Ars Technica System Guide: Back to PC building for back-to-school
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I appreciate the spirit of this article and giving us the many options but for the sake of visual flow I would suggest just picking a case option and inserting a picture of that specific case with each build. Just seems like it would increase the readability of this format slightly.
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Artem S. Tashkinov
Ars Scholae Palatinae
A gaming system in 2025 should have at least 32 GB of RAM, period, so I don't like your second build.
Many games have been shown to consume up to 16 GB of RAM, so a 16 GB build will result in heavy swapping and terrible stuttering.
Regarding your final build: "Four 32 GB sticks". No, just no. In most cases, four DDR5 sticks will result in poor memory performance. I've seen news about certain vendors improving on that, but it's rare. There are some very good 48 GB DDR5 6000-6400 MHz low-latency modules available, which will give you a comfortable 96 GB build.
Many games have been shown to consume up to 16 GB of RAM, so a 16 GB build will result in heavy swapping and terrible stuttering.
Regarding your final build: "Four 32 GB sticks". No, just no. In most cases, four DDR5 sticks will result in poor memory performance. I've seen news about certain vendors improving on that, but it's rare. There are some very good 48 GB DDR5 6000-6400 MHz low-latency modules available, which will give you a comfortable 96 GB build.
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I found the below list helpful for choosing a power supply.
https://cultists.network/140/psu-tier-list/
EDIT: As others have noted, the list hasn't been updated in a long time, so better not use it as your only reference. I still think it's valuable to include here, just because it ranks such a huge number of products.
https://cultists.network/140/psu-tier-list/
EDIT: As others have noted, the list hasn't been updated in a long time, so better not use it as your only reference. I still think it's valuable to include here, just because it ranks such a huge number of products.
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Reading this I just had the idea that I should probably finally get a 4k monitor before spending money on upgrading my still perfectly fine system.
My 30"+24" Dell OLED monitors were great ca. 2008 when I started Uni and they still work fine, but there's probably not much innovation in that area any more and I'm just being lazy.
That said oh great hive mind, any recommendations? I do like good color accuracy and would mostly use it for development these days, but games once in a while.
Budget isn't a big issue these days, but I do prefer to not spend ridiculously for small gain just out of principle (and growing up poor
)
My 30"+24" Dell OLED monitors were great ca. 2008 when I started Uni and they still work fine, but there's probably not much innovation in that area any more and I'm just being lazy.
That said oh great hive mind, any recommendations? I do like good color accuracy and would mostly use it for development these days, but games once in a while.
Budget isn't a big issue these days, but I do prefer to not spend ridiculously for small gain just out of principle (and growing up poor
)
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You, Sir, have impeccable timing. This is just what I need for my new system build.
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I love these guides. I hope Ars always continues to write these. I no longer follow hardware trends so when I'm ready to build or refresh a PC for myself or another, it's nice being able to come to a trusted source and feel confident the research has been done.
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A note on the 8500G: it's a little gimped for I/O for later expansion, as it devotes 8 PCIe lanes to its internal graphic card, which can't be disabled or rerouted. This leaves you only 8 lanes for a GPU, and I have the idea that it's even limited to PCIe3. That's slow and narrow enough to potentially cause performance issues.
That CPU is one of the lowest-cost options, and will give you a perfectly reasonable desktop, but if you're thinking about later GPU expansion, you may have to replace that processor to get the best possible results from whatever card you add.
You can probably keep the DRAM and the motherboard, however.
I'd slot another CPU in between the God Box and the penultimate build, using a 9800X3D instead of a 7800X3D. You don't need the 98 to drive a 5070Ti well, but if you play games that hammer the CPU (emulation is one common culprit, for example), the Zen 5 chip can be about 20% faster. And it supports AVX-512, and still runs really fast in Eco Mode, which cuts down power usage a bunch.
IMO, the 9950X3D in the God Box probably isn't something you actually want unless you explicitly know otherwise. It uses a bifurcated approach where only half the cores (one CCD) have access to the big cache and highest performance level. This means you have to manage the freaking CPU, using the Game Mode utilities from Microsoft to disable half the cores, the ones without the X3D cache, when you're gaming.
Your opinion may differ, but I find myself violently opposed to the idea of having to manage my own CPU. Goddammit, it's a computer, it's supposed to do that kind of stuff for me. So I prefer the 9800X3D, because it doesn't need management and runs smoking fast for games without any fiddling. All the cores are the same, the scheduling is simple, everything Just Works(tm).
You give up a fair bit of multicore throughput, but unless you're doing a ton of video encoding, or huge parallel compiles (like, say, the Chromium codebase, or the Linux kernel), chances are pretty good that you won't get much actually useful from going past 8 cores.
If you can use 16 cores to good effect, you'll probably know that already, and can safely ignore me.
That CPU is one of the lowest-cost options, and will give you a perfectly reasonable desktop, but if you're thinking about later GPU expansion, you may have to replace that processor to get the best possible results from whatever card you add.
You can probably keep the DRAM and the motherboard, however.
I'd slot another CPU in between the God Box and the penultimate build, using a 9800X3D instead of a 7800X3D. You don't need the 98 to drive a 5070Ti well, but if you play games that hammer the CPU (emulation is one common culprit, for example), the Zen 5 chip can be about 20% faster. And it supports AVX-512, and still runs really fast in Eco Mode, which cuts down power usage a bunch.
IMO, the 9950X3D in the God Box probably isn't something you actually want unless you explicitly know otherwise. It uses a bifurcated approach where only half the cores (one CCD) have access to the big cache and highest performance level. This means you have to manage the freaking CPU, using the Game Mode utilities from Microsoft to disable half the cores, the ones without the X3D cache, when you're gaming.
Your opinion may differ, but I find myself violently opposed to the idea of having to manage my own CPU. Goddammit, it's a computer, it's supposed to do that kind of stuff for me. So I prefer the 9800X3D, because it doesn't need management and runs smoking fast for games without any fiddling. All the cores are the same, the scheduling is simple, everything Just Works(tm).
You give up a fair bit of multicore throughput, but unless you're doing a ton of video encoding, or huge parallel compiles (like, say, the Chromium codebase, or the Linux kernel), chances are pretty good that you won't get much actually useful from going past 8 cores.
If you can use 16 cores to good effect, you'll probably know that already, and can safely ignore me.
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This ^
There are very few configurations where 2DPC will work without going back to JEDEC speeds (4 800 MT/s) or incurring major instabilities
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Can confirm that 4 RAM sticks was a horrible idea in my case - running a Ryzen 7 7700X on a ASRock PG Lightning B650 board with x2 16GB Kingston FuryBeast 5600MHz cl36 sticks - perfectly fine - put in 4 of the exact same sticks (even had the same manufacturing date) - constant random crashing if I try to run them on anything above 3600MHz (and even then it was not stable all the time). Borrowed a 64GB (2x32GB sticks, also 5600MHz) - works fine.
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That hasn't been updated since early 2023, more than two years ago, so I don't use it anymore.
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I don't know how much it applies for Americans and tariffs and things, but AMD chips via Aliexpress are so hard to pass up these days.
They're clamshell only, because they're just bulk OEM chips sold on at low cost, but so far I've bought a 5700X3D, a 7700 and a 5700X and all work fine, all around half the price of stores in Australia.
I'm skeptical of motherboards and who knows what chips you're getting in the RAM on there (plus GPUs are never cheaper), but AMD CPUs are regularly a great buy. Just need to make sure you pick a good retailer (much like ebay, don't buy from anyone without thousands of positive reviews)
They're clamshell only, because they're just bulk OEM chips sold on at low cost, but so far I've bought a 5700X3D, a 7700 and a 5700X and all work fine, all around half the price of stores in Australia.
I'm skeptical of motherboards and who knows what chips you're getting in the RAM on there (plus GPUs are never cheaper), but AMD CPUs are regularly a great buy. Just need to make sure you pick a good retailer (much like ebay, don't buy from anyone without thousands of positive reviews)
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It should be noted that the Lian Li Lancool 207 has a maximum length of 160mm for the PSU. And they mean it.
There isn't much clearance underneath the power supply intake, so look elsewhere if your computer will be sitting on top of carpet.
That remains a good list, but hasn't been updated in a couple of years. For PSU's released more recently, reviews on hwbusters, techpowerup and tomshardware are generally good, and were used as the source for that list.
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(I replaced the link since I can't post links yet.)
The issue with that is it's also last updated in April 2023. The site also sadly seems to have been effectively abandoned or at least on hiatus. Their last review was posted back in 2024. It's probably still usable for getting an overall picture, but I would not use it as the only source.
Hardware Busters is my current primary source for PSU testing. I also suggest relying on the Cybenetics rating more than 80 Plus, although they're a bit less widespread right now. Their testing process seems to be stricter and more thorough than 80 Plus's. My understanding is that 80 Plus primarily tests for efficiency, while Cybenetics tests things like how the PSU regulates current at various power draws, noise, and so on, in addition to efficiency (which isn't directly comparable to 80 Plus due to differences in testing methods).
Cybenetic's stricter requirements hopefully make it so that PSUs certified by them are also less likely to start a house fire. Or that might be my wishful thinking speaking.
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For monitors I generally check the recommendations on rtings.com. They have different categories for things like gaming, media consumption, and resolution.Reading this I just had the idea that I should probably finally get a 4k monitor before spending money on upgrading my still perfectly fine system.
My 30"+24" Dell OLED monitors were great ca. 2008 when I started Uni and they still work fine, but there's probably not much innovation in that area any more and I'm just being lazy.
That said oh great hive mind, any recommendations? I do like good color accuracy and would mostly use it for development these days, but games once in a while.
Budget isn't a big issue these days, but I do prefer to not spend ridiculously for small gain just out of principle (and growing up poor
I'd echo the other responses saying to go for the 9800x3d over the 7800x3d, it's not a huge price difference for a decent bump in performance. If, and it's a big if, you're near a microcenter in the states they have a few 8GB 9060xt models for $250 making it easy choice over the 5050 and 5060. Nvidia has totally abandoned the sub $400 market. I'd probably also go for the 9070xt over the 5070ti, but that's because I really only play games. Could understand going for the 5070ti if you need the CUDA cores.
Checking Newegg the majority of the top selling GPUs are from AMD, we'll see if the Steam hardware survey starts to reflect this
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Perfect timing, as I want to build a new PC. But after decades of macbook and thinkpad usage, I'm very rusty with all this PC building.
In my particular case, I'll use the PC for two things: reading/writing m-disc blurays and for VMs. So my priority is CPU and RAM. And the hardest part… finding a modern-looking case with a slot for an optical drive unit. I love the looks of the Fractal Nord, but I haven't found anything like it with an optical drive slot. Any recommendations anyone?
In my particular case, I'll use the PC for two things: reading/writing m-disc blurays and for VMs. So my priority is CPU and RAM. And the hardest part… finding a modern-looking case with a slot for an optical drive unit. I love the looks of the Fractal Nord, but I haven't found anything like it with an optical drive slot. Any recommendations anyone?
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I had a tough time finding a case with an external 5.25” drive bay for a previous build. I ended up putting my excellent BluRay reader/writer into an external enclosure. Works great. Also easy to move between systems if needed.
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I'm still going 4 x 24". Makes multitasking a dream and also works with my eve online addiction.Reading this I just had the idea that I should probably finally get a 4k monitor before spending money on upgrading my still perfectly fine system.
My 30"+24" Dell OLED monitors were great ca. 2008 when I started Uni and they still work fine, but there's probably not much innovation in that area any more and I'm just being lazy.
That said oh great hive mind, any recommendations? I do like good color accuracy and would mostly use it for development these days, but games once in a while.
Budget isn't a big issue these days, but I do prefer to not spend ridiculously for small gain just out of principle (and growing up poor
They are 2560x1440 sadly but thinking hard about upgrading to 4x BenQ SW242Q just to get those vertical pixels that everybody and their dog likes to waste.
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Not a whole lot of options, but the Fractal Design Focus G looks pretty nice and has support for an optical drive. Also some HTPC cases that have drive bays
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Since you can't go too big... Dell UltraSharp U4025QW is a good choice. Your 30" can shift to 2nd monitor position.
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Rather than 4 sticks of RAM, you can get DDR5 Light Enhancement kits from Corsair and then just go with 2x32GB DDR5-6000 CL30.
I haven't had any issues with games running on the x3d chiplet in a long time.
I haven't had any issues with games running on the x3d chiplet in a long time.
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For a budget/esport build with a focus on 1080p and possibly a survivable framerate on 1440p, I would argue that you cannot escape the Intel B580. It is 12GB of VRAM by default and (at least here in Norway) costs 150 USD less than the 9060 XT, 350 vs 500 USD.
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Pretty amazing resource on first glance, thanks.
Oh right, 16:9, I completely forgot about that. I think that's why I gave up looking the last few times I got the itch.
Might just have to accept it.
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So many hours into that game in the mid to late 2000s.
dual boxing with dual screens running 8 characters.... The endless parade of alarm clock POS bashes eventually killed it for me. Good times, though, made a few IRL friends, etc.
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Reading this I just had the idea that I should probably finally get a 4k monitor before spending money on upgrading my still perfectly fine system.
My 30"+24" Dell OLED monitors were great ca. 2008 when I started Uni and they still work fine, but there's probably not much innovation in that area any more and I'm just being lazy.
That said oh great hive mind, any recommendations? I do like good color accuracy and would mostly use it for development these days, but games once in a while.
Budget isn't a big issue these days, but I do prefer to not spend ridiculously for small gain just out of principle (and growing up poor
Honestly, just get a 2k (1440p) monitor instead. Most people can't tell the difference between 2k and 4k, they cost much less so you can get bigger monitors, and you'll save ~70% or more on graphics hardware since you won't need to run games in 4k.
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This forum sounds like a Chef's convention all arguing about the best chili recipe. Sweet and savory, hot and spicy, meat chunks, hamburger, vegan, yadda, yadda, yadda.
All in good fun, of course. And all insisting their choices are perfect.
Well, for them, sure. For others? That depends.
As someone who's probably built more systems for people than most other computer users (I had a business, and building computers was a thing), I've found it important to look at what a client HAS NOW, and build for current needs, with an eye on the future about five years ahead, eyeing what came out two or so years ago to build it with, all it without selling blood or taking out loans to cover the costs.
Looking at CPU/GPU "improvements" in the last few years, for most folks, what worked 2 years ago to replace in a computer built 5 years ago will be far better than paying three times more to get state of the art today. Cost-effectiveness is at play here. Yeah, it's not going to win any bragging rights, but, seriously aren't we adult enough to not have pissing contests about who's got the sexiest rig? The answer is always that fucker with more money than god (or less sense than Scrat the ice age squirrel going after an acorn).
Being decidedly ungodlike, I take a different tack. The way I see it is that, by now, most people have had desktops for a while, and replacing one already starts with a baseline of what they have. Knowing what they do and what they have, and then what they want to do in the future (at least as far as they know) lets you look at more of what came out after their gear came out, since MOST people won't have much in the way of change in what they do. They only want it to do it "better".
State of the art is bragging rights. If they have the money, fine. But my experience with computers is that a HAPPY computer user is NOT fucking around with the hemorrhaging the cutting edge often brings. So start with tried and tested, fixed, patched, upgraded, stuff from a year or two ago, and parse that out as needed for CPU/GPU and cooling solutions for both. Be sure to consider their operational environment, too. Is it always hot, or cold, moist, dusty, etc? Those are part of having a good computing experience, since the cooling solutions can vary a lot based on that operational environment. (under-pressure, over-pressure, liquid cooling, etc. I favor over-pressure, myself.)
Then it becomes a lot easier to match the computer to the user. It's like customizing a car order vs driving one off the lot. USUALLY, the custom order is more appreciated, and you have a happier user. If they're not picky, why bother with a custom build in the first place.
So I don't have any "recommended systems". Computers are very personalized, even if they can all do the exact same things. But users needs drive that personalization, and knowing THOSE, one can better pick the parts that best accommodate those needs, within their working budgets.
That said, I liked this article because it shows the range of possibilities, from the budget (and for me) "It's going to melt down and blow up the Earth the first time I render a video" to the over the top, "Who the fuck needs 360 fps?!?" at the top end. The reality is going to be between them, somewhere, depending on what the person has used, needs and will LIKELY want in the future. It can be about bragging rights. But most folks, like their cars, just want something reliable that gets them where they want to go with a minimum of drama for the life of the vehicle. Meet that goal, and you usually have very happy clams.
All in good fun, of course. And all insisting their choices are perfect.
Well, for them, sure. For others? That depends.
As someone who's probably built more systems for people than most other computer users (I had a business, and building computers was a thing), I've found it important to look at what a client HAS NOW, and build for current needs, with an eye on the future about five years ahead, eyeing what came out two or so years ago to build it with, all it without selling blood or taking out loans to cover the costs.
Looking at CPU/GPU "improvements" in the last few years, for most folks, what worked 2 years ago to replace in a computer built 5 years ago will be far better than paying three times more to get state of the art today. Cost-effectiveness is at play here. Yeah, it's not going to win any bragging rights, but, seriously aren't we adult enough to not have pissing contests about who's got the sexiest rig? The answer is always that fucker with more money than god (or less sense than Scrat the ice age squirrel going after an acorn).
Being decidedly ungodlike, I take a different tack. The way I see it is that, by now, most people have had desktops for a while, and replacing one already starts with a baseline of what they have. Knowing what they do and what they have, and then what they want to do in the future (at least as far as they know) lets you look at more of what came out after their gear came out, since MOST people won't have much in the way of change in what they do. They only want it to do it "better".
State of the art is bragging rights. If they have the money, fine. But my experience with computers is that a HAPPY computer user is NOT fucking around with the hemorrhaging the cutting edge often brings. So start with tried and tested, fixed, patched, upgraded, stuff from a year or two ago, and parse that out as needed for CPU/GPU and cooling solutions for both. Be sure to consider their operational environment, too. Is it always hot, or cold, moist, dusty, etc? Those are part of having a good computing experience, since the cooling solutions can vary a lot based on that operational environment. (under-pressure, over-pressure, liquid cooling, etc. I favor over-pressure, myself.)
Then it becomes a lot easier to match the computer to the user. It's like customizing a car order vs driving one off the lot. USUALLY, the custom order is more appreciated, and you have a happier user. If they're not picky, why bother with a custom build in the first place.
So I don't have any "recommended systems". Computers are very personalized, even if they can all do the exact same things. But users needs drive that personalization, and knowing THOSE, one can better pick the parts that best accommodate those needs, within their working budgets.
That said, I liked this article because it shows the range of possibilities, from the budget (and for me) "It's going to melt down and blow up the Earth the first time I render a video" to the over the top, "Who the fuck needs 360 fps?!?" at the top end. The reality is going to be between them, somewhere, depending on what the person has used, needs and will LIKELY want in the future. It can be about bragging rights. But most folks, like their cars, just want something reliable that gets them where they want to go with a minimum of drama for the life of the vehicle. Meet that goal, and you usually have very happy clams.
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That is why I want those BenQ SW242Q, they are 16:10 format. They have a cheaper "programmer" version that is also 16:10 but it comes with speakers which drives me fucking crazy so I'm prepared to pay extra for SW just to skip that particular idiocy.
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I built myself a gaming PC end of May: quite similar to your 3rd build: DDR5 and 32GB is a must have with 2x16GB (just in case).
I would say get a reasonably cooled case with room inside: I went for a LianLi Lancool 216 and I am really happy with it: I am sure it will stay around for later builds.
For the GPU I went for a RTX5060Ti 16GB.
I went for a PCIe4.0 2TB SSD with good specs just like you. Waiting for PCIe5.0 ones that don't explode the budget and that I could add next to the one I currently have (check on MOBO how many SSDs and with PCIe version it can accomodate... I got myself a Gigabyte Eagle AX and I am very happy with it.
In addition stay on the legal side: go for Linux and legally remove Windows license cost.
I would say get a reasonably cooled case with room inside: I went for a LianLi Lancool 216 and I am really happy with it: I am sure it will stay around for later builds.
For the GPU I went for a RTX5060Ti 16GB.
I went for a PCIe4.0 2TB SSD with good specs just like you. Waiting for PCIe5.0 ones that don't explode the budget and that I could add next to the one I currently have (check on MOBO how many SSDs and with PCIe version it can accomodate... I got myself a Gigabyte Eagle AX and I am very happy with it.
In addition stay on the legal side: go for Linux and legally remove Windows license cost.
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I just upgraded my rig, came into an i9-14900K and 64Gb RAM. Upgraded from a 3700x/32Gb RAM, I recycled my 4090/24Gb. I love it but damn is it loud when gaming! I have the Liquid Freezer III 360 and I've been tweaking fan settings so that it's quiet for normal use but gaming is loud. Currently I'm seeing 75-80C when playing PUBG. I'm seriously considering dropping down to an i7 just to get lower temps.
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If you can skip the pure modern part, check thrift/goodwill/habitat stores. Often an older system will show up for not much money with a decent case w/5.25" bay(s). Some of the 10+ year old cases still look pretty good. Sometimes you will get lucky and the guts are good enough for that family member that has been bugging you for a basic browsing type computer. Just put the old guts in the cheapest case you can find.
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Regarding config #2; it's a pity that the 'oddball' 5000-series X3D parts (5600X3D and 5500X3D) have somewhat...eccentric...availability.
Very dead end(though so is a DDR4 intel board) and you wouldn't really go to zen3 for generalist performance; but AM4 is nice and cheap; and X3D parts hit stupidly above their weight for gaming specifically.
Not like it necessarily matters unless you are mostly playing dwarf fortress; at that price point you aren't going to afford a GPU that will be all that hard to keep fed; but while the 5800X3D seems like a really, really, hard sell at this point the cheaper limited release ones remain sort of interesting as disproportionately viable gaming parts.
Very dead end(though so is a DDR4 intel board) and you wouldn't really go to zen3 for generalist performance; but AM4 is nice and cheap; and X3D parts hit stupidly above their weight for gaming specifically.
Not like it necessarily matters unless you are mostly playing dwarf fortress; at that price point you aren't going to afford a GPU that will be all that hard to keep fed; but while the 5800X3D seems like a really, really, hard sell at this point the cheaper limited release ones remain sort of interesting as disproportionately viable gaming parts.
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Make sure you are on the latest BIOS and default Intel power settings for that 14900K to mitigate the degradation risk. Same goes for the I7 if you get one.
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Depending on your eyes/preferred zoom level that might work, or if gaming is basically the only application; but my advice would be precisely the contrary:
4k is noticeably roomier for general activity(as well as things like grand strategy games with lots of UI and big maps); and it has the advantage of integer scaling with 1920x1080.
If you want high refresh rates and stuff the price can get out of hand, 1440p is definitely where those features are concentrated; but 4k in 'just competent 60Hz' is a relatively cheap monitor at this point; and can switch as needed between offering lots of room for less demanding applications or acting like a 1920x1080 for cases where you would otherwise be badly undergunned.
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PC Part Picker has some great guides as well, including real-time pricing at different vendors for whatever country you set it to. You can take one of those and then copy it into your own list where you can tweak and such, and it'll even check that you have enough power available for what you've picked.
Would definitely recommend. Just used it for my own build! (Note that I didn't get that GPU: I just took the 2080ti out of my current PC and am putting it in the new one until the rumored Nvidia refresh this winter. The 2080ti can run Borderlands 4/Endless Legend 2 and that's what I'm concerned about at the moment, heh.)
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enlightened.doggo
Ars Scholae Palatinae
Now is not a great time to be buying graphics cards if you can avoid it. This time last year you could still get a 7900 XTX at around the price people will have to pay for mid-range NVIDIA cards today.
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