have no recollection of them.
I got a CPAP machine, and it is remarkable how much better I sleep, and how much better my memory is.
Please, please, please - if you show the following symptoms, don't wait, get a sleep study done ASAP:
* Always feeling tired, even after a full night's sleep
* Falling asleep while driving, especially in the morning after a full night's sleep
* Memory loss, forgetfulness
* Waking up frequently in the middle of the night
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Was just going to post about this. So many people get wound up because they are awake in the middle of the night and can't get back to sleep, but it's actually natural. Get up and go do something until you feel sleepy again and sleep should come quick after a little while of wakefulness.
I have a sleep disorder, so all the exercise/restricting caffeine/cutting out TV/etc. stuff hasn't worked for me. But I do sleep better if I allow myself to be up for an hour or so after ~4 hours of sleep.
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Remember when people goofed on the History Channel for basically being the Hitler Channel? To think that was still a high water mark compared to what the History Channel is now.
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I worked on a sleep study, (did not do the scientific part) which essentially repeats this article. They though added a bit about this relating to hospital health care workers which made it scarier.
They do insane stuff with work hours there. No surprise that it’s better to be taken care of at the start of a shift than at the end.
They do insane stuff with work hours there. No surprise that it’s better to be taken care of at the start of a shift than at the end.
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Same here.
The symptom I wanted to address was debilitating fatigue and sleepiness for two to three hours after breakfast every day. I'm not a coffee drinker, so I didn't try to alleviate the symptom with caffeine.
I did a sleep study that recorded anomalous respiratory events for one night. Those included 229 episodes of apnea and hypopnea, averaging 28 seconds each, and 348 episodes of snoring (even though I sleep on my side).
The CPAP machine has greatly reduced my morning fatigue. I also seem to sleep through the night more often.
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I used to have immense difficulty going to sleep, wherein I couldn't shut my brain off and I would take 1-2 hours to go to sleep. I know from personal experience that overindulgence of alcohol will fuck with my sleep schedule royally. Anything approaching insomnia went away when I started exercising. Five seconds on googles finds links, including from Hopkins Medicine, CNN, and a NY Times blog post backing this up. But you are free to have a knee jerk response.
...Whatever helps you sleep at night.
At no point was I suggesting that what works for you is not a viable working theory for you or even the majority. If I'm having a "knee jerk response" it's because I know that even if your theory works for 98% of all people currently alive (though I'm being generous, I'm sure it's not that high), that means that it still doesn't work for 150 million people. That's a lot of people that you seem casually dismissive of.
I am one of those people, and so I do feel a negative reaction to your dismissive commentary. I do exercise for a multitude of reasons, usually at least an hour a day but sometimes as much as three hours a day, and I usually feel exhausted when I lay down at night; but that doesn't mean I always am able to fall asleep. Alcohol absolutely can interfere with my sleep, as can caffeine, but that's not to say that it definitely does all of the time. I don't think I have insomnia, I have never been diagnosed with it. I just tend to gravitate towards a natural circadian rhythm that wants to sleep at sunrise and wake up around 11am-noon.
As most jobs require a schedule that does not permit me that schedule I rely on habitually trying to sleep 7-8 hours before I have to be awake. No matter how long I'm on this sleep schedule I have always drifted away from it when I'm not required to be on it. My brain simply does not shut off at sundown (and no, it isn't because of blue light or electronic screens, as I've taken measures to eliminate those things).
When did Ars start rewarding this mindset of "well, this popular correlation worked for me, therefore it MUST be causally true for everyone!"?
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