First look: Mozilla Weave 0.2 puts Firefox in the cloud

Mozilla has announced the availability of Weave 0.2, the new version of its Firefox synchronization add-on. Ars tests this version and takes a close look at the underlying architecture.<BR><BR>Read More

 

[astrashe]

Is Mozilla going to provide hosting for the data for free? How would that work?<BR><BR>I've used different sync plugins in the past, and I find them to be really useful, although they've never really worked perfectly. So this one sounds really great to me.

 

[modeless]

How does synchronizing tabs work when you have multiple instances of Firefox running at the same time?

 

[ronelson]

Any comparisons to the wonder Google Browser Sync, which Google is not providing for FF3? That's the only thing holding me back.

 

[corrosive_nf]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ronelson:<BR>Any comparisons to the wonder Google Browser Sync, which Google is not providing for FF3? That's the only thing holding me back. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Yeah weave is a POS. It crashes FF3 on OSX and is slow as dogshit on windows.

 

[FoO]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ronelson:<BR>Any comparisons to the wonder Google Browser Sync, which Google is not providing for FF3? That's the only thing holding me back. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Google is on record as recommending Weave to replace google sync. And Weave was what initiated the ending of google sync.<BR>Mileage may vary as seen in the post above. I use weave on an OS X install and two XP installs flawlessly and since weave came out of labs. Never experienced any issues with it, always worked great.<BR>It helps to get your bookmarks straightened up, make one of your machines the master, then clear out the local data from your other machines before syncing with weave.<BR>corrosive_nf - you sure you don't have some corruption going on?<BR>I think that your experience is more the exception than the rule. Either that or you're just bitter about Google sync. Why don't you ask Google employees what /they/ use? <<BR>astrashe - yes, they're storing it for free.<BR><BR>FoO

 

[dhaveconfig]

Remember Google Browser Sync has gone open source

 

[grenavitar]

I find it wise to expect alpha results out of alpha software and then be surprised by anything better. I have also found from participating on the Weave forums that many users who are facing problems with logging in, etc. just don't read the forums to find out that accounts were wiped for 0.2.0.<BR><BR>That being said if you want beta/rc/final results don't use Weave. It is slow in syncing and causes some slowness with Firefox but that's partially because they haven't yet transitioned from time-based syncing to smarter syncing.<BR><BR>It's buggier than GBS but will be more powerful. If you don't like testing alpha software then don't use it--there are other alternatives, I believe (FoxMarks?). If you do want to help out be ready to rtfm (i.e. Weave forums) and help report bugs. That's what the developers need.

 

[FoO]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by grenavitar:<BR>I find it wise to expect alpha results out of alpha software and then be surprised by anything better. I have also found from participating on the Weave forums that many users who are facing problems with logging in, etc. just don't read the forums to find out that accounts were wiped for 0.2.0.<BR><BR>That being said if you want beta/rc/final results don't use Weave. It is slow in syncing and causes some slowness with Firefox but that's partially because they haven't yet transitioned from time-based syncing to smarter syncing.<BR><BR>It's buggier than GBS but will be more powerful. If you don't like testing alpha software then don't use it--there are other alternatives, I believe (FoxMarks?). If you do want to help out be ready to rtfm (i.e. Weave forums) and help report bugs. That's what the developers need. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Foxmarks is now compatible with 3.0. And you can access your bookmarks online, which is a nice feature not available in weave.<BR><BR>FoO

 

[typhus]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The latest version extends this functionality to also cover cookies, passwords, tabs, and form contents. </div></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR><BR>This will be interesting. Form contents will include credit card data. Since PCI is an industry regulated set of compliance rules there is no way to enforce anything but it's not going to be secure.

 

[wicker_man]

Opera's sync is pretty good, even though it's still in beta - been using it for some time.

 

[FoO]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by typhus:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The latest version extends this functionality to also cover cookies, passwords, tabs, and form contents. </div></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR><BR>This will be interesting. Form contents will include credit card data. Since PCI is an industry regulated set of compliance rules there is no way to enforce anything but it's not going to be secure. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Albeit it's only like six or seven sites that I actually buy anything from, but none of them seem to store cc#'s as form data for me in firefox. Are you seeing something different?<BR><BR>FoO

 

[Herve5]

I'll financially sponsor Weave when I'm sure I can install a server on my basic, shared hosting server (ie, PHP/MySQL but no Webdav support).<BR><BR>Otherwise, just getting an open fundation to use it with private servers isn't seducing at all for me...<BR><BR>(and don't tell me that's impossible: I already use PHPiCalendar over there, which does simulate a webdav answer for my iCal to publish over there)

 

[FoO]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Herve5:<BR>I'll financially sponsor Weave when I'm sure I can install a server on my basic, shared hosting server (ie, PHP/MySQL but no Webdav support).<BR><BR>Otherwise, just getting an open fundation to use it with private servers isn't seducing at all for me...<BR><BR>(and don't tell me that's impossible: I already use PHPiCalendar over there, which does simulate a webdav answer for my iCal to publish over there) </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Weave Prefs >> Server Field (specify server).<BR>Check mozilla fora. They might let you beta test the local server for yourself. I'd try to act a bit more friendly than you're doing here though. Or maybe less pessimistic. ::shrug::<BR><BR>FoO

 

[markpeak]

I, also with many others, encounter the problem with Weave server and this seems not to be fixed yet.<BR><BR>See Weave Forum for details

 

[danchr]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wicker_man:<BR>Opera's sync is pretty good, even though it's still in beta - been using it for some time. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Indeed, and the fact that it works with Opera Mini is great; now all they need to do is fix the desktop browser interface.<BR><BR>What I would really like to see is a good cross-browser synchronisation solution that would allow me to keep various browsers on various machines in sync, whether it's Safari, Opera, Konqueror or Firefox.

 

[ronelson]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I have also found from participating on the Weave forums that many users who are facing problems with logging in, etc. just don't read the forums to find out that accounts were wiped for 0.2.0. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Any software is guaranteed to fail if you must be a forum participant to successfully use it. That kind of information should be, I dunno, maybe in the release notes? (complaint waived if it was and those people didn't read it)<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Google is on record as recommending Weave to replace google sync. And Weave was what initiated the ending of google sync. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Weave did not even have the same functionality as GBS when GBS was cancelled. It is also disappointing that the Weave site has been unavailable for large segments of time over the past couple of weeks - not a good way to inspire a prospective user base that GBS pointed at them.<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">If you don't like testing alpha software then don't use it--there are other alternatives, I believe (FoxMarks?). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Synchronizing booksmarks is fine and dandy, but it's the *other* stuff that I care about - form data, passwords, history, even the tabs I have open.

 

[corrosive_nf]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FoO:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ronelson:<BR>Any comparisons to the wonder Google Browser Sync, which Google is not providing for FF3? That's the only thing holding me back. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>corrosive_nf - you sure you don't have some corruption going on?<BR>I think that your experience is more the exception than the rule. Either that or you're just bitter about Google sync. Why don't you ask Google employees what /they/ use? <<BR><BR>FoO </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Ive experienced this on multiple machines with a variety of operating systems. Its a POS. It either gets in a login loop, or just outright crashes FF.

 

[Deleted member 14629]

Jebus people, it's a .2 version of software. Don't expect production-level features or stability out of it. If you don't test nightly builds of Firefox, then Weave .2 likely isn't for you.<BR><BR>Yes, that does leave a gap in what Browser Sync was offering. I suggest either sucking it up on Weave and submitting bug reports to help them work on it better, or use Foxmarks until then.

 

[picklefactory]

I'll do it when I can run my own Weave server. It's my data -- my bookmarks, my plugins, my logins and passwords. Why on earth would I want to give it to a cloud?

 

[anazoal]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Happysin:<BR>Jebus people, it's a .2 version of software. Don't expect production-level features or stability out of it. If you don't test nightly builds of Firefox, then Weave .2 likely isn't for you.<BR><BR>Yes, that does leave a gap in what Browser Sync was offering. I suggest either sucking it up on Weave and submitting bug reports to help them work on it better, or use Foxmarks until then. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>No, but in an obtuse way I hold the Weave developers responsible for the demise of Google Browser Sync. And how on earth have they managed to screw up the client to server sync routine? Now I can't get rid of the server side lock (yes, I tried removing the server lock in preferences).<BR><BR>2008-07-03 10:20:23 Async.Generator ERROR Exception: Could not acquire lock (lock already held)<BR>2008-07-03 10:20:32 Async.Generator ERROR Exception: Could not acquire lock (lock already held)<BR>2008-07-03 10:20:37 Async.Generator ERROR Exception: Could not acquire lock (lock already held)<BR>...<BR>2008-07-03 10:25:20 Service.Main INFO Running scheduled sync<BR>2008-07-03 10:25:20 Async.Generator ERROR Exception: Could not acquire lock (lock already held)

 

[neoscsi]

Until Weave is working nicely, there is always Foxmarks. I was skeptical at first, but it was a lot more polished than Google Bookmark Sync ever was. I'd often have machines go out of sync with Google. Never with Foxmarks.

 

[neoscsi]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by typhus:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The latest version extends this functionality to also cover cookies, passwords, tabs, and form contents. </div></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR><BR>This will be interesting. Form contents will include credit card data. Since PCI is an industry regulated set of compliance rules there is no way to enforce anything but it's not going to be secure. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>PCI-DSS only applies to merchants and transaction processing service providers. The PAN needs to be encrypted on the mechant and service providers' end. Since it would be the end user sending his plaintext information to a 3rd party service this wouldn't apply.

 

[Izzmo]

What the.. hasn't anyone heard of Maxthon? That was their whole theory behind the browser. And it works great and fast too, not to mention there are loads of plugins and mods for it.<BR><BR>Ignorant people!

 

[neoscsi]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Izzmo:<BR>What the.. hasn't anyone heard of Maxthon? That was their whole theory behind the browser. And it works great and fast too, not to mention there are loads of plugins and mods for it.<BR><BR>Ignorant people! </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Except we're talking about Firefox add-ons, something Maxthon isn't.<BR><BR>From what I can tell, Maxthon is an extension for IE or its own browser. It also is Windows only.

 

[Tekzel]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Happysin:<BR><B>Jebus people, it's a .2 version of software. Don't expect production-level features or stability out of it.</B> If you don't test nightly builds of Firefox, then Weave .2 likely isn't for you.<BR><BR>Yes, that does leave a gap in what Browser Sync was offering. I suggest either sucking it up on Weave and submitting bug reports to help them work on it better, or use Foxmarks until then. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>This is the second time I have seen this point posted in this thread and I just wanted to point out how saddened I am by the fact that it has to be posted once, much less twice. <BR><BR>It is very early alpha software, don't whine about it. Test it, post bugs in the appropriate place so they can get fixed and move on. If you don't like doing that, don't run the freaking software. It is just that simple. I like the concept, I don't want to deal with bugs in it, so I am not using it. When its a little closer to a wide release I will be using it.

 

[manys]

It's a nonstarter for me without me being able to sync only against my own server.

 

[ronelson]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">This is the second time I have seen this point posted in this thread and I just wanted to point out how saddened I am by the fact that it has to be posted once, much less twice. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>For better or for worse, I'm holding it up against GBS. I'm not trying to be some asshole about how they should be perfect, but because it will need to match or exceed GBS's capabilities for me to move off of FF2 with GBS.<BR><BR>I am more disappointed in Google's decision to drop GBS than I am in Weave's shortcomings.

 

[bunklung]

Cut and paste from my post here<BR> GBS Goes Open Source<BR><BR>"I tried Weave 0.2.0 and it's certainly no GBS as far as tab restoration goes.<BR><BR>Main differences:<BR>1. Weave will not remember your previous tabs on the SAME computer, you have to turn on 'Show my windows and tabs from last time' on each computer.<BR><BR>2. To restore tabs on ANOTHER computer you must find the little tiny exclamation icon in the lower right of FF, THEN check each and every tab you want to "restore" that was from another computer, then you click ok.<BR><BR>3. If you close a tab from work and it already exists on you home computer it will not close when you get home. You have to manually close tabs and new tabs will have to be checked off (see 2.)<BR><BR>I'm really hopefully that they make Weave more friendly and automatic like GBS was, but I am not holding my breath.<BR><BR>I hope someone takes this code and brings GBS back to life. I'll cross my fingers for that one."<BR><BR>Here is a thread I started on Weave's official forums on a Weave and GBS comparison:<BR> GBS and Weave Comparison

 

[bbassett]

To everyone who wants to sync against their own server, it's really simple to do so. The server side is simply a WebDAV accessible web server. (There are a few mozilla.org-based account managements services, but they aren't required to use Weave on your own server.)<BR><BR>It's kinda confusing setting up the Weave extension to use your server, but once you set the advanced preferences, it's just a case of signing in using the user/pass that your WebDAV has been configured to authenticate.

 

[Quitch]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ronelson:<BR>Any comparisons to the wonder Google Browser Sync, which Google is not providing for FF3? That's the only thing holding me back. </div></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>Weave isn't as reliable yet, but it's only version 0.2 so that's not a surprise. I'd say 0.2 is "good enough" for most people holding off, but it's far from reliable, I still get the odd Firefox pause while it does something, or strange connection failures, and the sync process when you close Firefox goes on a good long while and I'm never sure why.<BR><BR>It's very much a work in progress, but the end destination is far more ambitious than the (superb) Google Sync.

 

[hanser]

Mind-bogglingly unreliable thus far. While the plugin software is stable enough (from what I can see) to be called beta, the server-side is most definitely alpha. I have yet to synchronize anything, and creating my account took ~4 tries over the course of 36 hours.<br><br>I'm really wanting this to work because I don't care for GBS (and it's now d/c'd), and I use multiple OSes, and it's a PITA to re-enter your passwords for each site when you're using a different OS.<br><br>Weave has been "Synchronizing your data" for the last ten minutes. Just like when I tried it yesterday.<br><br><blockquote class="ip-ubbcode-quote">
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div>
<div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Izzmo:<br>What the.. hasn't anyone heard of Maxthon? That was their whole theory behind the browser. And it works great and fast too, not to mention there are loads of plugins and mods for it.<br><br>Ignorant people! </div>
</blockquote> As if the entire world uses Windows, or wants to use MSHTML even if they do. -- View image here: http://episteme.meincmagazine.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif --<br><br>Ignorant indeed.