Bambu Lab pushes a “control system” for 3D printers, and boy, did it not go well

Security measure? Boxing out third-party tools? Or something more complex?

See full article...

 

[bstoner]

I don't understand this obsession with connecting every electronic device to the internet. My fridge, washer, thermostat, TV, 3d printer, don't need to be tracking everything I do and sending the telemetry back to a manufacturer. If I can't use the device offline I don't buy it. This just ensures I will never buy one of their 3d printers!

 

[The Wonderful Wizard]

As far as the key being easily extracted, that doesn't matter for their primary aim of boxing out competition. The DMCA makes the lock as good as Fort Knox even if it's really a Mast Lock 607 from a business perspective because it becomes illegal to mess with the DRM. They don't have to actually achieve their fig leaf goal of improving security to achieve their real goal of rent seeking.

Their statements that it isn’t meant to lock down the printer and won’t be used for rent-seeking and is just a security tool for the user might undermine an argument that it is a technical protection measure. After all, they’ve said it isn’t protecting any copyright at all, not even the figleaf involved in printer DRM

 

[Ozy]

Bambu does have to be careful though because that reoccurring revenue is partly driven by people printing 3D models posted on Makerworld

If you want to print something you see you're going to need not just the filament but any additional parts those prints might need.

For example my last purchase from Bambu was three different DIY kits that Bambu was selling. Things like an LED Lamp Kit collection.

If they piss off people developing 3D models they'll lose this reoccurring revenue.

As a X1C owner I hope Bambu can figure out how to balance the need for security, and also openness.

Bambu is still in a rapid growth phase where they want to 10x their marketshare. They're not going to get that by catering to the hacker/maker community printing random bits from the internet, they'll get that by being a no-brainer for small to medium businesses that need rapid and easy printing for prototyping, print farms, and other similar applications. Our business had a 3d printer we used on a fairly regular basis for prototyping and some pieces for production machinery. Then we bought a Bambu, and the ease of use and speed of print exploded our use cases such that we bought 2 more within a month or two of the first, and we buy their filament in bulk especially during their sales. There are periods of time when all three of our printers are in use from morning til night. An average hobbyist maker is likely not their target market.

All this talk about rent seeking and subscription print services are confusing either what stage the company is in, or confusing what VCs want vs. what private equity typically wants. VCs want explosive growth that 10-100x's their investment before they exit. They're not going to get that from filament lockin, or subscription printing.

 

[Ozy]

If I understand what you are saying correctly, the add-on Babu sells to handle filament for their printers has integrated RFID. That certainly isn't the sort of move a company that has "no plans" to integrate filament detection into their systems would typically make.

But, more to the point, It looks like the AMS unit is effectively the only mechanism that provides multi-material support for the printers. There doesn't appear to be any way to get the multi-material functionality without using the unit, and they don't appear to offer any alternative feed systems. So it appears to be standard equipment for any turnkey setup - which seems relevant.

And clearly the AMS thing has full digital integration with the Babu printer's electronics. If the AMS can tell the printer to stop because it's out of filament, why can't the AMS can tell the printer to stop because the filament is unathorized? And how is this fundamentally different than the "printer" having a mechanism to do it?

Seriously. How WOULD you build the capability "into the printer" if not by building it into the part of the printer that handles filament? The RFID is in the spool - not the filament itself. So it's not like you could build it into the hotend. When you suggest putting the mechansim "in the printer" .... what would you be talking about if not building it in to the material-feed system somehow much like it's been built into the AMS?

All of this adds up to make your certitude feel absurd. By your own telling, certainly looks like they've already built the capacity.

This would be monumentally stupid, because unless Bambu stocks and supplies every single filament type/color/durometer that a person/company would possibly need, any user that can't find the filament they want/need to print with would mean they would be forced to buy a different brand of printer. So, rather than the stick approach, Bambu uses the carrot to make their filaments better intetgrate into their printing system, and that likely works out just fine for them.

Seriously, even our company, which runs several of their printers primarily with their basic PLA filaments occasionally uses an off-brand TPU filament with a specific durometer that Bambu just doesn't stock. You think Bambu wants to completely lose printer and associated filament sales because of the 5% time that a company like us uses an off-brand?

 

[The Wonderful Wizard]

please propose a better way they can support open/FOSS (and fair labor, privacy respecting, etc, etc) while remaining solvent.

Perhaps have a licence provision prohibiting commercial use by any person who does not ensure that at least 90% of the added value from themselves and their suppliers is by companies that meet or exceed all employment standards applicable in, in that case, the Czech Republic (perhaps allowing PPP-adjusted or cost-of-living adjusted wages). That’s not open source per Bruce Perens, but it achieves the desired outcome.

 

[Aurich]

This would be monumentally stupid, because unless Bambu stocks and supplies every single filament type/color/durometer that a person/company would possibly need, any user that can't find the filament they want/need to print with would mean they would be forced to buy a different brand of printer. So, rather than the stick approach, Bambu uses the carrot to make their filaments better intetgrate into their printing system, and that likely works out just fine for them.

Seriously, even our company, which runs several of their printers primarily with their basic PLA filaments occasionally uses an off-brand TPU filament with a specific durometer that Bambu just doesn't stock. You think Bambu wants to completely lose printer and associated filament sales because of the 5% time that a company like us uses an off-brand?

Honestly the entire idea is just absurd on so many levels, I'm somewhat surprised that we're even talking about it at all.

I think the fatigue over people feeling taken advantage of and squeezed is just so real that nothing feels off the table anymore.

It's also just so damn hard to keep up with everything. There are no real good news sources to track it all. The best options are YouTube, and that's cool and all, but not a great way to just do a daily dump. But watching Joel interview the X1Plus team, or CNC Kitchen interview the Bambu CEO is useful. Even that is something you have to watch out for or you'll miss it.

YouTube is also the land of hyperbole and trend chasing. I said I don't like Louis Rossman, and it's just that I can't do that bombastic talking at your desk into a mic format. But it's something that works, and he has an audience.

So many people dropping Bambu takes now, my recs are flooded with it. I don't need to watch 10 different versions of the same thing.

 

[Aurich]

Just to follow up on that last post, since I think these are both kind of important videos if you're into deeper diving into the topics. They're a little older now though, not about any current news.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GW7tUpAVj4



View: https://youtu.be/7pFtbybLlk0

 

[Robaba]

Let the enshitification begin!

Me: looking for a Picard meme saying “Enshit!”

 

[zore]

Wait wait. So they are pushing this controversial update to make sure the printer isn't controlled remotely by an unauthorized actor. Why the heck is the printer remote controllable to begin with?

Oh yeah, they are trying to get a monopoly to then charge a fee for using what you paid for. Sorry I'm not going through that.

 

[Myyzius]

I find the wording of their "clarification" disturbing. As hopefully most computing enthusiasts might know, severity of security incidents is ranked.
The wording of
unless a "severe security issue arises in the future."
is just truthspeak to my ears. In other words "when we say there has been a security breach that we deem severe".
Thus giving them a free hand to implement said restrictions when they feel like it. Even if they were serious and said severity over 9.0; this still does not translate as hey we suck at security - let us implement our better security solution. Like literally have the worst security coders implement security?

 

[Hopefully Smarter]

Now we know what the price of a bribe is to the T**** (the convicted felon and sexual predator)®™ administration.

expect smooth sailing for the oligarchs from here on in.

 

[Astro-CCD]

I'm not happy they did this…

but I'm happy that if they were gonna do it, that they did it right when I was thinking "maybe I should buy a 3d printer before tariffs hit" and now I'll just stick to the sane world of just letting other people have that hobby and occasionally paying them to print things for me.

I know there are other brands out there but I don't think my interest in the tinkering and tweaking side of shit could be lower and Bambu's models seemed like the lowest-headache system.

Agreed. I only care about "getting the job done" when it comes to printing. I have had an X1C for over a year and it has been flawless so far.

Of course I only use two softwares, Fusion 360 and Bambu Slicer.

Tempest in a teapot, IMHO.

 

[makimaki]

I upload things on occasion to printables:

https://www.printables.com/@Aurich_1215174/models

I haven't put any of the 50mm grid stuff up because it's kinda specific. I don't use a 3D printed grid, I laser cut one. And the hex key stuff is for a couple specific sets.

But if anyone wants them I'm happy to provide.

I'm not going to lie, I love what you've done to organise your tools. It's something I'm planning to do for my labs (a startup hosted at a university in France), and like others here, I'd love to see your files to see how I could adapt them to my gear.

 

[ERIFNOMI]

Wait wait. So they are pushing this controversial update to make sure the printer isn't controlled remotely by an unauthorized actor. Why the heck is the printer remote controllable to begin with?

Oh yeah, they are trying to get a monopoly to then charge a fee for using what you paid for. Sorry I'm not going through that.

No, it's incredibly more convenient to start and control a print from your phone or from the computer where you just sliced the print than throwing it on a flash drive, walking it over to the printer, and poking at a little touch screen. Maybe you've only used shitty first gen printers that take 3 days to print anything and you're only making trinkets once in a blue moon, but if you actually use a printer and crank out multiple prints in a day, the flash drive shuffle is a waste of time.

 

[Aurich]

I'm not going to lie, I love what you've done to organise your tools. It's something I'm planning to do for my labs (a startup hosted at a university in France), and like others here, I'd love to see your files to see how I could adapt them to my gear.

I'm happy to share, I just usually don't upload things that are super specific, and only take the time to share the stuff that might be more generally helpful.

Are you familiar with Gridfinity? I'm basically doing my own modified version of it, but the stock one has a tremendous amount of resources available.

 

[Aurich]

No, it's incredibly more convenient to start and control a print from your phone or from the computer where you just sliced the print than throwing it on a flash drive, walking it over to the printer, and poking at a little touch screen. Maybe you've only used shitty first gen printers that take 3 days to print anything and you're only making trinkets once in a blue moon, but if you actually use a printer and crank out multiple prints in a day, the flash drive shuffle is a waste of time.

This.

But also, my X1C is in my garage where all my equipment that needs ventilation is. I don't want to print ABS in the house. So being able to remotely send a file to it without having to get up, open the garage, go out my front door, put in an SD card, then reverse the steps? Yes please.

Everyone needs to pick their own comfort levels. My TV isn't on my network, my AppleTV attached to it is. That's to me a reasonable way to do it.

My Bambu is exposed to the cloud. I take advantage of it and enjoy the features. Are there tradeoffs/risks? Sure. In my estimation they're so minimal as to not factor into my feelings. Others may calculate it differently.

Do I need my toaster networked? I cannot fathom why. But there is 100% value in my printer being such.

 

[Aurich]

Also, I love seeing our 3D printer enthusiasts showing up. If you're not using the forum or aware of our long running thread it's a good place to talk shop, share files, etc:

https://meincmagazine.com/civis/threads/the-new-perpetual-3d-printing-thread.1292039/

 

[makimaki]

I'm happy to share, I just usually don't upload things that are super specific, and only take the time to share the stuff that might be more generally helpful.

Are you familiar with Gridfinity? I'm basically doing my own modified version of it, but the stock one has a tremendous amount of resources available.

I never heard of it until you mentioned it. Thanks!

Just looking through their wiki, the amount of different storage solutions is impressive. We can have a lot of fun printing out and organising everything based on that.

 

[Aurich]

I never heard of it until you mentioned it. Thanks!

Just looking through their wiki, the amount of different storage solutions is impressive. We can have a lot of fun printing out and organising everything based on that.

The advantage of stock Gridfinity is you can take advantage of everyone's files, and there are tons.

Being extra like me and rolling your own to be custom means you're on your own. Which is fine by me, because I enjoy it, but maybe not how everyone wants to spend their time.

 

[Meathim]

it does not.
https://www.wevolver.com/article/ender-3-bed-leveling

... Ender-3 V3 SE specifically, which does have auto leveling. The ones listed in that article does not.

Don’t care. Good?

Yeah.

That sounds like a you problem.

Not reliably and consistently. Not with many materials. I wanted to print with wood and TPU, which need a:

Then you won’t print with wood. It pushes the material closer to the bed, as opposed to pushing the material through a tube from further away, like with a Bowden extruder.

Then why are you here screeching?

I can see why.

Just ranting a bit on my experiences. Chill man. We're all different, and that's fine. I did what you did, which is just giving options, and an Ender-3 V3 SE specifically is a cheap yet very plugnplay-friendly system, which is what a lot of people. me included, want.

 

[wagnerrp]

Wait wait. So they are pushing this controversial update to make sure the printer isn't controlled remotely by an unauthorized actor. Why the heck is the printer remote controllable to begin with?

When is the last time you've used a paper printer that didn't have remote access? If not network, USB, or Centronics? Even "offline" printers invariably come with a serial port (or serial over USB) to print through.

but if you actually use a printer and crank out multiple prints in a day, the flash drive shuffle is a waste of time.

I expect the average entry user does that for about as long as it takes to ship in something that will run Octoprint.

 

[Aurich]

I expect the average entry user does that for about as long as it takes to ship in something that will run Octoprint.

The average Ars user maybe. I wouldn't underestimate the appeal of "it just works" for the average user though. The beauty of 3D printing getting so popular is we're reaching a point where we have users who's eyes will glaze over the moment you say "just get a Raspberry Pi bro".

 

[wagnerrp]

The average Ars user maybe. I wouldn't underestimate the appeal of "it just works" for the average user though. The beauty of 3D printing getting so popular is we're reaching a point where we have users who's eyes will glaze over the moment you say "just get a Raspberry Pi bro".

Alright. We'll handicap them a week before they start asking what that little red button data port on the side is for.

 

[dtremit]

3D printing is still very much a 'I am a 3D printer enthusiast' and 'I am a 3D printing enthusiast'. Sometimes they crossover. Going from a Creality Sermoon (total shit) to my P1S moved me into the 'printing' column and I'm now thinking of picking up another printer that also puts me into the 'printer' column as well, a Voron looks very interesting.

I have been thinking that the ideal setup is buying one "just works" printer, probably on the compact side, and using it to print the parts for a Voron as printer #2.

 

[wagnerrp]

I have been thinking that the ideal setup is buying one "just works" printer, probably on the compact side, and using it to print the parts for a Voron as printer #2.

Is that like buying a second Jaguar to use while the first is in the shop?

 

[taxmanmike]

I don't understand this obsession with connecting every electronic device to the internet. My fridge, washer, thermostat, TV, 3d printer, don't need to be tracking everything I do and sending the telemetry back to a manufacturer. If I can't use the device offline I don't buy it. This just ensures I will never buy one of their 3d printers!

The Home Assistant community is huge on local integrations for this reason - with a local integration that isn't cloud-dependent you get something that you can control, doesn't depend on the whims of a manufacturer, and allows you to take advantage of many of the benefits of internet-connectedness without actually connecting your $thing to the internet.

Easier said than done, of course. Most manufacturers aren't implementing local control, at least not consistently. But if you look there are a lot of options that allow for that, at least in certain market segments. Increasing rollout of Matter support has some promise but it's had its challenges and those aren't entirely worked out.

HA is also something you have to own and manage - way more than just installing some app on your phone - and it's not for everybody.

 

[jnuneznj]

What? Why would you regret it? 350mm sounds awesome! I think 300 even would be a big step up for me, I run into the boundaries a lot where just a little more breathing room would be a big help.

The weight. It's big. My LDO kit came with metal handles. After I complete the tool changer I am looking at moving the electronics bay to the right of the printer.

 

[Aurich]

The weight. It's big. My LDO kit came with metal handles. After I complete the tool changer I am looking at moving the electronics bay to the right of the printer.

I mean, fair enough, but are you moving it around?

My laser cutter and CNC are heavy and never move for instance.

 

[jnuneznj]

I mean, fair enough, but are you moving it around?

My laser cutter and CNC are heavy and never move for instance.

Nah only when I make alterations. Adding 5 toolheads and upgrading the RPI OS.

 

[TROPtastic]

Thanks, I will check reviews and wait for availability for the CORE and Hi.

Since I brought up the Creality Hi, I should point out that Creality apparently doesn't have the best record for warranty claims or timely support. Despite these firmware changes by BambuLab, you may still want to go with a BambuLab A1 if you don't purchase a CORE One. You can take some precautions like not updating its firmware until BambuLab releases this supposed "dev mode" to maintain compatibility with 3rd party hardware and software, and there may be open source adapter boards that get developed for the A1.

 

[Deleted member 286188]

I got down voted to hell for trashing them on one of the last articles due to their locked down filament system.

Looks like I was right. Now that they have the market they want to control their users more.

the reason you got down-voted, is because they never promised open source, devices, in fact they are very open about being closed source, for some people the hobby is in the 3d prints, not tinkering with their printers, either way, its like getting an apple device and complain about their closed ecosystem.

 

[spac3heater]

@Aurich I joined the forums specifically so I could ask you this (since I don't have 10 forum posts under my belt, I don't have access to private message features). Would you consider sharing your 50mm grid system models? I have have the same drawers in my garage, and ever since seeing the July article - I have been wanting to make the same labelled boxes.

 

[Aurich]

@Aurich I joined the forums specifically so I could ask you this (since I don't have 10 forum posts under my belt, I don't have access to private message features). Would you consider sharing your 50mm grid system models? I have have the same drawers in my garage, and ever since seeing the July article - I have been wanting to make the same labelled boxes.

I set your account to full privileges. It's only 3 posts now, not 10, but no reason to make you wait.

So, I don't mind sharing, but it's kinda not super friendly for people compared to standard Gridfinity.

The grid for the boxes is laser cut, not 3D printed, so there is no file to print for it. And I design the box sizes as I need them, so what I have now is all that exists.

Since I have a laser it's just faster and easier to make grids that way. But I do realize that's not a common tool for most folks. I just cut them out of cardboard.

 

[spac3heater]

Thanks so much! I have a laser, so that would be no issue at all.