Growing up gaming: The five space sims that defined my youth

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Control Group

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944471#p28944471:16pxlej5 said:
siliconaddict[/url]":16pxlej5]When they announced the Wing Commander movie I was so damn hyped for it. After WC III and IV I thought OMG THAT but full length movie. And then it was released and my soul died a little. D:
Why would you say that? Why would you even remind me that movie existed? What have I ever done to you to deserve such pain?

(I mean, I get that they were channeling submarine movies. I'm even on board with the concept. But having literal silent running - as in, nobody say anything! - in space is just too stupid for words)
 
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dr_hoads

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I have played all of these.... My favorite of all time are probably tie fighter, WC2, FS2 and privateer. I picked up the new Elite, but I just cant play it without autopilot. I am older now, and am lucky to get a 30 min session in each week. I need that time to be all trading and action. When I was a kid I would have enjoyed just flying around, but these days it does little for me. I don't mind having my AutoPilot disrupted like in the independence war series with some disruptor missiles, because then I would be engaged in a firefight with the pirates. Someone please PM me when they have an autopilot patched into the game as it is still on my computer just waiting to be played!! I love that space sims are making a comeback. I never understood why they went away... RIP Babylon 5 sim... I still miss you... :-(
 
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Psion

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944165#p28944165:2mn32xkn said:
Shakespeare212[/url]":2mn32xkn]I believe the Rapier was a Medium Fighter...Sabre was the Heavy Fighter in that line of ships.

You're right. That jumped out at me, too. Some things you just don't forget!

(true pedants would point out that's a Rapier II, as it's an upgraded model from the Rapier you fly in WC1)
 
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siliconaddict

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944573#p28944573:eys7zenr said:
Pokrface[/url]":eys7zenr]Wing Commander movie? Yeah, I heard rumors, but fortunately I don't think they ever made one. That'd be like if they made a second Highlander movie.


Don't see it. For the love of all that is good and holy just don't if you haven't. It was so bad.
 
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pokrface

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944641#p28944641:s3pj52f9 said:
siliconaddict[/url]":s3pj52f9]
[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944573#p28944573:s3pj52f9 said:
Pokrface[/url]":s3pj52f9]Wing Commander movie? Yeah, I heard rumors, but fortunately I don't think they ever made one. That'd be like if they made a second Highlander movie.


Don't see it. For the love of all that is good and holy just don't if you haven't. It was so bad.
No, sigh, I saw it. Beautiful, bombastic overture....horrifyingly terrible film.
 
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The great grand-daddy of them all is Ian Bell and David Braben’s Elite. Initially released for the BBC Micro and Acorn Electron home computers (devices that will be familiar to thirtysomethings from the UK and few else)....
You flatter us, but it's fortysomethings. :)

I remember that era quite well. I passed on a 2 week trip to Spain with my family during the school holidays so I could stay with my Grandparents and play Elite. I regret nothing. :D
 
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Raptor

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944607#p28944607:rv0cqoxh said:
Zak[/url]":rv0cqoxh]"Capital ships fired ridiculously large, ridiculously powerful beam weapons at each other," -- yeah, I remember that from Freespace2 as well. That game was lots of fun. I never found a space sim as god as that since then.

Compared to X-Wing, where single-handedly killing a Star Destroyer (and its compliment of TIEs) with an X-Wing was just a 15 minute task. ;)

I never was particularly concerned about them after that.
 
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keithzg

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944573#p28944573:2szaipi8 said:
Pokrface[/url]":2szaipi8]Wing Commander movie? Yeah, I heard rumors, but fortunately I don't think they ever made one. That'd be like if they made a second Highlander movie.

Or if they'd made a second half to the last season of Battlestar Galactica. Good thing they ended on that thematically interesting downer, with
the humans and some of the Cylons finally coming to peace and together finding Earth...only to discover it's a bombed-out wasteland
. No idea where they would've gone from there, but if the writer's strike hadn't delayed them so much they might've made a second half to that 4th season, and I strongly suspect it would've been kind of stupid. Luckily that never happened.
 
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Raptor

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944641#p28944641:2gljdea7 said:
siliconaddict[/url]":2gljdea7]
[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944573#p28944573:2gljdea7 said:
Pokrface[/url]":2gljdea7]Wing Commander movie? Yeah, I heard rumors, but fortunately I don't think they ever made one. That'd be like if they made a second Highlander movie.


Don't see it. For the love of all that is good and holy just don't if you haven't. It was so bad.

Eh, it's probably been something like 20 years, but I didn't think it was much worse than the plot of some of the Wing Commander games themselves.

Most of what I remember of the movie was seeing Poirot as the ship's Captain, seeing space combat portrayed as submarine warfare was neat and Biff was a jerk. Also the Kilrathi looked stupid.

Beyond that, my memories are fuzzy.

I seem to remember mostly being bored during the cutscenes of WC2 and eventually just skipping through them as quickly as I could just to get to the next mission.

I love story driven stuff, but the WC series was always just a bit too over the top for me in that respect.
 
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Cheezem4n

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Shout out to Lunatic Fringe, a game hidden in a screensaver on Mac's (remember flying toasters?) years before XWing or TIE. The game was tremendous fun and ahead of its time, with a hilarious charm yet great gameplay. Googling it now shows its actually available on GoogleCode! Not really a sim, but it was the first game that got me flying in space.

TIE Fighter remains my all-time favorite game after more than 20 years of hardcore gaming.

edit: I remember the copy protection on either XW or TF was a code word printed in the bottom corner of every page of the instruction manual. At some point I lost the manual, so I would have to boot the game (from DOS, slowwww) over and over again until it asked for the code word from one of the few pages I could remember. Ahh good days...
 
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phoenix_rizzen

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Played TIE Fighter first as I found it in the bargain bin (on CD). That game lead me to buying a Gravis joystick, as playing with the mouse just sucked. :) Ran fine on a 486sx2 (no FPU!) running at 66 MHz. Had to write a custom config.sys/autoexec.bat and not load Windows 3.1, but it ran just fine.

Then I found the collector's edition of X-Wing ... and was severally disappointed in it. The controls were just too wonky, and they were missing the "Match speed to opponent" feature!! Wasn't until later I realised X-Wing came out first. :)

A few computer upgrades later (486dx4 at 133 MHz with a Gravis UltraSound ACE soundcard, then a Pentium-MMX laptop at 166 MHz), I picked up a Thrustmaster USB joystick to go with Windows 98, and picked up X-Wing Alliance and Secret Weapons Over Normandy. Those were some great games!

I really miss the old days of space/flight combat games (they were NOT sims!). I can't stand the space combat sims that came out around then or that are available now. I don't want to worry about inertia, or physics of combat in space, or pitch/yaw/roll, or the angle of the ailerons, etc. I just want to fly around and shoot things, damn it!

Just found my Thrustmaster the other day and I am very tempted to head over to GoG to pick some of these up ... Just not sure how/when I could play them with a 3-year old and a 6-month old in the house ...

[Edit: whoops, typo'd 386 instead of 486.]
 
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ChronoReverse

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Freespace 2 was unparallelled for sure.

I'd also put forth that the mod tools available right from the start made a huge difference as well. AFAIK, FRED(2) was the same way the devs made the campaign and from some of the really good fan-made campaigns, it was a wonderful thing that we had access to it.

If you've the mind to play FS2 using FS2_open, there are some really good campaigns like Blue Planet that you shouldn't miss. I haven't pulled out FS2 for a while, maybe it's time again!
 
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brionl

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I played a lot of Elite on my Apple //e, but I probably spent more time on SunDog, even though it's not exactly a space combat sim.

In the years since '99, Earth & Beyond showed up (and fizzled) on the MMO market place. The main thing I remember about that, was that it had pretty abysmal joystick support. I guess they didn't want to non-stickers to feel too inferior.

In honor of my Apple //e, I changed the HUD in my Elite: Dangerous ships from orange to green.

Here's the l337 green HUD for E: D

http://arkku.com/elite/hud_editor/#them ... 1_-0.3_0_0
 
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Jeremy Reimer

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Thank you for this article. It brought a tear to my eye.

One thing that I can't let go though:

(and I’ll be the first to admit that Wing Commander and Elite are both… a little thin, from a gameplay perspective)

The first Wing Commander was actually incredibly deep from a gameplay perspective. You could lose or damage subsystems on your ship, such as shields, maneuvering thrusters, the repair unit, or even individual weapons. Colliding with asteroids or other fighters would cause damage based on your relative speed and the shield levels of each ship. Thus you could see things like a damaged enemy Gratha burning his afterburners in an attempt to get away, plowing into an wayward asteroid, and exploding. These things weren't scripted-- they were emergent behaviors. Every mission was a bit different, and so was every replay.

Enemy fighters, when damaged beyond a certain amount, would attempt to run away, and you could attempt to chase them down by going full afterburners, but that might pull you away from the mission (especially bad if it was an escort mission)

When you got really good at the game, the AI would also get better to compensate, and in the expansion packs (the Secret Missions, of which Secret Missions I was the most awesome) you were often outnumbered and outgunned. You could even those odds by using your afterburners, flying your ship at the enemy and squirting off a stream of plasma bolts, hoping to get lucky and take one out in a single pass or at least take down their shields for the next run. They would also be firing at you, but if you hit your afterburners at the right time your momentum would carry you out of their range of fire.

The problem with this approach was twofold: you were much more likely to die by running into an asteroid or enemy fighter (which at full afterburners was often fatal) and on longer missions, you would often run out of afterburner fuel before the mission was complete. So completing the mission took some planning and constant reassessment of the risks you needed to take versus how much afterburner fuel you might need for later.

For a game that was released in 1990, that was pretty impressive, and many space sims that came later were missing one or more of those elements.
 
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pokrface

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944723#p28944723:janqax4o said:
phoenix_rizzen[/url]":janqax4o]Ran fine on a 386sx2 (no FPU!) running at 66 MHz.
80386DX didn't have in inboard FPU—you're thinking of the 486DX/SX distinction. An 80386SX had a 16-bit data bus instead of the DX version's 32-bit bus.

(Also, I don't think the clock rate on a 386 ever went higher than 40MHz!)
 
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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944723#p28944723:2rwv0gpn said:
phoenix_rizzen[/url]":2rwv0gpn]Played TIE Fighter first as I found it in the bargain bin (on CD). That game lead me to buying a Gravis joystick, as playing with the mouse just sucked. :) Ran fine on a 386sx2 (no FPU!) running at 66 MHz. Had to write a custom config.sys/autoexec.bat and not load Windows 3.1, but it ran just fine.

Then I found the collector's edition of X-Wing ... and was severally disappointed in it. The controls were just too wonky, and they were missing the "Match speed to opponent" feature!! Wasn't until later I realised X-Wing came out first. :)

A few computer upgrades later (486dx4 at 133 MHz with a Gravis UltraSound ACE soundcard, then a Pentium-MMX laptop at 166 MHz), I picked up a Thrustmaster USB joystick to go with Windows 98, and picked up X-Wing Alliance and Secret Weapons Over Normandy. Those were some great games!

I really miss the old days of space/flight combat games (they were NOT sims!). I can't stand the space combat sims that came out around then or that are available now. I don't want to worry about inertia, or physics of combat in space, or pitch/yaw/roll, or the andle of the ailerons, etc. I just want to fly around and shoot things, damn it!

Just found my Thrustmaster the other day and I am very tempted to head over to GoG to pick some of these up ... Just not sure how/when I could play them with a 3-year old and a 6-month old in the house ...

Get them to help you play! That's what I'm planning to do with my kids, anyway!
 
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Please please PLEASE help me find this space game from my childhood...

You could go on missions, but could also do this arena style dogfight thing with other bots. Mid 90's-00's? There were ships you could buy and sell too.

It was super annoying every time you had to go back to base because there would be this cutscene of your ship flying to the dock (like Freespace 2, but longer).

Man I wish I could provide more info....

Cheers, thanks and gig 'em!

Edit: Thank you Lee for this article. Was the reason I created the accnt. That Freespace 2 intro still gives me chills :p
 
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The greatest space sim ever made (if it can be categorized as that) was "Nexus : The Jupiter Incident."


It came after homeworld 2 which was more of a spaced based rts, but unlike the typical rts game, there was no economy/resource management.

ALL of the focus and management was on the ships in your fleet. You could custom fit specific weapon types after each mission based off points accrued. And my GOD the options that were there to make the comparative depth of a homeworld or freelancer look like a childrens toy in comparison. Hull damaging weapons that did greater damage to... hulls, shield damaging weapons that did more damage to shields so you could start making better use of those hull damaging weapons that were weak against shields. And then there were laser beam weapons that could pierce the shields and take out specific sub systems like engines/weapons/shields.


There were finite per mission missile weapons that did devastating damage, but could be countered with a ships electronic jamming systems, which could in turn be jammed by the firing missile ships own counter jamming systems. Such glorious mechanics of cat and mouse.

You could adjust the power levels to beef up weapons or engines or shields, it was the greatest tactical space sim of all time. The problem. Virtually NONE of you have either played it or knows it ever existed.

And so its shining example stays hidden in the past while lesser sims and rts variants take the spotlight.
 
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pokrface

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944809#p28944809:3jmxvabs said:
Not A Rocket Scientist[/url]":3jmxvabs]Get them to help you play! That's what I'm planning to do with my kids, anyway!
Yes. Please, yes, this. I cherish the memories of "gaming" with my dad—which was really almost all him doing the flying and me pointing at stuff and making suggestions and just...hanging out with my dad. Starflight, Elite, Space Quest, a bunch of others...gaming with my dad is probably why I love games so much, and those memories are one the greatest gifts I have.

If you have kids, game with them. You'll give them a lifetime of joyful memories to keep.
 
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SmokeTest

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944845#p28944845:qqa469wc said:
Pokrface[/url]":qqa469wc]
[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944809#p28944809:qqa469wc said:
Not A Rocket Scientist[/url]":qqa469wc]Get them to help you play! That's what I'm planning to do with my kids, anyway!
Yes. Please, yes, this. I cherish the memories of "gaming" with my dad—which was really almost all him doing the flying and me pointing at stuff and making suggestions and just...hanging out with my dad. Starflight, Elite, Space Quest, a bunch of others...gaming with my dad is probably why I love games so much, and those memories are one the greatest gifts I have.

If you have kids, game with them. You'll give them a lifetime of joyful memories to keep.
Also, it's ton's of fun in the moment. You get to play games AND spend time with your kids? What's not to love?
 
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ChronoReverse

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944827#p28944827:3amxlcxh said:
Sammael7[/url]":3amxlcxh]Hull damaging weapons that did greater damage to... hulls, shield damaging weapons that did more damage to shields so you could start making better use of those hull damaging weapons that were weak against shields. And then there were laser beam weapons that could pierce the shields and take out specific sub systems like engines/weapons/shields.


There were finite per mission missile weapons that did devastating damage, but could be countered with a ships electronic jamming systems, which could in turn be jammed by the firing missile ships own counter jamming systems. Such glorious mechanics of cat and mouse.

To be fair, Freespace 2 had all of those things.
 
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pokrface

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944827#p28944827:2bs1orwx said:
Sammael7[/url]":2bs1orwx]The greatest space sim ever made (if it can be categorized as that) was "Nexus : The Jupiter Incident."
...
And so its shining example stays hidden in the past while lesser sims and rts variants take the spotlight.
If it's this game, then that's very much a fleet-based RTS as opposed to a cockpit-style space combat sim. Very different kind of game. That looks a hell of a lot more like EVE than Freespace or Wing Commander.
 
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fitten

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944773#p28944773:22x5qwiz said:
Pokrface[/url]":22x5qwiz]
[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944723#p28944723:22x5qwiz said:
phoenix_rizzen[/url]":22x5qwiz]Ran fine on a 386sx2 (no FPU!) running at 66 MHz.
80386DX didn't have in inboard FPU—you're thinking of the 486DX/SX distinction. An 80386SX had a 16-bit data bus instead of the DX version's 32-bit bus.

(Also, I don't think the clock rate on a 386 ever went higher than 40MHz!)

And then, Intel's were 33MHz. AMD made one that was 40MHz (I had one). I also installed a 387 in mine... well... actually two of them. The first one I messed up and installed rotated 90 degrees... took a long time to boot and then said I didn't have a 387 installed! Which was the truth... it was just a little lump of molten silicon ;) The second... ah, but the second! stoodinstalled fine and was a good thing to have. I bought both of those while at college on a college student's budget... that first one being destroyed hurt pretty bad.
 
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akro

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Still have my Xwing floppies in the original box with the included mini novel. Same for Tie Fighter...

One of my funniest wing commander 1 memories is hitting autopilot when a ralari jumped in and the autopilot cinematic freaked out and I watched my ship go bouncing off the ralari.... never could reproduce it....
 
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phoenix_rizzen

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944773#p28944773:2jbttelu said:
Pokrface[/url]":2jbttelu]
[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944723#p28944723:2jbttelu said:
phoenix_rizzen[/url]":2jbttelu]Ran fine on a 386sx2 (no FPU!) running at 66 MHz.
80386DX didn't have in inboard FPU—you're thinking of the 486DX/SX distinction. An 80386SX had a 16-bit data bus instead of the DX version's 32-bit bus.

(Also, I don't think the clock rate on a 386 ever went higher than 40MHz!)

Whoops, sorry, fat-fingered that one. It was a Compaq Presario, 486sx2-66 all-in-one. Not a 386. I've updated my post.
 
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TimJongiLL

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Man, can't believe you listed the original Wing Commander - this was a great game but Privateer was where the series really became great - the openness of it, exploration and trading and a storyline that I can't remember for the life of me due to all of the extra stuff you could do!

Even more recently "Freelancer" was fine, even though it was a keyboard and mouse affair.

One last question, why did you not include the "X" series?
 
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Drizzt321

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[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944891#p28944891:21qp1vh5 said:
Pokrface[/url]":21qp1vh5]
[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944827#p28944827:21qp1vh5 said:
Sammael7[/url]":21qp1vh5]The greatest space sim ever made (if it can be categorized as that) was "Nexus : The Jupiter Incident."
...
And so its shining example stays hidden in the past while lesser sims and rts variants take the spotlight.
If it's this game, then that's very much a fleet-based RTS as opposed to a cockpit-style space combat sim. Very different kind of game. That looks a hell of a lot more like EVE than Freespace or Wing Commander.

Agreed, very different game. Still great, and more like a tactical RTS...In Space! Closer to HW/HW2 than EVE I'd say, although I never played EVE. I still recommend it though.
 
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Kilkenny

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Capital ships fired ridiculously large, ridiculously powerful beam weapons at each other, slicing each other to ribbons and providing a fantastic Babylon 5-esque backdrop while the player duels enemy fighters.
Those were awesome moments. I remember flying between capital ships when those beam weapons fire up & almost getting obliterated in the cross-fire. I must've jumped in my seat (and later check my face to see if my eyebrows had been burned off)

I'd also gotten Freespace 2 shortly after getting my first set of Altec Lansing speakers for my computer - complete with subwoofer. Man, at the time, gaming never sounded so good with laser flying, AA flak guns thundering, and all the rest. So good.

[url=http://meincmagazine.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=28944049#p28944049:3sykx9ak said:
Pokrface[/url]":3sykx9ak]Watch your back, Bangeman.
Given the context, I assume you meant "watch your six". :p
 
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Ezzy Black

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Though I could fight my way through the campaign to the Death Star trench run, I could never complete the mission, which required a protracted amount of dodging around obstacles and turbolaser fire

Dude! You fly to the side of the trench until the last minute. Then you dive in and bulls-eye that womp-rat. Not so hard :)

Yeah, it's kind of cheat-y-ish, but it works (or worked back then).
 
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tcowher

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In every discussion I have seen about X-wing and Tie Fighter, two of my most favorite games people never mention the accuracy differences. If you play the orginal X-wing and Tie fighter back to back you will notice this near the large ships. In X-wing they will pummel you hard right if the bat but in Tie fighter they miss much more often. I understand it is a gameplay mechanic but it did make later missions when you got ships with shields much easier.
 
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