Jericho may have been spared the chopping block for seven more episodes, but CBS has a message for fans of the show: watch it live if you want to see it survive. According to execs, DVRs are hurting the show.<BR><BR>Read More
Struggling Jericho: please don't TiVo our show!
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They can kiss my butt. I like Jericho, but I don't like ANY show enough to watch it live any more. Besides, I am not their target anyway. I am less likely to buy anything I see advertised, not the opposite. If they didn't constantly shove ads down my throat everywhere I turn it might be different. <BR><BR>For the record advertisers: Your ads almost always suck, they are annoying, obnoxious and there are just too damn many of them. They are like cockroaches. When you watch a show and over 1/3rd of the time is spent on commercials thats just too damn much.
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Tempus --)-------
Ars Tribunus Militum
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TandooriBone:<BR>Funny. About a year ago, I did a two week survey for Nielsen. They contacted me specifically BECAUSE I am a DVR household. They wanted to know what shows I typically recorded.<BR><BR>So yeah, this is complete bullshit. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Been there and filled out that diary... and yeah they saw me do things like watch something I'd recorded two or three weeks before.. <BR><BR>They also saw me watch the same DirtyJobs show 3 times that week because my 6 year old loves it and kept asking for it over and over when he got a chance to choose what to watch.. <BR><BR>Of course I think they also saw me watch 1 or maybe 2 hours total of 'network' (abc/nbc/cbs/fox) TV during the entire week.. <BR><BR>My TIVO is doing little to kill network tv.. I'd blame that much more on the crap they put, can't compete (at least for my eyeballs) with what's on discovery/tlc/history/scifi/science/nat-geo etc.. Battlestar on Scifi is better than ANYTHING on the tranditional networks, and Hell they can't even compete with the FOOD network for cristsake.. even Iron Chef is better than 90% of what the oldschool networks want to show me..
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zsouthboy:<BR>I'm gonna guess that DVRs/etc are simply being used as an excuse to give the networks less money for ad spots.<BR><BR>Not that I particularly care, but it just seems that way from my point of view. The advertisers finally have something to push back on the networks about, so they're using it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Me, I'm guessing that zsouthboy has it down cold. Nielsen is a dinosaur.
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What I think is getting lost here is that CBS <I>did</I> cancel the show. Gone. Kaput. Then, they <I>changed their minds</I> (how often does that happen?) and agreed to bring it back due almost entirely to the online efforts of people like us who love the show.<BR><BR>Is it <I>that</I> wrong for them to say to that same audience: "Hey, if we bring back this show that you want so bad like you asked, for free, do you mind helping us pay for it?"<BR><BR>Because if the answer is yes, than I guarantee you this will be the last time a network brings back a canceled show based on Internet fan support. And that would suck, because I for one would like to see more <I>Jericho</I> and less <I>Desperate Temptation Survivor Island</I> on the air.<BR><BR>The person who said this, Nina Tassler, is the head of CBS Entertainment, not the CBS corporation. She's the one who funds shows, and she's out there telling Jericho fans how she gets the money she needs to fund their show.<BR><BR>Sure, broadcast TV execs are out of touch. Sure, the Nielsens are about the dumbest possible way to measure viewership and set advertising rates. Sure putting it on hiatus for three months in the middle of the season was just as dumb as running it against the most popular show on TV.<BR><BR>But, even so, that's the system we've got, and that's the system that funds this particular show. The premise of asking people who want this show to work within the existing system to help make it succeed is neither absurd nor asinine.<BR><BR>With great power comes great responsibility, people. If you want the power to bring a show back, you have the responsibility to make the show work for the people paying for it.<BR><BR>Please, please, please, don't send networks the message that the reward for listening to their viewers for once is "CBS can lick my balls."
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chuckstar:<BR>It's hardly CBS's fault that the advertisers prefer live viewers. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>This is the part I still don't quite understand. We keep reading about advertisers (or at least ad agencies) saying things like "only live viewers are worth paying for" or "only viewers within 24 hours...", or 3 days, or whatever.<BR><BR>Okay, I've got a question. If advertisers really believe that, why the hell do they keep paying to have that same exact ad shown a month or two later?<BR><BR>Think about the ads you've seen. Don't even confine it to "recently." Think about the last decade or more. What percentage of ads are for a timed event? It's not very high, especially if you exclude the networks' ads for their own shows. Sure, there are the occasional ads for a business having a holiday weekend sale, but those are really few and far between overall. Hell, probably the most common time-limited sale ads are car and truck promotions, and again if you exclude the holiday weekend thing and actually pay attention to the sale dates, those promotions tend to run for at least a month.<BR><BR>Flat out, most ads simply promote a product, or even just a brand. Ad agencies like to be able to try to correlate a change in sales with the beginning of a new ad campaign because it helps them justify their fees to the companies that actually make and sell the products, but in the end it doesn't really make any real difference to Giant Corporation X whether the ad makes you try their brand of diapers tomorrow or a month from now. Hell, even if you make the decision tonight after seeing their ad live, it may be a couple of weeks before your stock gets low enough that diapers make it onto your shopping list.<BR><BR>Makes me wonder whether the whole "only live viewers" thing isn't really just a smoke screen for the real agenda of not wanting people to use DVRs to fast-forward or skip through ads, similar to how the music and movie industries use piracy as a smoke screen to move toward their own business goals.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by arsbernard:<BR>I don't believe the problem is ratings as much as its that as the article states, DVR viewers only watch half the commercials of Live viewers. (and I think half is generous) </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I really have to wonder about the validity of that number. On the rare occasions when I watch a program "live" these days, I do the exact same things during a commercial that I did before TiVo existed, which are the exact same things that people all over the country did for decades. I go to the kitchen to grab a snack or refill my drink. I go to the bathroom. I <STRIKE>annoy</STRIKE> play with the cat. I talk to my girlfriend. Or I change the channel and might or might not come back.<BR><BR>So I have trouble believing that half of the commercial time on "live" network television actually involves people staring raptly at the screen.
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The actor that quoted this is indeed full of shit. Come on... this is based on a quote from a TV actor... not a TV or advertising executive.<BR><BR>I know for a fact that Neilsen monitors DVR usage for many cable companies and satellite providers. They know exactly what shows are being DVR'd, when they're being watched vs. their broadcast time, and even what commercials you fast forward through vs. ones that you watch. DVR viewership is not some "black hole" in the advertising industry.<BR><BR>I personally know people that work at Neilsen and have been at their HQ many times. If you watch the video playing in their lobby that talks about the history of Neilsen, it tells you all of the above right there.<BR><BR>All of these metrics provided by Neilsen are currently being used today in the TV advertising world to help determine which air time is more valuable. One show might have ratings higher than another, but if those ratings have a high percentage of DVR viewership, from an advertising perspective it's actually worth less than the air time of the lesser show. Mr. Fisher already alludes to all of this with his "According to Neilsen..." quote.
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It seems to me that the whole business model relying on advertisements is in jeopardy, because it's harder to sell to people who have choices and are not willing corporate slaves.<BR><BR>Yet a site like Google has had success using advertising, because their adwords are not intrusive to the point of driving people away. Basically these folks in TV land have gotten so greedy that their advertising space and commercials are taking up like 30% of the show time length, which is greedy. It's gotten to the point that people don't even want to watch TV anymore.
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Until I built a computer with MythTV, I watched <I>maybe</I> an hour of TV a week. Now I watch quite a bit, but I almost never see the commercials. If DVR's somehow became outlawed, I'd go back to not watching TV.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by arsbernard:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I pay for the entertainment and the DVR was entertained at that time. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>If you didn't buy a product that was advertised during the show, you didn't pay for anything. -so you can't expect anything either. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>At $1,200/year for cable access to the channels, you would be way off base with this assessment.<BR><BR>They get paid to entertain me, and I expect that entertainment on my schedule and not theirs. The technology exists, if they don't want me to use it then I can save $1,200/year and go full time Netflix where I completely avoid commercials, while saving the cable fee.<BR><BR>They are in competition with all of the other entertainment options, and they will have to mature into the marketplace or leave it in bankruptcy. I couldn't care less which option they take.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Please, please, please, don't send networks the message that the reward for listening to their viewers for once is "CBS can lick my balls." </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Please. This is ArsTechnica; grand bastion of consumerism. They want their stuff exactly the way they want it, and the world must conform to what they want or to hell with them.<BR><BR>Don't expect anyone in this forum to understand the word "compromise" or understand the concept of "trade off".
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I wonder if this means that they will take the shows off their web page. You have always been able to watch every single Jericho episode for free, a few days after it aired on cbs.com. This is in fact, the only way I have ever watched this show.
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CBS invents the news, why don't they just invent some viewers? <BR><BR>Seriously, one reason networks like people to watch live is because you're supposedly more likely to watch whatever crap follows the show you want to see. (They've obviously not seen my wife with a remote. Ditto for commercials.) <BR><BR>Having never seen an episode (or even heard of) Jericho, or for that matter American Idol, I have to ask: What's the deal with the peanuts?
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Chuckstar:<BR>It's hardly CBS's fault that the advertisers prefer live viewers. <BR><BR>CBS <I>is</I> in the process of embracing new business models. Those models just haven't gotten far enough along to save Jericho. If you'll notice, they are not asking people to stop Tivoing, they are simply asking people who want to save Jericho to stop Tivoing Jericho. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>This is the only reasonable post I've read in this thread so far.
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I watched teh series hoping after the 4th episode it would get back on track and deal with life post nucler attack. It didn't get better until it stopped dealing with who likes who and unimportant crap like that and dealing with what the first few episodes dealt with. IF it's going to be more soap opera crap then I say let the show stay dead.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RPGSpree:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by primortal:<BR>On another topic. How do advertising companies tell when there product was purchased based on when a commercial is aired? </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>They don't, which shows how retarded the whole thing can be. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>The Nielsen company also offers POS retail measurement. Anything with a barcode can be tracked. After an ad airs, Nielsen can track the advertised product (I think the typical timeframe is a week) and report back. This is how advertisers know if an ad was effective or not.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">But, even so, that's the system we've got, and that's the system that funds this particular show. The premise of asking people who want this show to work within the existing system to help make it succeed is neither absurd nor asinine.<BR><BR>With great power comes great responsibility, people. If you want the power to bring a show back, you have the responsibility to make the show work for the people paying for it.<BR><BR>Please, please, please, don't send networks the message that the reward for listening to their viewers for once is "CBS can lick my balls." </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>++<BR><BR>(and I've never watched Jericho. But I'd have liked FireFly for a few more seasons.)
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Yet a site like Google has had success using advertising, because their adwords are not intrusive to the point of driving people away. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I suspect that Google has had success more because it targets the ads than because they're less intrusive. That's half the reason people don't want to watch TV ads: They're obscenely boring, because they're advertising things I would <I>never</I> buy. I don't need diabetes medication, makeup, feminine hygiene products, diapers or weight loss pills. <BR><BR>To be honest, I don't think I'm alone in wishing they would just do what HBO does. I would gladly pay a few bucks a month to have the HD versions of network channels broadcast commercial free, and I suspect many others would too. For that matter, package this "service" with the HD DVR service and I think you've got a winner from all sides.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fxds:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by arsbernard:<BR>I don't believe the problem is ratings as much as its that as the article states, DVR viewers only watch half the commercials of Live viewers. (and I think half is generous) </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I really have to wonder about the validity of that number. On the rare occasions when I watch a program "live" these days, I do the exact same things during a commercial that I did before TiVo existed, which are the exact same things that people all over the country did for decades. I go to the kitchen to grab a snack or refill my drink. I go to the bathroom. I <STRIKE>annoy</STRIKE> play with the cat. I talk to my girlfriend. Or I change the channel and might or might not come back.<BR><BR>So I have trouble believing that half of the commercial time on "live" network television actually involves people staring raptly at the screen. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Saying that DVR viewers watch half the commericals of Live viewers doesn't mean that Live viewers watch 100%.<BR><BR>Perhaps Live viewers watch 20% of the commercials and DVR viewers watch 10%. 10% is half of 20%.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Traddy:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by arsbernard:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I pay for the entertainment and the DVR was entertained at that time. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>If you didn't buy a product that was advertised during the show, you didn't pay for anything. -so you can't expect anything either. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>At $1,200/year for cable access to the channels, you would be way off base with this assessment.<BR><BR>They get paid to entertain me, and I expect that entertainment on my schedule and not theirs. The technology exists, if they don't want me to use it then I can save $1,200/year and go full time Netflix where I completely avoid commercials, while saving the cable fee.<BR><BR>They are in competition with all of the other entertainment options, and they will have to mature into the marketplace or leave it in bankruptcy. I couldn't care less which option they take. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Except for HBO, you pay $1200 for the cable access, not for the shows. <BR><BR>Are you mad at Ars if a thread isn't entertaining because you pay maybe $500/year for internet access?
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I wish we could pay for the channels we wanted. Paying crazy prices for over 200 channels of which you may really watch 5 is crazy.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by arsbernard:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I pay for the entertainment and the DVR was entertained at that time. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>If you didn't buy a product that was advertised during the show, you didn't pay for anything. -so you can't expect anything either. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>It's MY time. I have the choice not to watch. I have every right to demand my expectations be met.
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<blockquote class="ip-ubbcode-quote">
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div>
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by werepossum:<br>Having never seen an episode (or even heard of) Jericho, or for that matter American Idol, I have to ask: What's the deal with the peanuts? </div>
</blockquote>
<br><br>In the last episode, one of the characters recounts the story of World War II, where Germans ordered the General of the 101st Airborne Division to surrender at Bastogne, where they were hopelessly outnumbered and outgunned. General McAuliffe's reply: "Nuts!" <br><br>Later that episode, the lead character is ordered to give up and accept defeat. His reply: "Nuts!"<br><br>After the show was canceled, CBS said they were sorry it was canceled, but that's life. Fans' reply: "Nuts!"<br><br>It was a clever protest but I have to believe the nut-seller who instigated it made a killing from the fans.<br><br><blockquote class="ip-ubbcode-quote">
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div>
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by arsbernard:<br>I've never watched Jericho. But I'd have liked FireFly for a few more seasons. </div>
</blockquote>
<br><br>I accidentally/subconsciously wrote "Firefly" instead of "Jericho" in my earlier post in one spot. -- View image here: http://episteme.meincmagazine.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif -- It sucks that Firefly was canceled, but I don't care, I'm still free... you can't take the sky from me!<br><br><blockquote class="ip-ubbcode-quote">
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div>
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alfonse:<br>They want their stuff exactly the way they want it, and the world must conform to what they want or to hell with them. </div>
</blockquote>
<br><br>So I see.
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div>
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by werepossum:<br>Having never seen an episode (or even heard of) Jericho, or for that matter American Idol, I have to ask: What's the deal with the peanuts? </div>
</blockquote>
<br><br>In the last episode, one of the characters recounts the story of World War II, where Germans ordered the General of the 101st Airborne Division to surrender at Bastogne, where they were hopelessly outnumbered and outgunned. General McAuliffe's reply: "Nuts!" <br><br>Later that episode, the lead character is ordered to give up and accept defeat. His reply: "Nuts!"<br><br>After the show was canceled, CBS said they were sorry it was canceled, but that's life. Fans' reply: "Nuts!"<br><br>It was a clever protest but I have to believe the nut-seller who instigated it made a killing from the fans.<br><br><blockquote class="ip-ubbcode-quote">
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div>
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by arsbernard:<br>I've never watched Jericho. But I'd have liked FireFly for a few more seasons. </div>
</blockquote>
<br><br>I accidentally/subconsciously wrote "Firefly" instead of "Jericho" in my earlier post in one spot. -- View image here: http://episteme.meincmagazine.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif -- It sucks that Firefly was canceled, but I don't care, I'm still free... you can't take the sky from me!<br><br><blockquote class="ip-ubbcode-quote">
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div>
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alfonse:<br>They want their stuff exactly the way they want it, and the world must conform to what they want or to hell with them. </div>
</blockquote>
<br><br>So I see.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Wooda:<BR>And interestingly, at least on Comcast, Jericho is made available, for free, on-demand for a limited time starting the day after it airs. So I don't even have to DVR it CBS, you make it available advertisement free for me already. THANKS! </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>I watched about half the episodes this way. And no, they weren't ad free. Most of the comcast stuff has an ad or three thrown in the middle. I remember seeing a ton of Silverado ads this spring watching On Demand.
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I want a nissan versa.<BR><BR>Er.. wait a second. What the hell IS a Nissan Versa?<BR><BR>...<BR><BR>We CAN always go back to the 'beginning of TV time' advertiser sponsored primary content model of TV. Where it's just (politely, barely) mixed in to the primary content of the show.<BR><BR>Or product placements.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alfonse:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Please, please, please, don't send networks the message that the reward for listening to their viewers for once is "CBS can lick my balls." </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Please. This is ArsTechnica; grand bastion of consumerism. They want their stuff exactly the way they want it </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Hell yes! And that's the way every rational consumer should behave.<BR><BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"><BR>and the world must conform to what they want or to hell with them. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>This bit is not true. There are plenty of people over here who are self-confessed <insert item here whores>, be they Apple fans or Nintendo fans or Sony Ericsson fans, etc.<BR><BR>In the particular case of Jericho, mose people on this thread don't care all that much for it. Why the hell should they aquiesce to a network's demands for a show they only marginally care about? The network's request isn't entirely unreasonable, but If Jericho doesn't have enough fans who'll do whatever it takes to keep it afloat, then it deserves to go to the TV Land graveyard. I'm not interested in avoiding sending the 'wrong signals' just for the sake of a few random dudes who like Jericho.
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Prediction:<BR><BR>Eventually, production studios will figure out that the only way to make ad money in the days of TiVo is to embed ads in strategic places in the content periodically, leaving the content uninterrupted. A solid 30 or 60 minutes of TV show, every time.<BR><BR>Also, count me as another random dude who really likes Jericho.<BR>Then (ready for this?) you can buy the DVD of the series... ad-free.
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I wonder if they count iTunes revenue. I can't get American TV (I don't even own a TV, even if I could). I did, however, buy BSG off iTunes to vote with my money for a good show. Never seen Jericho, so I have no idea if it is any good, but you can buy it on iTunes.
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I'm not understanding how tivo customers don't count.<BR>In order to record a show, doesn't the tuner have to be tuned in to that show?<BR>And, if the tuner is tuned in, how do they know if you are watching it or just recording it?
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How do they know if the show was watched live or recorded to be played back later? The tuner will still have to be on the channel for the entire program for it to be recorded. The system doesn't know if the TV was left on and nobody was on the couch or if it was recorded, to be played back later. Unless I'm misunderstanding how thier monitoring works, this just sounds completely bogus.
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They need to change the way they determine viewership of shows to include DVRs.<BR><BR>I TiVo my shows and almost never fast forward the commercials (unless I'm short on time) because I'm just too lazy to do that.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DeltaFive:<BR>FWIW, Jericho was a terrible show. Not enough leather chaps with roving bands of mohawked bikers killing everyone and too much high school drama. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Hmm. I need to add leather chaps to my disaster preparation kit.
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I agree, let Jericho die already. They should look toward Heros for how to really do up a sci-fi series. Enough plot development and action to keep you interested each show, while holding just enough back to make you want more.<BR><BR>What's sad is I really liked that show when it first came out.. but it quickly took a detour through boringville.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by arsbernard:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Traddy:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by arsbernard:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I pay for the entertainment and the DVR was entertained at that time. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>If you didn't buy a product that was advertised during the show, you didn't pay for anything. -so you can't expect anything either. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>At $1,200/year for cable access to the channels, you would be way off base with this assessment.<BR><BR>They get paid to entertain me, and I expect that entertainment on my schedule and not theirs. The technology exists, if they don't want me to use it then I can save $1,200/year and go full time Netflix where I completely avoid commercials, while saving the cable fee.<BR><BR>They are in competition with all of the other entertainment options, and they will have to mature into the marketplace or leave it in bankruptcy. I couldn't care less which option they take. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Except for HBO, you pay $1200 for the cable access, not for the shows. <BR><BR>Are you mad at Ars if a thread isn't entertaining because you pay maybe $500/year for internet access? </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Whats the fucking problem? If you love the system then you support it. I support it if and when I feel like it.<BR><BR>Furthermore, each and every station receives their cut of my monthly cable bill. They are paid for the right to broadcast their stuff in Canada. The commercials are extra over the cable bill.<BR><BR>Once I can select only the 3 or 4 channels I care about then that is all I will pay for. I will record and watch it as I see fit, and as I am permitted under the laws of Canada.<BR><BR>Frankly, there is a good chance that I watch a good show twice when I recorded it. As such, there is a chance I watch twice as much commercials.<BR><BR>So, how about you get your ass off the fucking computer chair and go back to the fucking couch, and watch all the commercials of all the shows you care about, and buy all the products.
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I've never watched Jericho so I really couldn't understand what all the fuss is about. The only show that I ever planned my week around was Rome on HBO, but I let that one die peacefully when HBO announced the end of the series.<BR><BR>That being said, I think that CBS knows it screwed up by putting the show up against American Idol. Any moron with half a brain can see that unless Americans as a whole develop good taste in TV in the next 6 or so months (which will probably not happen) then anything that gets thrown up against AI is not going to do well in live viewership. If CBS has that much a hard on to have people watch the show live, it would do better to place it up against some of the weaker shows that the competition offers instead of asking people to turn their DVR's off.
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Unreality TV as a whole is an IQ test and America does not want to see its score.
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by -Locke-:<BR>Of course if you're not part of a Nielson household it doesn't make one bit of difference if you watch it live, record it, or download it online. No matter what you do it doesn't count for ratings which means I'll stick to what's more convenient, gives better quality, and is guaranteed not to be interrupted by the weather man telling me that it's currently raining outside and to stay tuned for breaking updates. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>++<BR>The system is so outdated and broken, it doesn't make a bit of difference what you personally do. The networks have to start looking at alternative funding for shows if the advertisers aren't going to move into the twenty-first century. Sell The episodes subscription style on DVD or the internet, and then show them on broadcast a few weeks later.<BR><BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Nielsen also do semi-random telephone and paper surveys in addition to the houses with nielsen boxes, so it could make a difference, unless you are willing to lie about it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Who wouldn't lie about it? I know that the few times I have gotten the paper Nielsen surveys, I have pimped out the shows I care about. Their system doesn't work for me, I don't even have cable, so I don't feel bad at all trying to push the shows I care about.<BR><BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The real problem is that Jericho is crap. I have the whole series off of itunes, but it got to the point I just couldn't take it. Crap writing, crap acting, crap sets. I think it lost steam about three episodes in. Its budget did not match its ambition. Let it die. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>It definitely had a bad patch, and was far too slow setting up the interesting stuff, but it did get good for the last third. Once they got the conspiracy out in the open and there were less secrets the whole tone of the show changed for the better. Besides, a success story like this does nothing but help the next time a show is unfairly canceled, regardless of whether you like the show or not. A few years ago, the networks didn't pay any attention to anything but the ratings. Now at least they are having to acknowledge niche audiences, even if they are too stupid to realize they could be making big bucks by catering to them. <BR><BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">What I think is getting lost here is that CBS did cancel the show. Gone. Kaput. Then, they changed their minds (how often does that happen?) and agreed to bring it back due almost entirely to the online efforts of people like us who love the show.<BR><BR>Is it that wrong for them to say to that same audience: "Hey, if we bring back this show that you want so bad like you asked, for free, do you mind helping us pay for it?" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Yes, because at this point the old way is dying, and propping it up and refusing to move to newer funding and tracking systems is just going to end up getting next season's Jericho type shows canceled too.
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