No F-150 in France? US automakers complain the EU blocks big trucks.

European buyers aren't interested in full-size trucks; US car industry doesn't care.

See full article...

 

[itanod]

Hold the line, Europe — America is clogged with massive trucks driven by small men.

 

[DistinctivelyCanuck]

It would be somewhat sweet for the EU to implement a version of the Chicken Tax.

You want to sell your trucks in the EU? Ok, we require a safety tax. Perhaps 25% ?

 

[frelled]

I can't tell you how many small minded people here buy absolutely obnoxious large trucks that have never been used for a day of work. We need more regulation here in the US regarding the size of our vehicles. The last thing EU should do is follow our example.

 

[laitpojes]

Whatever you do, don’t let these things take hold over there.

They are absolutely horrendous for society

 

[Sajuuk]

could breach the spirit of the trade deal

As an American myself, our collective hypocrisy is truly a mesmerizing sight to behold. We have the agency to sign all the deals we want with all the words we like, and you have the agency to accept it when we inevitably break it. Any attempt at self-determination is a violation of our agency and flag-given right to trample you.

Of course it makes sense in the grand scheme of things, from a self-interested standpoint. What is the nature of empire but the economy of scale for rapists, after all?

edit: grammars

 

[j00ce]

Given that the current US administration's recent actions have hugely increased the cost of gasoline and diesel, is this really a good time to try and force the rest of the world to buy massive, gas-guzzling American SUVs?

Not least since it's likely to be months if not years before oil prices settle back down.

 

[Slothur the Hasty]

Yes, people are queuing up here to be able to buy one. They dream of filling it up for $217 on its 23 gallon tank here in Norway on a good day.

 

[FxzlmS]

I think the main issue we (Europeans) have with this type of car is less about the practicality for the driver rather than the complete "fuck you" attitude it conveys.

The design is quite clearly a danger to pedestrians and especially children, providing more bulk and armor to the driver while in return endangering everyone else.

Powering such a large vehicle of course also comes with a huge gas burn rate. Again, a fuck you to a) the people who live there where you pollute the air, and b) simply the planet as such.

And, lastly, there is no trade-off in that the vehicle provides some sort of unique utility. On the contrary, a pick-up truck of that size is in many/most situations inferior to a regular transporter van (think Mercedes Sprinter).

And all that taken together also very clearly identifies you, the driver, as some self-centered MAGA idiot - because this is the only clientele that drives these things over here.

 

[peterford]

Give me a M1A2 Abrams that I can park at Morrisons in Whitby or give me death.

 

[L0neW0lf]

A huge number of EU roads were never built with the size of big trucks and SUVs in mind; since when have these vehicles ever been a great purchase choice there to begin with?

Also, even before the new Iranian "special military operation", gasoline per-litre in the UK/EU is nuts from what I understand and it's just going to get worse. The only people who could afford these will be the ones least suited to drive them in a civilized manner (ultra-rich, entitled people) and that's not a marketshare, given that they're the one percent.

This lacks all logic. If a truck is going to be purchased in the EU, I'd totally expect the kind of smaller trucks that Japanese automakers have been famous for, or the Ford Ranger from before they changed it from a small truck to a big truck like all the others.

P.S. Self-certification/regulation sucks; as we all know here in the US, you can't trust any company to say "Just trust us!".

 

[Fatesrider]

Hold the line, Europe — America is clogged with massive trucks driven by small men.

The men are big. It's parts of their anatomy that are small.

As you might imagine, self-certification is great for companies but less great for consumer safety.

Elon Musk would not be a name most people recognize if we had the government certifying vehicles for safety before they could be sold.

 

[pavon]

Fine, let cars meeting US safety standards be sold in the EU, but they can't operate on public roads without type-approval, or the equivalent of a CDL.

 

[spacespektr]

This review is scheduled to be complete next year and has the potential to freeze out full-size pickups designed with no consideration for things like European pedestrian safety. But part of the trade deal includes the EU recognizing US car standards, and US ambassador to the EU Andrew Puzder told the FT that “you can’t have low tariffs and massive non-tariff trade barriers and claim you’ve got a functioning relationship.”

Who wants to tell him?

 

[Jackattak]

When my wife and I deployed to Germany post-9/11, we took her 1999 Ford F-150 regular cab with V6 and 5MT. One of the last manual transmissions they did in the F-150 IIRC.

It was basically like driving a hypercar or something. People taking pics like we were Brad and Jennifer and shit. Even had a farmer offer us 18,000 euros for it, which was what my wife spent on it brand new. We would've been taken to the cleaners over the VAT though.

It was fun but I wouldn't recommend owning one there. Villages can be extremely tight.

Edit: And to add to this, an F-150 in 1999 was about the size of a 2026 Ranger

 

[lithven]

But part of the trade deal includes the EU recognizing US car standards,

Is this a reciprocity agreement so the US would have to recognize EU safety and emissions standards and thus we can move past the 25/21 year import rules? Please say yes.

 

[Bravesirrobinson]

It would be somewhat sweet for the EU to implement a version of the Chicken Tax.

You want to sell your trucks in the EU? Ok, we require a safety tax. Perhaps 25% ?

It's not worth it, no matter what the tax is it could never be high enough. Trucks here are so large that as a 6ft male, their hood is at my shoulder. I've been driving my crossover which is decently high off the ground and had situations where the grill is to the top of my window. If one of those hit into me it'd be a battering ram to the entire car. Let alone pedestrians and children that are invisible to the driver.

This doesn't even mention the size they require for parking or navigating streets. We have giant parking lots here, and yet many still have their tow hooks a foot or two hanging out of the back of their spot. You can't park between two of them unless you drive a compact car, because their wing mirrors stick a solid foot and a half out preventing you from opening your car door.

Their gas milage is atrocious, their size is ludicrous, and their danger is immeasurable.

 

[accantant]

I offer a compromise: Let people in Europe who want these monstrous road safety hazards buy them, then impound and crush them immediately.
I recommend we apply the impound-and-crush rule retroactively, as well.

 

[outadoc]

It's so clearly purely political. No reasonable person in France wants a truck the size of an F-150. The thing is literally impossible to park anywhere, in addition to being a death machine.

 

[peterford]

gasoline per-litre in the UK/EU is nuts from what I understand

I have personally seen diesel at $10.18 per US gallon. A motorway service stop it's true, but I saw it.

Edit 199.9p per litre

 

[urbanCTO]

Two points:

Got back from France last night. Driving there is a nightmare -- purposely so -- with small streets with people, bikes, scooters, and everything else. So much more human and humane.

Learned how to drive in my grandfather's Ford F150 on his Minnesota farm in the 1970s. That truck was the size of a large Euro car today. Today's trucks are 3x larger. Everyone knows that the size is of the truck is inversely proportional to the driver's self-esteem. To wit, my grandfather was a confident fellow with a full section of blue earth country and never went above the speed limit.

(edit: sp.)

 

[hildey328]

I drive an Audi S4. Not a large car in the US. The Gent and I were daydreaming about moving to Europe and what we would take with us should we win the lottery. He said "of course, we'd take your car". I pointed out that when we'd been in Europe, most cars were smaller than mine. Parking my car would be a nightmare in many places (especially since she's old enough to NOT have a backup camera).

I cannot fathom driving or parking a huge truck in areas where they just don't fit. It's utterly ridiculous.

 

[DRJlaw]

Restricting the flow of F-150s to the continent “could breach the spirit of the trade deal,” according to US negotiators, the Financial Times reported this morning.

That's a pretty rich claim given a 60 year-old tariff on "light trucks" known as the "Chicken Tax" pretty much keeps Europe (and Japan, and Korea) from exporting pickups, non-passenger vans, and truck-type SUVs to the United States.

This is one of the big reasons that you can't buy a Toyota Hilux in the U.S.

 

[WebDev511]

I was stationed in the UK for 3 years and Germany for 2. those roads weren't big enough for US Pickups in the 90's, there's no way the current crop of full sized us trucks are appropriate for use in either country. The 1971 LTD I had in Germany (purchased from a guy returning stateside) was too big for everything except the Airbase and Autobahn.

The Ford Maverick is about perfect though.

 

[Frasersgrove]

Yes, people are queuing up here to be able to buy one. They dream of filling it up for $217 on its 23 gallon tank here in Norway on a good day.

I'm in Central Canada and that tank would cost $103.35USD but my cousin in Berlin would be paying $224.94USD. They're niche vehicles there, not much more...

 

[PurpleBadger]

Heck, I'm an American and what surprises me is the lack of alternatives to these monsters. I own a first-generation Tacoma, and it's common for people to tell me: "Man, I wish they still made these small trucks!"

 

[fe3a8b63]

The last thing Europe needs is turbocharged F150s.

Hell, I'm in Toronto, work as a contractor, ALL my coworkers drive giant ass pickup trucks - and the best part? They refuse to haul goods or fill them to more than 1/10th capacity because they don't want to "abuse the car". Seriously, they refuse to load anything over 220lb.

They bought fully decked out trucks for... ??? [some unknown purpose, it sure aint hauling goods] I don't know. - one coworker paid over 120,000CAD despite spending almost all of his earnings on payments each month. "It'll ruin the suspension or transmission". 220lb is "too fucking much".

 

[arkhanist]

Fine, let cars meeting US safety standards be sold in the EU, but they can't operate on public roads without type-approval, or the equivalent of a CDL.

Generally that's already the case - if your vehicle is only ever going to be used off road on private land (such as an agricultural machine, or track car) you don't need an IVA and can declare it for such use. You will need to transport it from the port, if moving locations etc, and insurance will likely have to be specialised. If you ever want to drive it on public roads, you'll need to get it registered, taxed etc - and type approval/IVA is a requirement for that.

 

[Trentmoller]

Japan made a mistake in agreeing to accept vehicles that don't belong on Japanese roads. There is zero reason for the EU to do the same. If American manufacturing wants to sell in Europe they absolutely can - as long as what they're offering meets regulatory requirements and people want to buy them.

No one wants your enormous dork mobiles. Everyone in Europe thinks these vehicles are idiotic.

 

[JTD121]

Oh no! Anyway......

Detroit grasping at straws is mostly entertaining, but also very sad.

 

[poke 532810]

Not Just Bikes came out with a video a few months ago on the problem of oversized US pickups on Europe. I hope Europe sticks to their guns and blocks further imports. They don’t need them there, and we don’t need them here.

 

[Tactical Finesse]

The last thing Europe needs is turbocharged F150s.

Hell, I'm in Toronto, work as a contractor, ALL my coworkers drive giant ass pickup trucks - and the best part? They refuse to haul goods or fill them to more than 1/10th capacity because they don't want to "abuse the car". Seriously, they refuse to load anything over 220lb.

They bought fully decked out trucks for... ??? I don't know - one coworker paid over 120,000CAD despite spending almost all of his earnings on payments each month. "It'll ruin the suspension or transmission". 220lb is "too fucking much".

My coworkers whine when the scratch the bed. Like. Seriously--that is its job.

They bought them--because clever branding with lots of marketing. People on the shorter side buy these high-profile vehicles to see over all the large vehicles. Everyone buys bigger vehicles--because smaller ones are "death traps" due to all the large trucks. Which results in a self-feeding cycle of security-theater that has no limit.

The cake is when their owners complain about how narrow the 50ft+ right-of-way streets are or the regulation car-parking stalls. No, honey--that is just how comically obese our trucks and SUVs have gotten. The roads infra didn't get smaller--your vehicle got comically overlarge.

 

[hexapodium]

Fine, let cars meeting US safety standards be sold in the EU, but they can't operate on public roads without type-approval, or the equivalent of a CDL.

This is halfway the case already: European (and UK) licenses have relatively tight weight categories for cars. Most people who passed their driving test after 1996 only have a "B" license up to 3.5t (or 4.25 for electrics and hybrids) gross weight, and most EU market vehicles are plated at 3.45t. This cuts out several US market full-size trucks (and, happily, the Cybertruck), since about half the driving public would need to do another driving test to be allowed to drive them at all.

Licenses originally issued before 1997 have a "BE" endorsement and go up to 7.5t instead, and a decent minority of people do take a second test for 7.5t, usually for work and on their way to a 22t C license or the HGV (truck) licenses.

 

[AusPeter]

I can't tell you how many small minded people here buy absolutely obnoxious large trucks that have never been used for a day of work. We need more regulation here in the US regarding the size of our vehicles. The last thing EU should do is follow our example.

Isn't the fact that obnoxious large trucks exist solely because of tax loopholes in the first place?

 

[avant]

Behold.

 

[Sajuuk]

Isn't the fact that obnoxious large trucks exist solely because of tax loopholes in the first place?

That, and people just keep buying more and more of them.

 

[AusPeter]

That, and people just keep buying more and more of them.

You can only buy what that exists

 

[House of Propane]

Heck, I'm an American and what surprises me is the lack of alternatives to these monsters. I own a first-generation Tacoma, and it's common for people to tell me: "Man, I wish they still made these small trucks!"

Small trucks cost roughly the same to build as large trucks, and you can’t sell them for nearly as much money.