Fallout versions - try the old ones? Stick with the new?

JohnCarter17

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Fallout 1 had a bug with the Gun Runners where an NPC would block the path to get off of their island surrounded by goo. You walk onto the island, buy something, then it's impossible to escape because the path back to land is 1 square wide and is occupied. This was even published in Computer Gaming World back in the day.

I forget whether you had the option to try to kill all of them and lose access to their shop or if combat was disabled in this area.
Wasn't there a patch released where you could "push" people who are in doorways or blocking?
 

JohnCarter17

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The fact that this thread exists must be a sign (from The Master, I shouldn't wonder). This is going to sound weird, but I have a question: how should I play Fallout 2 so as to enjoy it?

Background: I got it into my head to play the Fallout games in order. I finished Fallout last year, thought it was good. Clunky (expected and understood, given its age), not exactly my favourite genre (I find the nuclear post-apocalypse bleak), but good.

Moved on to 2, and am making my way through it. I looked up a guide or two on how to make a strong player character -- I do that, with games where I don't feel like spending the time to figure out builds on my own -- but tried my hardest to avoid spoilers as to where to go in the game or what to do.

So now I'm playing the game, and am feeling a bit at a loss as to where to go next, or more generally how to approach the thing.

I went from the Arroyo to the Den to Klamath and then to Redding, where I learned I was too underleveled to complete all of the quests in the town. (I fought some wanamingos in the caves, it was hard.) Not knowing exactly what to do next, I decided to head for Vault city -- many hostile random encounters along the way, had to stop. In travelling, I came across Modoc, which seems to have at least one story-relevant quest -- I guess I'll continue here?

So, coming back to my question: is being in the dark as to where you're supposed to go next part of the intended game experience, do you think? Or am I just missing something? I'd like to avoid figuring out the game by sheer repetition (saving and loading), if at all possible.
Modoc is some easy exp. But you really need to get over to Vault City and work the Vault City <-> Gecko story lines. There is a ton of exp. Vault City is also clutch as a source of renewable skill books.
 

Ardax

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Apteris

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No. That "patch" was Fallout 2. :D

You can run Fallout 1 on Fallout 2's engine though. Details in https://meincmagazine.com/civis/threa...ones-stick-with-the-new.1511840/post-44331794
That was hilarious.

I seem to have gotten quite into Fallout 2. Unique atmosphere, interesting world.

The 8-bit color palette looks bad on my IPS computer monitor. I'm trying to remember if games with only 256 colors always looked this bad, because I remember them more fondly than this. (In particular, I'm wondering if the transitions between nearby colors were always this "sharp".)
 
That was hilarious.

I seem to have gotten quite into Fallout 2. Unique atmosphere, interesting world.

The 8-bit color palette looks bad on my IPS computer monitor. I'm trying to remember if games with only 256 colors always looked this bad, because I remember them more fondly than this. (In particular, I'm wondering if the transitions between nearby colors were always this "sharp".)
There were no LCDs back then so it would've been tested against the sorta-aliasing of a CRT.

Which reminds me: I remember getting my first LCD, playing Neverwinter Nights 1 or 2 (I think 2) and being disappointed about the black levels being more grey than black -- the bad old days of 1? backlight for the entire screen.
 
For those wanting a new isometric Fallout-like, Atom RPG is pretty good though there are some newbie-gotchas:

  • Unarmed and melee are a bad idea for mid to late game
  • You need a startling level of Speech skill - much higher than your gun skill in the early game
  • Barter is more important than in Fallout since ammo is scarce and expensive
  • Dexterity is a critical skill so you can get off 2 shots per turn. Most guides recommend 10 dex
  • Personality is also important or some people won't talk to you and one companion can't be recruited. 6 for males, 4 for females
  • Weapons have Strength requirements, 6 for most automatic weapons, 7-8 for some rifles, one pistol, light machine guns. You can get 3 stat increase during the game from quests/dungeons
 
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DarthSlack

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Agreed. I recall loading and sometimes it gets stuck. This would after playing a while. The workaround was quit FNV and reload the game. It also happened more often depending on all the mods. There is a brilliant Bounty Hunter mod series for FNV.

Was that New Vegas Bounties? I've played that one and the first one is brilliant. I've never been able to finish the second mod because the final boss fight has so many things shooting that my computer keeps crashing.
 
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JohnCarter17

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Was that New Vegas Bounties? I've played that one and the first one is brilliant. I've never been able to finish the second mod because the final boss fight has so many things shooting that my computer keeps crashing.
Yeah, New Vegas Bounties. I have gone through that a second time. IIRC, he added a new "northern area" for part 2 that you travelled to.

I also installed New California on FO4, got most of the way through then there was some issue near the end. IIRC, you travelled to a Capitol type area, and I think there was a betrayal, then there was a battle outside, and then I ran into an issue there.
 
I finished playing Atom War and enjoyed it enough to pick up the Trudgrad continuation.

If you enjoy isometric turn-based post-apocalypse games like FO 1-2-Tactics and Wasteland 2-3 you'll probably like this too.

Things that caught me off guard since I was going by Fallout experience:

  • Dexterity is critical for action points and the order of attacks (sequence), less so for dodge chance which is much less useful than armor protection. DEX = 10 is strongly recommended
  • Personality = 6 for men, = 4 for women is useful for being able to talk to people and get some rewards like skill training. Lower for women because they can get a +2 boost by using perfume twice later in the game.
  • Strength = 6 for most rifles and automatic weapons, = 7 for endgame light machine guns, rifles, one "special" pistol
  • Luck is useful if you want to try for a rifle crit build, but it's fine to make it a dump stat and take the Unlucky Optimist distinction to get more stat points

- Glutton distinction is recommended because food is plentiful.

It's possible to get 3-4 points of stat increases in the game but one of them requires an insane amount of grinding (fishing)

Weapons

Martial arts and melee are fine for early- to mid-game but poor later on because everyone has high-powered guns and will shoot you while you're running to them. Don't have anyone put points into melee or unarmed, even if a companion looks like they were designed for it.

Skills
  • Speechcraft is very useful for conversions including increasing your rewards. Put enough points into it to reach 60 ASAP. Later checks in the second area need 93 then more later on.
  • Barter lowers prices as expected but passing a Barter check with vendors can earn an additional discount. Try to get 60 soon.
  • Tinker for crafting is useful early-to-mid game but not in late game. Getting it up to something like 40 eventually is fine
  • You can look up tinkering recipes online instead of buying them

Crafting

Good for some early- to mid-game weapons and simple grenades, and also consumables like cigarettes (+8 tinker), joints (+1 Personality), zip gun and crossbow ammo (no other ammo). Crafting success gives XP but success is RNG-based so save scumming is recommended!

Tutorial Area:

Everything you do or pick up disappears after the tutorial, except for the XP you gain. Do all the tutorial stuff for XP, and also grab all the junk and do all the crafting you can for more XP. You can earn close to a full level worth of XP this way.

Spoiler about the campfire after you leave:
the developers designed this so you can't win. If you find an old video showing how to win, that no longer works. Accept your defeat then go around the area looking for junk to scavenge.

Cheesing Fights: Inventory

There are 4 boss fights in the game where I needed to do this even on Easy difficulty. If you spend 4 action points to go to inventory you can reload all of the party's guns, swap out "everyday" guns for the specials that use scarce ammo, and have them take stimpacks to heal. That 4 AP allows unlimited inventory actions.

Trudograd notes:

You can import your Atom War character if you didn't mod the game or use the console. At import time you get back all of your stat points, skill points, ability points, and distinctions to re-assign. Something to keep in mind is if you find a trainer or skill book for Martial Arts in Atom War you can turn those points into Rifles or anything else when you import the character.
 
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