One last look at software support as macOS 26 Tahoe winds down the Intel Mac era
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Yeah I’m going to be converting mine using a conversion board, but I’m technically inclined enough to do it. I’m not paint for the studio monitor when I can get a Mac mini and save some e garbage.
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It's not the end of the world to stop receiving software updates. The mac will still work. Obviously one has to take precautions regarding any security vulnerabilities ...but Macs are inherently safer than PCs in that regard anyway. If you get a decade put of your hardware...good for you. But my gosh, the M chips are a revolution compared to Intel. Save your simoleons and upgrade.
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Even as a joke I would not wish such a project on my worst enemy. With many manufacturers selling “new” computers with years old chips, shipping with OS versions that were already not eligible for updates, or barely functioning computers with the shipping OS even an LLM would cry trying to make sense of it. We should make giving an accurate answer to this the test for if something is real AI. I would however be interested if Microsoft pushing drivers has helped the situation or if additional code signing has made driver updates even less likely.
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My concern is the impact on speed/stability.
I long ago noticed that most Macs offered the best compromise between acceptable performance and latest features on the penultimate major release that officially supported them. That last release often ran slow as shit, and sometimes came with stability issues.
Maybe I'm wrong, but the question of whether or not to use OCLP to bring them closer to current is a trade off between security (currently managed by not allowing them on the internet) and performance (how slow is too slow for me). So far I've not needed them to access the internet. We have a lot of other, more modern devices (other laptops, iPhones, iPads, etc.), so the trade off has seemed not worth the hassle for us.
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My 2012 non-retina pro served me well for 10 years, I hope it's M2 replacement achieves a similar life. The post 2015 days were just bad, bad products with bad support, not too dissimilar to the tail end of the PowerPC days for the G5 and late G4 models
Speaking of 2015, I think in the discussion of models with long sale periods it's supposed to be the "non butterfly/non touchbar" 2015 Pro and not "non retina." I had one of those machines at work during the period and it was solid and people were not pleased with being saddled with the "new" macbook or early touch bar pros
Speaking of 2015, I think in the discussion of models with long sale periods it's supposed to be the "non butterfly/non touchbar" 2015 Pro and not "non retina." I had one of those machines at work during the period and it was solid and people were not pleased with being saddled with the "new" macbook or early touch bar pros
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I'm talking about the support period for Macs. 5-7 years for a desktop isn't a lot.
I know someone that still uses a 2015 Macbook Pro. Earlier this year I upgraded the Dell laptop (they got it in 2016, I think) of a family member from HDD to SSD.
Regarding phones, I agree that people usually don't keep them for +10 years, but if I go to Apple's UK refurbished store right now, they're selling the iPhone 14 (2022) and iPad Pro 11" (2020) directly to consumers. I think last year I saw the iPhone 13 Mini in one of their stores? Those buying some of these devices now won't get 5 years of support.
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Well, it'll happily keep running for some time yet... Just no major new OS revisions, but there, really, it's a case of diminishing returns anyway.
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planned obsolesce from the start. Another reason I'll never believe tech companies when they pretend to care about the environment.
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Yeah, but admitting to that will kill all the Microsoft-hating click bait for doing exactly the same thing apple has been doing for years with no one complaining and actually cheering and justifying
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There's definitely a future for "orphaned" Intel Macs:
install FreeBSD or Linux.
(as I write this on a MacMini running FreeBSD).
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Well, remember that there used to be an effort to get the operating system to support the broadest user base possible (outside of Apple-land)?
Windows 95 on a 386 with 4MB of RAM was a joke.
I also remember a Flight Simulator release that supported Windows 95, 98, Me, NT, 2000 and XP.
Now it's straight to the landfill. Yes, a 2009 Mac Pro may not be very efficient, but maybe you run on solar? At least give us the option. I'd probably be on the Mac, but I just can't justify parting with perfectly functional (and fast) computers.
So I left and now a ThinkPad is my daily driver and I keep a Mac around to be able to access some old data.
MSFT played an Apple with the TPM 2.0 + arbitrary CPU cutoff carpet pull.
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We upgrade phones every 2-3 years on average, and yet the iPhone has an average 5+2 support window. iPhone upgrade timelines are easier 2-3x larger than their expected ownership time per user.
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The M1 Air is one of the best computers Apple ever made. Great performance for the form factor, great keyboard + trackpad, great battery life, great screen. I've got one, and I'll be using it until the hardware falls apart. Such a good laptop.
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Dell officially provide 5 years of support anything after that is not guaranteed and best effort.
Part of this is the support lifecycles provided by their suppliers being similar Dell cannot provide firmware updates if Intel and stopped supporting the platform and providing updates for it.
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For the nth time except for one weird exception to do with a processor used in an MS surface device the CPU cutoff is not arbitrary it is the point that Mode Based Access Control was implemented which makes certain security related features implementable with negligible slowdown.
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Which was fine (my SE was from a 1990 campus offer), since the 68000 Macs were painfully slow under 7.5.5, and couldn't use many of the new features anyway (colour). They were much happier under 6.0.x.
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Ah yes, the "people only use a Web browser on their computer" argument.
If that were actually true, everybody would be using Linux already. But it isn't.
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The problem with the M1 - for a not-that-small number of people - is that it didn't natively support more than 1 external display, whereas Intel could do this out of the box. To achieve this feature required 3rd party hardware and drivers which, as I've experienced them, aren't the most reliable things in the world.
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Yeah, people are assuming that because those are still being sold, it's a given that they will be supported for an extra long time, but personally I wouldn't put it past Apple to not care and just screw over all those M1 MBA recent buyers.
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Well, there is an aftermarket of replacement main boards for the 27 inch iMacs to convert them into dumb monitors. But it's still a very involved build. You don't get a part that just snaps elegantly into the same ports and reuses the same power supply. No, that would be too easy and convenient...
I've been looking into it a few years ago and decided it was too much work just to get to a point where you have a really janky-looking setup. Then recently I've checked again and to my displeasure, nothing really improved.
Feels like there is potential market out there for DIY iMac conversion kits that streamline the process as much as possible, but alas.
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I don't know that "screw over" is justified there.
I agree, that they probably will not support M1 MBAirs longer than they would otherwise inspite of the fact that they are still selling them now. I vaguely recall them doing something similar with a different machine during the PowerPC days (though I can't recall what the device was). This was also a formal part of their iPhone strategy for a while, selling last years or 2-year ago models to meet a lower price point.
However, they are buying a 5 year old design, at a discount vs a current design. Anyone who knows what M1 vs M4 means - even if just by knowing that 4 is 3 more than 1 - should realize that they are buying a machine with less longevity in front of it. It was part of my calculous when advising my teenager what to buy with their Christmas money a few months back (they settled on an M3 MBAir to keep costs down, but ensure it could probably get them through the rest of HS and a BA degree).
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Plenty of people buy a device for whatever it costs and use it as long as it works. If my phone works for nine years, why wouldn't I use it for that time?
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Just as a funny point of interest, we noticed when I was updating the article image for the new Finder graphic that they've swapped the colors.
I get why, the right side was the raised 'positive' and in the new scheme that's going to be the darker version, but it's a break with a long tradition.
I get why, the right side was the raised 'positive' and in the new scheme that's going to be the darker version, but it's a break with a long tradition.
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See Action Retro's YouTube channel to see what weird and wonderful OSes you can load PowerPC and Intel Macs with.
To make your Mac to live forever then try an Amiga-based OS because as it is known, the Amiga never died.
To make your Mac to live forever then try an Amiga-based OS because as it is known, the Amiga never died.
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No it doesn't. Laptops from 2019 are about to lose support.
8th Gen Intel CPU's all support Windows 11, and that's from 2017 until at least 2027 or longer.
So there you go. I've done Dell and Lenevo for you. Of course this is AppleTechnica so I'm ready for all the negative downvotes but Apple suck at long term support. You can still play modern games/apps with modern hardware and drivers from PC's released nearly 20 years ago with Windows 10.
I have a Compaq (yes, Compaq) laptop from 2006 that runs Windows 10 and will finally lose support at the end of 2025 when Windows 10 retires. That's 19 years!
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Ask and you shall receive. And it's more saying dumb shit like Appletechnica that gets you the downvotes BTW. Come at the comment with a combative attitude and that's what happens.
Also 2018 MBP has Coffee Lake processors, but not eligible for Windows 11. My Boot Camp can't be upgraded.
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I just upgraded to a M4 Pro, shifted my M1 to the wife, moved her 2018 Mac Mini i7, 16GB to her sewing room. I'm not happy that a very capable (and expensive) PC is going to be relegated to the trash heap. Apple needs to facilitate reuse of these machines by releasing specs on T2 and any other Intel deitrius they're leaving behind.
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I am typing this on my Intel 2012 MacBook Pro running Ventura 13.7.
The OpenCore team do an amazing job of keeping old Macs alive when Apple choose not to. If Apple announce they are ending support that doesn't mean you should throw out perfectly good equipement.
Especially if it means you are giving Apple more money to obsolete products and services so they can lock them down behind non-upgradeable walls and software bubbles.
The OpenCore team do an amazing job of keeping old Macs alive when Apple choose not to. If Apple announce they are ending support that doesn't mean you should throw out perfectly good equipement.
Especially if it means you are giving Apple more money to obsolete products and services so they can lock them down behind non-upgradeable walls and software bubbles.
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The Mac may function - but just like the iPad Air I have which is in pristine condition - give it another software release cycle and then suddenly you will find nothing else works on it, because all third party app devs need to move with the Apple software.
It's just a brick with lights at that point unless you go OpenCore.
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The length of time the OS is supported is less than half the story these days. It is the entirety of the machine that matters which includes:
- CPU Microcode
- Firmware
- Management Engine and other embedded software
- OS Drivers
Dell only say they will guarantee the above while the machine is in warranty. The longest warranty you can buy from Dell on a desktop machine is 5 years therefore such hardware is out of support 5 years after the last sale date.
It's comparing apples (sic) to oranges as even those PCs from 2017 have lost support for at least one of the above let alone the machines from 19 years ago.
Apple's support lifecycle is the entirety of the machine like the dell one above.
Recently UK legislation compelled companies which sell in the UK to state their minimum support period for the entire device both Apple and Dell said 5 years.
The reason you are being downvoted is because you are wrong not because this is arstechnica.
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Apple stated the support lifecycle when you bought the product.
https://support.apple.com/en-us/102772
"Products are considered vintage when Apple stopped distributing them for sale more than 5 and less than 7 years ago."
"Products are considered obsolete when Apple stopped distributing them for sale more than 7 years ago. Monster-branded Beats products are considered obsolete regardless of when they were purchased. "
And that has been the same for a very long time. If you do not like that then do not buy Apple products.
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Apple will support those machines for 5 years after they last offered it for sale which for Apple is 2024 + 5 = 2029 when the design will be nearly a decade old. If they consider Walmart selling stock to count is a different matter.
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True though OpenCore is now on borrowed time. Since Apple has announced that macOS 26 will be the last one compiled for intel after that it's over as there won't be intel OS binaries to patch anymore going forward
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Citation needed? Apple never makes any support roadmaps public, any projections are purely hypothetical.
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Amen. You can airplay to it but that’s not optimal for many applications. Target display mode should have been kept but was cut off with the ARM transition.
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You can (or recently could) buy refurb LG screens with the same panel for about $500. Not as good as keeping using something you have that works, but not a bad deal either.
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I'm a creative professional that got an M1-Max MBP when it released in Q4 2021. 3 1/2 years in, the machine is still a beast. But the screen has been problematic. Apple has replaced the screen 3 times. I was told if it happened again, they'd replace the entire machine (which raises a question of just how many 32GB RAM, 24GPU M1-Max processors they have in reserve).
I always planned to get 5-6 years out of the machine as my main computer.
But as my work doesn't stop when Apple is shipping my laptop back and forth from its repair facility in Texas, I've pulled my Spring 2015 MPBR out of its bag and put it back into service. I bought the machine brand new in Spring of 2016. I will say that it runs great. I have to be much more careful to do my processing in smaller chunks so as not to exceed the RAM and have stuff paged out to disk - even the M1 can get twitchy if I push too much data at once. But as long as I do my image processing in smaller chunks it's a great replacement. I am somewhat concerned that I'm no longer getting security updates, but as an emergency backup the now 9 year-old laptop (and 10 year-old model) is surprisingly capable. I find my Windows laptops are generally all but useless after four years, even as backups.
I always planned to get 5-6 years out of the machine as my main computer.
But as my work doesn't stop when Apple is shipping my laptop back and forth from its repair facility in Texas, I've pulled my Spring 2015 MPBR out of its bag and put it back into service. I bought the machine brand new in Spring of 2016. I will say that it runs great. I have to be much more careful to do my processing in smaller chunks so as not to exceed the RAM and have stuff paged out to disk - even the M1 can get twitchy if I push too much data at once. But as long as I do my image processing in smaller chunks it's a great replacement. I am somewhat concerned that I'm no longer getting security updates, but as an emergency backup the now 9 year-old laptop (and 10 year-old model) is surprisingly capable. I find my Windows laptops are generally all but useless after four years, even as backups.
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But why is Apple's EOL policy for security maintenance unwritten?
They control the software. They control (most of) the hardware. What is the excuse? I don't know of any other OS that doesn't document a support lifecycle.
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They should really bring it back now that the bandwith issues related to the external display ports has been fixed
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