Google doubles Plus membership with brute-force signup process

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RGMBill

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It REALLY pissed me off that Google pulled a backhanded move a six weeks ago with Lattitude on Android. My wife and I use it all the time to know where each other is (we can't always call each other for various reasons even though we want to know where the other is, such as when she's driving home (an hour drive). Lattitude didn't need Google+; it could work based on just an Gmail account; it worked that way since we got our DroidXs the day they came out back in July 2010. But six weeks ago, Google pushed out an update that DISABLED Lattitude if you didn't have Google+. The only way to get it working was to get a Google+ account.

I don't do social media. PERIOD. So this kind of BS move is DEFINITELY Google being Evil, forcing me to do something I didn't have to do previously to enjoy a service so they could pad stats. Google long ago abandoned the "Don't be evil" mantra. Google+ is just more proof. I'm really starting to lose trust and respect for them as a brand with this.
 
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gold163

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The Ugly":1hy33yoa said:
How is this different from Microsoft bundling internet explorer with Windows?

Google has dominant positions in search, youtube, and large marketshare in webmail.

They are far behind Facebook in social networking, but trying to use their search monopoly to force users into their system.

Microsoft doesn't force you to use Internet Explorer as your browser. The way Google is implementing Google+ indicates that they very much want to make it inseparable from their other services, which makes a lot of current Google users who are not Google+ users very uncomfortable. On the other hand, if you don't like Internet Explorer you can't really uninstall it but at least you can use Firefox. If you want to use Google Docs or Gmail and don't currently have a Google account, fat luck. Although I guess it's nice you can still delete Google+ if you don't want to use it, but I wouldn't be surprised if Google eventually forced people to use G+ accounts.
 
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fidget42

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The Ugly":a5f4blnf said:
How is this different from Microsoft bundling internet explorer with Windows?

Google has dominant positions in search, youtube, and large marketshare in webmail.

They are far behind Facebook in social networking, but trying to use their search monopoly to force users into their system.

And that is one of the things that got Microsoft in trouble. It is called tying.
 
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Sphynx

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Been a gmail & youtube user for a long time. Saw the little 'upgrade to google+' button some months ago and still continue to ignore it. Don't need, don't want. But then, I don't use facebook or twitter either.

Personally, I agree this is an anoying move but see it no different to that of Microsoft's peddling of IE, WMP, MSOffice or Bing. Something that's set to get a whole lot worse come Win 8. That's right folks - time to start stockpiling Win 7 keys.
 
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nikhilw

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at office, I work on a product development and I find it 'natural' to integrate our product with various others from our company, I mean I dont find it evil in any case.. Its simple, you want x, you get y- it just provides better experience on product x, its better integrated! Not to say forcing a product down someone's throat is great, but then there should be a way to disable it completely, and then you can say that it will be disabled at d cost of ease and better user experience.. Doesnt google provide a way to disable it? Then?
 
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The Cappy

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The Ugly":1og3y4wb said:
How is this different from Microsoft bundling internet explorer with Windows?

Google has dominant positions in search, youtube, and large marketshare in webmail.


Beat me to it. Not only is this the same strategy, it's also nearly the same language.

"...so deeply integrated that..."

It's like deja vu all over again.

The Ugly":1og3y4wb said:
They are far behind Facebook in social networking, but trying to use their search monopoly to force users into their system.

I remember when people said the exact same thing about Internet Explorer vs Netscape.
 
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.Darien

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I honestly can't figure out WHY Google is doing this. I mean... I understand from a business standpoint - this move will push people towards Google+, and hopefully they'll reach a critical mass where someone has most of their friends on Google+ and can actually use it for social networking (as opposed to just reading posts by popular tech bloggers).

What I don't understand is why they'd do this when the monopoly problems are so likely to bite them in the ass. It makes no sense to take a risk like this.
 
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ok. I just made a new google account. While your new account allows you to use all service, including Google+, there was nothing forcing me to go to Google+. I could go to the search engine and mail just like before. So what exactly is the problem here? Most people would gripe if they had to sign up for every Google service independently I would think. Don't like Google+, don't use it. I have a Google+ account that I have used in the past and I have no problem ignoring it now.
 
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singularity6":1tbp60i9 said:
I honestly like Google + the way it is now... I ditched Facebook because I was sick of all the bullshit that went along with it. Facebook was nice when it was small, and restricted to the professional/academic worlds. If G+ remains relatively exclusive to the tech-savvy, I'll be happy!

And when it doesn't, you will hate it as well, I suppose.
 
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Alfonse

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The Ugly":1pen7uq2 said:
How is this different from Microsoft bundling internet explorer with Windows?

Google has dominant positions in search, youtube, and large marketshare in webmail.

They are far behind Facebook in social networking, but trying to use their search monopoly to force users into their system.

It isn't. Facebook, the DOJ, or state attorney's general simply haven't sued Google for it. If nobody calls you on it, it's not illegal.
 
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jbrodkin

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TechGeek":36ip6frj said:
ok. I just made a new google account. While your new account allows you to use all service, including Google+, there was nothing forcing me to go to Google+. I could go to the search engine and mail just like before. So what exactly is the problem here? Most people would gripe if they had to sign up for every Google service independently I would think. Don't like Google+, don't use it. I have a Google+ account that I have used in the past and I have no problem ignoring it now.

Your new Google+ account will show up in public search results, even if you don't use it and didn't intend to create it (the process is such that you may not even realize you've created it). That may bother some people, or it may not.
 
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MrMalthus

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Any action taken during a logged-in Google session—whether it be searching the Internet, checking Gmail or using Google Docs—counts as engagement under the statistic Page used.

has this actually been confirmed anywhere? I imagine it has to be something *like* that for the number to be so high, but I agree with your original coverage that if it was as simple as doing a search the number would be much higher (I seriously doubt 40% of people going to the effort of making an account use bing for searching the web).

And, the new signup process encompassing all services has its advantages. Once you've completed the process from the Google homepage, you automatically have accounts with Google+, Gmail, Picasa, Google Docs, and more. That is convenient—although it would be nice if you were provided the list of services and the ability to choose which ones you want (and don't want) prior to completing the process.

I really have to disagree with the sentiment in this thread so far, and agree more with this (except the last sentence). I think people are getting annoyed that a) features are being added that they don't want and b) they are then being counted in a statistic they don't support.

I agree that the 90 million number is probably BS (at least in the implications of what most of us mean when we say "user"), but do you get upset that when you sign up for gmail that you get access to google docs? Do you think of that as also getting a "google docs account"? No, because that would be dumb.

In a year it will just be a google account that you're signing up for, and google+ will just be another service you do or don't use. Yes, it will exist if you want to use things like latitude, apparently, but if you never add anyone to your circles, does it even matter? tree falling in the forest and all that.

The docs thing is a good analogy again: what would it mean to have a list at signup that lets you choose not to use google docs? It wouldn't show up in the drop down list of services? If that's the only advantage, it sounds like a UI problem, not one with accounts. google+ is a little different if it defaults to a public profile, but, again, it sounds like the only thing they need to do is add a checkbox for "don't make my profile public" on the sign up page.

[edit: or better, "make my profile public", and default off, but I don't know how realistic that is :)]
 
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okungnyo

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"Evil?" What's evil about a company trying to stay relevant? You might as well bash Microsoft for giving you access to all Windows Live services when you signup for Hotmail. Or Facebook for giving you a free @facebook.com address when you wanted to just a Facebook account.

Actually, I just remembered something: They're free services! Everything I mentioned (Google+, Windows Live, Facebook) is completely free. Just don't use it!

Do you sign up for separate Calendar, Docs, and Gmail accounts? No? So what's the difference between Google+ and other Google services? If you only use certain Google services (such as Gmail and YouTube), then just ignore the ones you don't use! (Google+, Docs, Calendar) You don't lose anything by not using them, you're not paying for the space, are you? "omg they're so evil!! they're giving us free space that we dont have to use!!"
 
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jbrodkin

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MrMalthus":jtz9w2ia said:
Any action taken during a logged-in Google session—whether it be searching the Internet, checking Gmail or using Google Docs—counts as engagement under the statistic Page used.

has this actually been confirmed anywhere? I imagine it has to be something *like* that for the number to be so high, but I agree with your original coverage that if it was as simple as doing a search the number would be much higher (I seriously doubt 40% of people going to the effort of making an account use bing for searching the web).

Yes, Google has confirmed this. I see what you're saying, but remember people can still use Google search without being logged in.
 
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tatose

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okungnyo":2bgkggbg said:
"Evil?" What's evil about a company trying to stay relevant? You might as well bash Microsoft for giving you access to all Windows Live services when you signup for Hotmail. Or Facebook for giving you a free @facebook.com address when you wanted to just a Facebook account.

Actually, I just remembered something: They're free services! Everything I mentioned (Google+, Windows Live, Facebook) is completely free. Just don't use it!

Do you sign up for separate Calendar, Docs, and Gmail accounts? No? So what's the difference between Google+ and other Google services? If you only use certain Google services (such as Gmail and YouTube), then just ignore the ones you don't use! (Google+, Docs, Calendar) You don't lose anything by not using them, you're not paying for the space, are you? "omg they're so evil!! they're giving us free space that we dont have to use!!"

Nah, the issues emerge from the paranoia that is Privacy versus Google.

The paranoia is legitimate IMO, by providing 'un-necessary' services (which contributes to public visibility) to existing subset of Google users who do not need those services, people thinks the "trust has been broken".
 
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stummies

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buggsy2":1q3u2ff9 said:
"do no evil"; but lying and scamming are just business

People need to quit bringing this up, evil is a subjective principle that depends on the point of view. I may/may not agree, but to act like we've been scammed is ridiculous.

Personally I thought their released numbers would be due to something like this, I know very few people that actively use their Google+. Though that could be bias due to demographics.
 
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NicoleC

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I have been moving my usage away from Google because they are intent on systematically destroying the UI for anything except a smartphone. My content on Reader, Docs and Picassa has all been removed but I can't "delete" those accounts. I played with Google+ and deleted it after a while. At some point I was forced to create a You Tube account, too. I've even been switching search engines.

I'm still looking for a good alternative to Gmail.

okungnyo":2j9o2ami said:
Do you sign up for separate Calendar, Docs, and Gmail accounts? No? So what's the difference between Google+ and other Google services?

I don't remember about Calendar, but yes, I *did* sign up for Google Docs way back when. And the difference is that my document names and calendar entries and email subjects are not indexed in a public search engine -- and Google+ is.
 
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AdamM":1bp4ums5 said:
molitors":1bp4ums5 said:
Google+ is dead. There's no one there. All these numbers being parroted by google are pure lies.

Burden of proof is on you.
Actually, the burden of proof is on Google to prove these numbers are real. About the only demographic that's on G+ are males, 30+, IT professionals. Everyone else is on Twitter or FB.
 
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It's kinda surprising that the Microsoft way of doing social networking is actually the most privacy-friendly. As bass-ackwards as they used to be, I've actually found myself pleasantly surprised by a lot of their offerings.

Their intelligent mail scanning (finding things like pictures, tracking numbers, documents, etc.) makes it insanely easy to find what you're looking for in your mail. Wish they'd add that kind of intelligence into Outlook, honestly. Windows Live lets you tie in other services from outside their network one at a time if you choose. Google's is EASIER, but you also have less control. Being able to create a "sub" email account (a fake email account for certain kinds of email) that you see from your main account is also nice. I've set up an entire fake email for services I want to try out without long-term commitment, but that I might not want to throw away the email for, and I can access it from within my main mailbox.

Also, I think the Docs.com integration with Facebook is more powerful long-term than Google Docs sharing (although co-editing is damn fun in Google Docs.

Basically, if you're looking to get away from the Goog, I'd say try out Windows Live. It's not half as bad as it used to be, and a lot of their services have features that supersede Google.
 
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I really don't like the way that Google is handling this one.

That said, I trust the competition even less. At the end of the day, we are dealing with for profit corporations here. Google seems to be the sort of least bad of the evils, but the way things are going .... it's bad enough.

These sorts of things should be optional.
 
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Speaking of shaky statistics, I am ass-tired of every journalist this side of Neptune trotting out this one:

Facebook has 800 million active users, and 50 percent of them log in each day, an impressive feat given that Facebook is really just one site (albeit one with hooks into many other websites).

If surfing the Internet, watching television and putting 2 and 2 together counts as a way of gathering information, my guess is that over half of those 800 million Facepalm users is a business of some kind. Every website I visit makes damn sure to tell me I need to befriend them on Facecrap, as does every one of my local TV networks and their individual shows.

Of the two 'evil' corporate overlords, I'll pick Google every time. At least they provide me with some great, useful apps on an everyday basis such as the best search on the planet, and a decent, free email service. Yes, I know they are recording my every move...
 
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They may be telling the analysts about how many users they are signing up, but that isn't going to go very far with analysts when stories like this get reported.

Prediction:

Analyst on earnings conference call: "Sure, but what's the real usage number?"
Google: "We are not going to disclose that at this time."
Analyst: "Right. Can't you just run Google Analytics on it or something?"
Google: "Er, no... we're just not going to talk about it."
Analyst: "I see. Well, shucks, I guess I'll just focus on the big number your pushing..." (*snort*)
 
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jbrodkin

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darkowl":1o4pho6p said:
One current issue for people on G+ is that you are supposed to use your real name - no pseudonyms. That could be a problem for some.

I have found in further tests of the signup process that using an obviously fake name-like one with a bunch of consonants in a row- can prevent creation of a Google+ account. However, Google claims it plans to support pseudonyms at some undefined future time.
 
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