Volvo is coming for its competitors with more efficient production and newer tech.
See full article...
See full article...
Moose-proof and megacasting: Ars drives the new Volvo EX60
- Thread starter JournalBot
- Start date
Yea, that is becoming exclusively an US problem.
Elsewhere, EVs are selling like hotcakes.
I am waiting for a simple finance approval for a lease. The approval is a no-brainer, usually takes 2 days. Waiting for a two weeks now, because so many people want to lease an EV.
Hopefully any day, and then we have an EV. The shift to EV has been happening so fast in my friends circle, we are going to be late to the party, I am not making it up 4 of our closest friends (like a list of 6 or 7) have just gotten an EV, so we will be number 5.
Upvote
69
(71
/
-2)
The interior is still a complete shit-show of plastic and nothingness.
I was looking last week for a mid sized EV. I went into Volvo, saw the horrendous shiny black plastic and cheap interior of the 30/40 and we just walked out. The mini countryman, kia ev3 and cupra born were literally miles ahead.
Volvo is just another once great company now just a name.
I was looking last week for a mid sized EV. I went into Volvo, saw the horrendous shiny black plastic and cheap interior of the 30/40 and we just walked out. The mini countryman, kia ev3 and cupra born were literally miles ahead.
Volvo is just another once great company now just a name.
Upvote
-19
(23
/
-42)
“It then takes a minute to dry”. I don’t think you mean dry, maybe “set” or “solidify”? Such techniques are great for the manufacturer but not great for the vehicle owner. Castings are almost impossible to repair, certainly ones with such a lattice structure. You are very unlikely to be able to straighten or weld them- welding aluminium is intrinsically difficult and impossible for most high strength alloys so even a relatively small local damage could total the car. Look for higher insurance premiums.
Upvote
42
(50
/
-8)
Welding aluminium is not really difficult. The tricky bit is that you have to do so in an oxygen-free enviroment - or it will oxidise.
That oxygen free thing is a bit hard in a home setup, but in a properly equiped workshop, once you got the setup and expertise it's not rocket science.
Upvote
23
(25
/
-2)
ubercurmudgeon
Ars Praefectus
As a 100kg cyclist, who had my 10kg bicycle ripped out from under me, and the full weight of my body impacted the windshield of a car, my sympathy is with the moose in this scenario. Large animals they may be, but they're still a fraction of the weight of this two-plus-tonne vehicle. But by all means make cars heavier and heavier, with bigger and bigger touchscreens, so their drivers can be more and more oblivious.
Last edited:
Upvote
11
(30
/
-19)
US problem.
If you want to see numbers:
View: https://bsky.app/profile/janrosenow.bsky.social/post/3mmbed4utzk2q
And my prediction is 2026 will be quite a lot over this.
EVs were good enough in 2025, in 2026 they are becoming clearly superior.
There are still issues where they cannot replace a petrol car - at least not well.
Such as towing a caravan over a long distance.
But that will not take long to solve.
Upvote
72
(75
/
-3)
I am somewhat surprise that Trump has graciously allowed Volvo to use the made-great-again american roads: Volvo is owned by Geely, a Chinese company.
Upvote
-10
(5
/
-15)
Who in the everloving F... would ever ask that? I, and anyone I know just wants a button to press or a knob to twist. Oh, I'm a bit warm. Click, click, now it's comfortable. I can sort of see this for stuff like navigation, but basically ANY car function (wipers, lights, temperature/climate, seats, windows, mirrors) give me a friggin button or knob!
Upvote
127
(129
/
-2)
Bold choice. Plenty of batteries have issues that require servicing and replacing a module. With everything glued in and "structural" the only option is just ignoring any potential problem, lowering charge with firmware / set higher spare ratio, or replace the vehicle floor with battery built in. Contrast that to swapping a bad module/brick in a more conventional design:
Maybe it's nbd within the first 10 years inside the warranty period but after that any issue sends the Volvo straight to the scrap heap.
With older cars like Toyota hybrids there are lots of options to repair a broken pack - salvage modules, sort by capacity, voila new balanced refurbished packs ready to be swapped. And the old pack is never totalled, pull the modules, test and trash the ones that are too far gone and shelf the rest for the next customer. Random eBay image of these modules:
A well developed third party service economy makes a car future proof - as in, won't be completely useless after the first 10 or 15 years.
Last edited:
Upvote
37
(45
/
-8)
And a second thought, I hate the move towards "megacasting" (stupid name, it's just metal injection moulding). It's making new cars basically disposable. Even a low speed fender bender can crack that rear casting and the whole care is an economic loss. Nobody is going to weld those (too much liability) and they're not replaceable. I don't mind too much if it's just a subframe that can be unbolted and replaced (and the manufacturer keeps ample stock for a decade at least) but imho even that is questionable. Castings don't belong in these applications, it's too brittle and too sensitive to impact.
Upvote
51
(61
/
-10)
Plain aluminium or the range of weldable alloys sure, but any high strength alloy for example as used in aircraft or vehicle manufacture typically depend on solution hardening which does not survive welding in a useable form- that's why aircraft structures are typically riveted or glued. The other issue is fatigue strength, aluminium has no lower stress level (or maybe a ridiculously low one) below which it will not fatigue, whereas steel typically will never fatigue at any stress below 50% of the elastic limit, so anything that contributes built in stress or stress concentrations from welding repairs in aluminium is not a good idea. Interestingly this is one of the reasons that the Lotus aluminium chassis cars, Elise and so on, used glued extrusions and sheet for the main structure except for the rear suspension subframe which is welded steel.
Upvote
48
(48
/
0)
To state the blindingly obvious, price will be key. Volvo generally sells well here in the UK and I've been seeing quite a few of the smaller EX30 models around. It would be good to see something still made in Europe competitive with the vast number of chinese imports people are buying - BYD and Jaecoo mostly.
I'm ok with the minimal interior. The target market is almost always families and anything to make keeping the inside clean after children and/or dogs is wise !
I'm ok with the minimal interior. The target market is almost always families and anything to make keeping the inside clean after children and/or dogs is wise !
Upvote
13
(13
/
0)
Yes, my very first thought was "As no-one will ever utter until the heat death of the universe".
I see Volvo didn't get the memo that the other luxury carmakers (or at least Audi, MB, and Jaguar from the rumour - specifically not BMW, who are up to their own weird shit trying to redefine the interior of a car) have been talking about. There's a lot of talk in the next few years that we'll see buttons and knobs come back as a "luxury" option, since even $20k cars can manage a 14" touchscreen these days. Irrelevant whether it's better or not, or customers want it; it's something to offer in a luxury car that you can no longer get in a basic one.
Upvote
14
(15
/
-1)
I was going to write a snarky comment that there are no moose in Europe, they are called elk. Thankfully Google was my friend...
While they are called elk in Europe, they are the same species as North American moose. However, to add to the confusion, there is a separate species (slightly smaller than the moose/elk) in N America that are called elk. I suppose a case of why not reuse a good name
While they are called elk in Europe, they are the same species as North American moose. However, to add to the confusion, there is a separate species (slightly smaller than the moose/elk) in N America that are called elk. I suppose a case of why not reuse a good name
Upvote
26
(30
/
-4)
Don't get me started on buffalo and North American "buffalo" (i.e. bison) ;-)I was going to write a snarky comment that there are no moose in Europe, they are called elk. Thankfully Google was my friend...
While they are called elk in Europe, they are the same species as North American moose. However, to add to the confusion, there is a separate species (slightly smaller than the moose/elk) in N America that are called elk. I suppose a case of why not reuse a good name
Once, a møøse bit my sister...
Upvote
34
(34
/
0)
The moose-proof part is actually interesting to me, so it will make me take a look at Volvo when an EV is on my list in the next few years as I will buy a used one.
I drive a lot in the south-eastern part of Norway, or mid-western part of Sweden which are areas with scattered villages with large forests and lakes everywhere. You do meet these animals on the road fairly often especially at the end of summer, and there are many accidents reported, some fatal, so good on Volvo to focus on that.
Anecdotally, living in one of those municipalities in Norway almost a few decades ago, I had my own little computer service shop but also selling a lot of hunting gear, mostly electronics, radios etc. One of those years, permission to hunt almost 800 moose was given, and in an area that covered 371 square miles. I think they did fell about 500 that year. Lots of good eating that fall.
In Sweden, I would guess there are far more of them as they have much larger forested areas, but the Swedes are also great at mowing down a quite big band of nature next to the roads for better visibility. If you have not met one up close, they are comically huge and can be very dangerous.
I drive a lot in the south-eastern part of Norway, or mid-western part of Sweden which are areas with scattered villages with large forests and lakes everywhere. You do meet these animals on the road fairly often especially at the end of summer, and there are many accidents reported, some fatal, so good on Volvo to focus on that.
Anecdotally, living in one of those municipalities in Norway almost a few decades ago, I had my own little computer service shop but also selling a lot of hunting gear, mostly electronics, radios etc. One of those years, permission to hunt almost 800 moose was given, and in an area that covered 371 square miles. I think they did fell about 500 that year. Lots of good eating that fall.
In Sweden, I would guess there are far more of them as they have much larger forested areas, but the Swedes are also great at mowing down a quite big band of nature next to the roads for better visibility. If you have not met one up close, they are comically huge and can be very dangerous.
Upvote
19
(19
/
0)
Apparently you’re mistaken and there’s no moose in Scandinavia.
Upvote
1
(8
/
-7)
The title says Ars drives but I'm not seeing the usual disclaimer about what was paid by Volvo and about not accepting paid editorial content.
Is the disclaimer just a Dr Gitlin style thing, is this paid content, or was the writer not flown to drive the cars?
Upvote
8
(8
/
0)
This has been true of all Volvos for a very long time, The story of the moose-test:
View: https://www.reddit.com/r/Volvo/comments/13f601k/ive_grown_tired_of_retyping_the_story_in/
Upvote
19
(19
/
0)
That part I do know, when I took my driver's license back in the dark ages in the boonies which is a very strict and expensive thing here in Norway, one part of it was focused on evasive driving for said moose. Teachers throwing stuff on the road in a closed circuit etc.
Upvote
11
(11
/
0)
Easy to tell the difference…
You can’t wash your hands in a buffalo
(Yeah it’s an old one and I’ll be getting my coat now and seeing myself out)
Upvote
9
(10
/
-1)
I don't understand the need to be non imperative when telling the car what you want it to do.
You want to lower the temperature in the front seat, just tell the car that. "Turn off the drivers heated seat" or "lower the temperature of the front passenger AC".
The car isn't going to get mad at you because you tell it what it has to do. No need to have the hardware resources in the car to run a local AI agent just to chat with the driver.
Upvote
19
(20
/
-1)
I wonder if moose-proofing translates to roo-proofing for those of us living down under? Kangaroos are not as massive, but their hopping gait often means their centre of mass is higher than you'd expect, with unhappy results for all concerned when they are hit by cars.
Upvote
20
(20
/
0)
I can't simply reach over and use my hand to adjust where the vent is blowing, I have to fuck with the touchscreen? I mean, having to poke at it to change the fan speed is bad enough, but forcing this most absolute basic function of comfort to be electronic might be the most boneheaded car design decision I've ever heard of. Maybe the justification is "you can just tell the car AI to move the vent", but there is no world where that's going to work as well or with less distraction to the driver than just booping the vents.
Please tell me I'm misunderstanding this or that the author has somehow mistyped this paragraph and that someone whose job it is to design car interiors didn't actually think this is a good idea.
Upvote
41
(41
/
0)
Yes, but by the time you have taken the car apart t do it, at any sensible hourly labour rate... you will still have an insurance write off!
Upvote
9
(11
/
-2)
It's funny how the fancy "flying buttresses" in the aluminum castings look exactly like the plastic supports in cheap plastic injection molded tools or toys, the ones often only visible from underneath or when snapping it together. Similar enough process and structural constraints so it's sensible, it's just that in one it's "inspired by cathedrals" and worthy of being shown off but in the other it's something hidden from the consumer if possible. For the same thin wall with a small solid cylinder of material in the middle.
Upvote
12
(13
/
-1)
I agree,
My eight year old XC60 T8 recharge has an electric/electronic handbrake that has a design fault built in. I have spent around £1,500 a year since owning it on the handbrake wiring, modules, calipers etc.,
Whats wrong with a cable and a handle?
The rest of the car is magic now at 110,000 miles still going like a train, hope the air suspension lasts....
Upvote
4
(4
/
0)
i don't love the one-screen-to-control-them-all design style. but, in my experience, it doesn't take long to get used to. and it's honestly not significantly more brain-intensive than a forest of knobs and dials. YMMV.
it's not hard to put all the common things right on the 'home' screen (climate, volume, etc) so all you need to know is "temperature controls are at the bottom/left of the screen", volume is bottom/right (and on the right thumb-wheel on the steering wheel).
Upvote
-2
(4
/
-6)
That jumped out at me, too. Please tell me that vent direction isn't also electronically controlled through the touchscreen.
Upvote
4
(4
/
0)
I went to Volvo's site and the EX60 build tool only shows 322mi range for the P10 AWD Ultra. Where is the 400mi range in this article getting its basis from?
Upvote
1
(2
/
-1)
Metallurgical knowledge varies tremendously with experience and depth of study.
Within one factory, you'll get all of the following ideas:
- "It's light in colour and light in weight, it must be aluminum."
- "It's aluminum, you can weld that."
- "It's 6061-T6 aluminum lapped at 1/8 in thickness, you should use MIG with ER5356 or ER4043 wire and 100 amps under argon."
- "Yes that's the right welding protocol for 6061-T6, but while the bulk metal has a yield tensile strength of 276 MPa, that is going to drop to 48 MPa within the weld zone and if you don't take that into account then you are going to get a nasty failure once it's in service."
Upvote
19
(19
/
0)
You say: “buttresses”; I say: ‘stiffening ribs’.
And, as I understand it; architectural ‘flying buttresses‘ did not carry much or even any STATIC load; they were primarily for resisting the dynamic loads from wind; and maybe secondarily for enabling the main vertical support structure to be much less massive than was traditionally needed. Am I mistaken?
Whereas the stiffening ribs in this casting look like they’re carrying a lot of static load.
Can we get an FEA model…?
And, as I understand it; architectural ‘flying buttresses‘ did not carry much or even any STATIC load; they were primarily for resisting the dynamic loads from wind; and maybe secondarily for enabling the main vertical support structure to be much less massive than was traditionally needed. Am I mistaken?
Whereas the stiffening ribs in this casting look like they’re carrying a lot of static load.
Can we get an FEA model…?
Upvote
10
(10
/
0)
Upvote
4
(4
/
0)
We really do not need to slap SI prefixes on the names of perfectly ordinary mid-tier processes. It's cringe and it makes the people saying it look like ignorant fools. There is nothing "mega" or "giga" about squeezing 100 pounds of liquid aluminum into a moulding die. We've been doing that since the 1890s.
For actual big castings, you need to look at the likes of Sheffield Forgemasters, who have been known to cast 600 tons (!) of steel in a single shot. Something like that will take six weeks to cool enough to be pulled from the sand and several more weeks to cool in air, and then might spend two weeks in the heat-treatment furnace.
And yeah, you can't fix structural aluminum castings. When they break, you replace them and recycle the old one. Which means that repair is going to consist of completely dismantling everything attached to the casting, then reassembling it, at a shop rate of $120 per hour....
Upvote
19
(20
/
-1)
That sentence could probably be expressed better. A megacasting is going to be a "single" part no matter how large it is.
Upvote
-1
(0
/
-1)
The problem isn't "hard to get to" or "hard to find" or even "hard to operate" persé. It's that it's impossible to operate as a driver without looking or with only a small glance. If I want to adjust temps in my car, I only have to glance where the knob is and then my eyes go back to the road while I reach out to adjust the temperature one click, then a short glance to see that the change was as intended and eyes back on the road. With a touchscreen, my eyes have to stay on the touchscreen as I reach out and hit the button because there is no feedback whatsoever whether I'm hitting the right spot or not. Some stuff just works safer and easier if it's a physical button and that button has to be "clicky" and provide tactile feedback too.
Upvote
26
(29
/
-3)