Waymo gets green light from California DMV: AVs in some cities are ok

What will cars do if they don't know what to do? Apparently, stop until they do.

Read the whole story

 

[david newall]

See, Tesla, that's what you do?

 

[freedfromdeath]

There will be waymo self driving cars in CA now.

 

[eathdemon]

we are getting closer. in 2015 I guessed 2025 for full market avalability, and that guess seems to be right on the money. they will test in those cities for a year or 2, than move to LA/SF. if no major issues 2025 seems right.

 

[frazing]

There will be waymo self driving cars in CA now.

Well, its a very small (very crowded) area around Google headquarters. They have been testing there for years, and the maps of those streets are probably the most up to date and highest resolution in the world.

 

[Drizzt321]

When I see them, fully autonomous, driving through LA street traffic, with all the idiots that normally apply, that will be a very fine day. Without a safety driver.

 

[dtich]

There will be waymo self driving cars in CA now.

Nice summary.

 

[Fearknot]

"If a Waymo vehicle comes across a situation it doesn't understand, it does what any good driver would do: comes to a safe stop until it does understand how to proceed," Waymo continued in a press release. "For our cars, that means following well-established protocols, which include contacting Waymo fleet and rider support for help in resolving the issue."

What kind of control does Waymo fleet and rider support have? How do they explain things to the car? Do they drive it remotely?

 

[frazing]

"If a Waymo vehicle comes across a situation it doesn't understand, it does what any good driver would do: comes to a safe stop until it does understand how to proceed," Waymo continued in a press release. "For our cars, that means following well-established protocols, which include contacting Waymo fleet and rider support for help in resolving the issue."

What kind of control does Waymo fleet and rider support have? How do they explain things to the car? Do they drive it remotely?

Yes, I believe that's the way it works. They have been testing in Chandler AZ for over a year. They have an Operations Center, with technicians watching the cars, and helping navigate issues, like road construction.

It would be interesting to read a report summarizing their experience so far. It would also help Californians know what to expect.

 

[Lysergic]

There will be waymo self driving cars in CA now.

Well, its a very small (very crowded) area around Google headquarters. They have been testing there for years, and the maps of those streets are probably the most up to date and highest resolution in the world.

I see about 10 of these a day on my commute. Never seen one without a person in it. Can’t wait

 

[lolmuly]

There will be waymo self driving cars in CA now.

Well, its a very small (very crowded) area around Google headquarters. They have been testing there for years, and the maps of those streets are probably the most up to date and highest resolution in the world.

I think you mean" most highly optimized in the world", not "highest resolution in the world". When you're dealing with path calculations through 3D data in real time, you want highly acurate, highly efficient geometry. Having more resolution than you need is counter-productive

 

[Lysergic]

This one time I was driving home after working late at Adobe. I ran into a weird situation on highway 280: no other cars at all across 5 lanes of traffic. So I kept on driving like usual. When I looked down I saw with a fright an extraordinary sight: I was doing 30 in a 65. I stepped on the gas and started to regale with my bizarre tale of highway fail.

Dude 280 has an effective minimum of 80 MPH. You were WAY under.

 

[Electroniclog]

Progress

 

[Azethoth666]

There will be waymo self driving cars in CA now.

Well, its a very small (very crowded) area around Google headquarters. They have been testing there for years, and the maps of those streets are probably the most up to date and highest resolution in the world.

I think you mean" most highly optimized in the world", not "highest resolution in the world". When you're dealing with path calculations through 3D data in real time, you want highly acurate, highly efficient geometry. Having more resolution than you need is counter-productive

As long as it can move in a forward direction without crashing I am happy. Well ok, at better than normal human competence as well.

 

[Azethoth666]

This one time I was driving home after working late at Adobe. I ran into a weird situation on highway 280: no other cars at all across 5 lanes of traffic. So I kept on driving like usual. When I looked down I saw with a fright an extraordinary sight: I was doing 30 in a 65. I stepped on the gas and started to regale with my bizarre tale of highway fail.

Dude 280 has an effective minimum of 80 MPH. You were WAY under.

I know, and 880 is even faster. I am usually doing 80-95, but relative to other traffic and almost never looking at the speedometer. As the only car on the highway I was concerned that radar would accurately clock me and nobody else would be to blame. But fatigue and no references = way too slow.

It’s the kind of failure a self driving car would never suffer from though, so there is that.

 

[citpeks]

My encounters with the driver-monitored Waymo vans have always been benign.

They're easy to spot, and behave predictably, adhering to speed limits and using their signals.

Which makes them less of a perceived danger than most human drivers, who can be erratic and inattentive.

 

[MaxArt]

There will be waymo self driving cars in CA now.

And we'll be seeing waymo of these puns, as usual.

 

[darkteflon]

Bring it on. We need to get these crazy meat sacks out from behind the wheel as soon as possible.

 

[Rrr7]

My encounters with the driver-monitored Waymo vans have always been benign.

They're easy to spot, and behave predictably, adhering to speed limits and [r]using their signals.[/r]

Which makes them less of a perceived danger than most human drivers, who can be erratic and inattentive.

THIS ^^

Can't wait for the day when most cars on the road use turn signals!!

I clearly remember 4-5 years ago driving on 94 through Michigan and seeing a local Sheriff's cruiser use turn signals EVERY TIME he changed lanes. Never before or after that time have I seen another 'law enforcement' agent use turn signals the way they're supposed to.

How could we expect them to enforce rules they have no idea about??

 

[Einstein76]

My encounters with the driver-monitored Waymo vans have always been benign.

They're easy to spot, and behave predictably, adhering to speed limits and [r]using their signals.[/r]

Which makes them less of a perceived danger than most human drivers, who can be erratic and inattentive.

THIS ^^

Can't wait for the day when most cars on the road use turn signals!!

I clearly remember 4-5 years ago driving on 94 through Michigan and seeing a local Sheriff's cruiser use turn signals EVERY TIME he changed lanes. Never before or after that time have I seen another 'law enforcement' agent use turn signals the way they're supposed to.

How could we expect them to enforce rules they have no idea about??

The only explanation I can think of is that most people think turn signal laws are about giving fines rather than showing your intentions to the other drivers around you. The few people I do see use them turn them on as they begin their turn which entirely defeats the purpose.

 

[Rrr7]

My encounters with the driver-monitored Waymo vans have always been benign.

They're easy to spot, and behave predictably, adhering to speed limits and [r]using their signals.[/r]

Which makes them less of a perceived danger than most human drivers, who can be erratic and inattentive.

THIS ^^

Can't wait for the day when most cars on the road use turn signals!!

I clearly remember 4-5 years ago driving on 94 through Michigan and seeing a local Sheriff's cruiser use turn signals EVERY TIME he changed lanes. Never before or after that time have I seen another 'law enforcement' agent use turn signals the way they're supposed to.

How could we expect them to enforce rules they have no idea about??

The only explanation I can think of is that most people think turn signal laws are about giving fines rather than showing your intentions to the other drivers around you. The few people I do see use them turn them on as they begin their turn which entirely defeats the purpose.

Actually I think it'd be great if people would in fact get fines for not signaling.
..or for not turning on their headlights at night, especially on the highway, or for turning from the wrong lane, or for any other stupid shit they do in attempts to kill others or themselves on the roads. Couple of tickets might make them remember and pay attention and drive better.

The reality is the only tickets cops can be bothered with are speeding tickets, nevermind stuff that's really unsafe and dangerous.

 

[jdale]

"If a Waymo vehicle comes across a situation it doesn't understand, it does what any good driver would do: comes to a safe stop until it does understand how to proceed,"

Meanwhile in another article....

Most emergency braking systems on the market today won't stop for stationary objects at freeway speeds.

I'm sure nothing could possibly go wrong.

 

[t_newt]

I live/work in these cities and have been watching these cars driving around for years. They started with a pod car that didn't even have a steering wheel! (but couldn't go faster than 25MPH), so these cities are well used to this. They have really stepped up on the use of these vans lately--I always see at least a couple driving around every single day on my commute. Now I know why.

So what has changed? Now there won't have to be a person in the car to monitor the driving. I'm looking forward to seeing these driving around without anyone in the car. It sounds like it will still be a while before the public is allowed to ride these, at least in California (I'm jealous of Arizona).

edit add: I very occasionally see Apple's self driving van driving around too. Looks like they are still up to something, but who knows how far they'll go with it.

 

[Statistical]

"If a Waymo vehicle comes across a situation it doesn't understand, it does what any good driver would do: comes to a safe stop until it does understand how to proceed,"

Meanwhile in another article....

Most emergency braking systems on the market today won't stop for stationary objects at freeway speeds.

I'm sure nothing could possibly go wrong.

Waymo has full lidar array it can detect stationary objects. The hard part for OEM building AEBs is how to do with without $120,000 in lidar gear per car.

 

[A.I.R.Specialist]

When the pods first started appearing downtown Mountain View 4-5 years back, I was taking a break out at Castro street and Dana (downtown) Mountain View, spot one going west on Dana to cross Castro with NO ONE INSIDE! So me and this other random guy are watching it cross Castro, it’s gets across and up pops a head in the car. The guy had ducked down just messin’ with us. Trickster activities.

 

[FlyingSteamGoat]

My encounters with the driver-monitored Waymo vans have always been benign.

They're easy to spot, and behave predictably, adhering to speed limits and [r]using their signals.[/r]

Which makes them less of a perceived danger than most human drivers, who can be erratic and inattentive.

THIS ^^

Can't wait for the day when most cars on the road use turn signals!!

I clearly remember 4-5 years ago driving on 94 through Michigan and seeing a local Sheriff's cruiser use turn signals EVERY TIME he changed lanes. Never before or after that time have I seen another 'law enforcement' agent use turn signals the way they're supposed to.

How could we expect them to enforce rules they have no idea about??

The only explanation I can think of is that most people think turn signal laws are about giving fines rather than showing your intentions to the other drivers around you. The few people I do see use them turn them on as they begin their turn which entirely defeats the purpose.

In a town not so very far from where this testing is being performed, use of turn signals is interpreted as weakness, to be punished by merciless hazing. Robots will find this very difficult to deal with.

 

[althaz]

My encounters with the driver-monitored Waymo vans have always been benign.

They're easy to spot, and behave predictably, adhering to speed limits and [r]using their signals.[/r]

Which makes them less of a perceived danger than most human drivers, who can be erratic and inattentive.

THIS ^^

Can't wait for the day when most cars on the road use turn signals!!

I clearly remember 4-5 years ago driving on 94 through Michigan and seeing a local Sheriff's cruiser use turn signals EVERY TIME he changed lanes. Never before or after that time have I seen another 'law enforcement' agent use turn signals the way they're supposed to.

How could we expect them to enforce rules they have no idea about??

The only explanation I can think of is that most people think turn signal laws are about giving fines rather than showing your intentions to the other drivers around you. The few people I do see use them turn them on as they begin their turn which entirely defeats the purpose.

Actually I think it'd be great if people would in fact get fines for not signaling.
..or for not turning on their headlights at night, especially on the highway, or for turning from the wrong lane, or for any other stupid shit they do in attempts to kill others or themselves on the roads. Couple of tickets might make them remember and pay attention and drive better.

The reality is the only tickets cops can be bothered with are speeding tickets, nevermind stuff that's really unsafe and dangerous.

Can people not get tickets for these things where you live? Seems absurd tbh. They aren't super-strictly enforced where I live (Australia), but you can be booked for not signalling and you *will* be booked for driving without your headlights.

 

[facw]

Can people not get tickets for these things where you live? Seems absurd tbh. They aren't super-strictly enforced where I live (Australia), but you can be booked for not signalling and you *will* be booked for driving without your headlights.

They can be ticketed, but they probably won't be. Especially for not using turn signals (the police are as bad about not using them as everyone else). Having your headlights off at night is more likely to get you pulled over, but it's definitely not uncommon to see people without them on in well-lit areas.

 

[LordOfTheMorning]

Does Waymo have infrared sensors underneath the car like a Roomba? One of my fears is falling into some hole (can be due to construction) or some cliff or stairs. Also operating in an imperfect world can it detect constructions even without a safety barrier. For example, a construction worker is cementing a part of some road and did not put up barriers in time. Can it detect that the section of road is not fully solid?

 

[jdale]

"If a Waymo vehicle comes across a situation it doesn't understand, it does what any good driver would do: comes to a safe stop until it does understand how to proceed,"

Meanwhile in another article....

Most emergency braking systems on the market today won't stop for stationary objects at freeway speeds.

I'm sure nothing could possibly go wrong.

Waymo has full lidar array it can detect stationary objects. The hard part for OEM building AEBs is how to do with without $120,000 in lidar gear per car.

Waymo's lidar array doesn't help if the Waymo car is stopped and the car that's in motion can't detect it.

 

[unequivocal]

"If a Waymo vehicle comes across a situation it doesn't understand, it does what any good driver would do: comes to a safe stop until it does understand how to proceed," Waymo continued in a press release. "For our cars, that means following well-established protocols, which include contacting Waymo fleet and rider support for help in resolving the issue."

What kind of control does Waymo fleet and rider support have? How do they explain things to the car? Do they drive it remotely?

I don't know for sure about Waymo, but that's how Starsky does it - remote drivers handle the complicated parts of a trip. So it seems reasonable that Waymo could remotely pilot their vehicles in challenging or confusing circumstances.

 

[AxMi-24]

we are getting closer. in 2015 I guessed 2025 for full market avalability, and that guess seems to be right on the money. they will test in those cities for a year or 2, than move to LA/SF. if no major issues 2025 seems right.

We are nowhere near it. Testing is done in optimal conditions. That is far from actual self-driving in all conditions or even in conditions present in a large number of cities on the planet (i.e. snow to begin with).

 

[LastObelus]

It's really a shame that so many manufacturers have wasted so much time and money and thinking and engineering on autonomous vehicles despite being warned over and over again by many Very Smart Dudes that it will be impossible to give computers the Magical Intelligence that allows humans to drive in snow.

 

[ApproTechGeek]

Testing outside the USA is not only done under optimal conditions. For example, Oxbotica has cars out in narrow twisty lanes and congested town high streets in Oxfordshire.

 

[LastObelus]

In a town not so very far from where this testing is being performed, use of turn signals is interpreted as weakness, to be punished by merciless hazing. Robots will find this very difficult to deal with.

Huh? No they won't. They'll just drive around. They don't know or care whether you're "hazing" them. Perhaps for fun someone will've programmed them to post video of people behaving unusually to the internet, and you'll make a fool of yourself to other humans, but the car won't care.

 

[Cloudgazer]

In a town not so very far from where this testing is being performed, use of turn signals is interpreted as weakness, to be punished by merciless hazing. Robots will find this very difficult to deal with.

Huh? No they won't. They'll just drive around. They don't know or care whether you're "hazing" them. Perhaps for fun someone will've programmed them to post video of people behaving unusually to the internet, and you'll make a fool of yourself to other humans, but the car won't care.

I assume he meant the lack of indicating would be hard to deal with, not the mockery.

 

[Boneman69]

I can't wait to see one at a gas station. How is it going to get gas?

 

[veldrin]

Testing outside the USA is not only done under optimal conditions. For example, Oxbotica has cars out in narrow twisty lanes and congested town high streets in Oxfordshire.

Nor is testing inside the USA done only under optimal conditions. (Even assuming the data that Tesla supposedly collects from cars they have sold doesn't count as "testing") The omnipresent trolls and negative nancys just either haven't heard of the test cars operated by many companies in various four season states or are having selective memory.

Most likely the latter since there are a couple of prominent companies testing primarily in northern cities.