Ars Technica’s best video games of 2023

2022's relative drought leads to an absolutely packed year of major epics.

See full article...

 

[RoninX]

Honestly, the Ashtray Maze was probably my all time favorite gaming moment from any game, ever!

I agree.

I've been playing video games since the era of Pong, and the Ashtray Maze battle was my favorite video game sequence ever. The way they synchronized the action with the music from Old Gods of Asgard (aka Poets of the Fall) was perfect.

I've linked a video below, but if you're even considering playing Control, you should experience it for yourself instead of watching the video.

 

[tuna74]

I don't resent competition, I resent a non-competitive entry that sits on games like Smaug instead of competing on differentiating on features, functionality, price, or uniqueness like GOG's DRM-less downloads and standalone installers.

Games on EGS are in a lot of cases cheaper than on Steam.

 

[Jordan83]

Is this a problem?

Sort of?

Diablo has a reputation, for better or worse, of being one of those games that really starts after the main story ends. That colors expectations somewhat for the content that follows the main story, and when the price of entry is $70, I feel like a lot of the value is supposed to be in that post-story mode content.

The main campaign might not even have taken me 40 hours; that's really a guess on my part. If the game cost significantly less, it wouldn't really be an issue. But the price tag, the expectations, and what it delivered added up to be a pretty underwhelming package all total. Especially when my favorite games of 2023 gave me a lot more content, that was satisfying from start to end, for less money. Diablo 4 just felt underwhelming to me when I stack it up against other titles.

 

[NewCrow]

I feel out of touch, because the only game I'd like to try on this list is BG3...

I guess in part because I liked the first BG game released (checks Wikipedia) 25 years ago.

Shit, was it that long ago?

 

[Tridus]

While I personally have no ill will towards epic itself , it's actually ok for people to not like a company. It's a valid opinion to have.

If people have a low opinion of a company , it's up to that company to come up with compelling reasons to make you like them. Epic fails at this pretty hard. I don't think saying developers make more money was a compelling enough selling point . Great to see, but just not enough.

The ironic thing is that "developers make more money" was one of the arguments for early Steam when it was competing with retail. Except the numbers were WAY different (Brad Wardell at Stardock said that with all the retail production cost and the middlemen, they made 1/4th per copy what they made from a digital sale).

And back then you had tons of people who basically said "I don't care, I want the physical media." Which is totally valid, the customer is free to make that choice. But it meant those people wouldn't buy a lot of the awesome indie games that started appearing on Steam at the time and that were not even remotely financially viable at retail.

My point is that Epic should have known "this is good for developers" is not an argument that will win the day on its own since the market has already been through that once before. Steam ultimately won because it let me do things like decide I want to try a game with my best friend, buy him a copy, and both of us can be playing in less time than it'd take me to go to the store to try to find out if they even have it (among other advantages).

EGS has been out for 5 years now and to this day I still can't do that on it... so Steam just wins that case by default. And once I'm buying most of my stuff on Steam anyway, why wouldn't I just keep doing it?

 

[aliksy]

I genuinely want to know what games you consider to have a good magic system if you think that BG3's is "bland". I know that Two Worlds II had their magic crafting system that allowed for Tornado of Anvils and that Magicka specifically left in a combination designed to crash the game to desktop, but neither game was "good". Meanwhile, BG3's got magic designed to make the game almost entirely open-ended between potential sequence breaks and bonus stacks.

For tabletop of for video games? For tabletop, mage the awakening is a pretty crunchy system that covers a lot of ground. It's got all the cool bells and whistles. Reaching for extra effects at the risk of failure or backlash. Adding symbolically appropriate elements to your casting for bonuses. Scrutinizing spells to learn who cast it. Casting the spell slowly as a long ritual for bonus dice. Casting as a team to accomplish something no individual could pull off alone. Clear rules for how things scale - more subjects, more effect, longer duration, etc.. Rules for spending personal resources to boost a spell (willpower and mana). D&D magic isn't very good at that stuff.

Fate on the other hand generally is pretty narrative and light. Unknown Armies just drips with flavor. I'm going to assume PbtA games generally handle it with more flavor. GURPS probably does too, but I don't know that system. Shadowrun I think has rules for burning yourself out, but it's been a while since i skimmed that.

D&D spells and magic are generally written so that spells Just Work. You declare that you are going to cast Fireball, check the box, and it happens. People can roll to resist, but generally you're going to get 8d6 damage in a whatever foot radius. There's comparably few decisions to make here. You can upcast for a few extra dice, and one class has a very small set of metamagic options, but that's it. All that cool stuff I mentioned that Mage does? Not really here.

Sort of related to the above, the spells tend to be very static and very bespoke. There's not really much support for creating your own spells. There's kind of a formula for damage by spell level, though the official spells don't always follow it. There's maybe some guidelines for causing effects like Charmed or Prone, but if it exists it's in the DMG somewhere as an optional ruleset. The game doesn't really give you a lot of options for being creative with new spells. You can't really be like "I'm a wizard, I should be able to disarm the angry farmer" unless you have like that very specific spell (which I don't think has a canon spell effect to do before 5th level Telekinesis)

The AC system is definitely a bit simplistic when the computer can do more advanced calculations on the fly

The AC system is also extremely weird in that you can beat their AC by 15 and then roll a two for damage. It also tends to get weird at higher levels where you get hit all the time anyway. It's not a good system. Pathfinder 2e I think is better while still keeping the spirit of D&D. Other systems just combine the attack into a single roll, because having them as two is clumsy.

the rest system allows for dedicated story beats

The rest system forces the story either into some dissonance, or into a very specific pacing. If you don't have time pressure, the characters can blow their resources and throw the whole balance out of whack. It creates problems like the five minute adventuring day. It creates problems where short-rest and no-rest classes are hard to balance against long-rest classes. Turns out most players in real life only do like one or maybe two big encounters per day, and it turns out when the wizard uses 5 encounters worth of resources at once they tend to win. But the other characters that are short-rest based don't have that option, and then feel bad.

There are other ways to have story beats than the long-rest cadence D&D does.

and the character growth is almost entirely in the player's hands with more options than most RPGs.

More options than most RPGs? Are you kidding?

What does a rogue get to pick at 2nd level, 5th level, 7th level, 9th level, 11th level? Nothing.

The levels where you get choices tend to be pretty narrow in scope. Pick a subclass. Pick an ability score to improve (but probably just your main one), or maybe a feat. Feats are pretty limited though.

Compare to, say, CofD where you can buy stuff directly with XP. Compare with Fate where you can free form upgrade your aspects, or improve skills. Hell, even compare with 3rd edition where you could build towards some wacky prestige class combinations.

 

[the_frakker]

I haven’t played Baldur’s Gate 3. All the love it’s gotten has encouraged me to buy it. Probably will get for PC, but it’s on sale for PS5 for now so who knows. It’ll be a 2024 game for me either way.

I played 21 games this year and completed the main story objectives on 15 of them. 2 of the games were replays of games I’d already played in the past. 2 of them were remakes.

Alan Wake 2 is my GotY for 2023. I liked it so much, I’ve now gone back to play Alan Wake Remastered and I’m currently going through Quantum Break for the first time. I’m excited for the Max Payne remakes that are supposedly on the way. I’ve never played those games. I’m likely to revisit Control in 2024 too. I really enjoy all the references to this weird universe Remedy has created over time.

2 games really surprised me with how much I enjoyed them: Hi-Fi Rush and Sea of Stars. Overall, 2023 was a really great year of games. Though - Acknowledging all the industry-side drama that has occurred over the year is important as well.

 

[HiroTheProtagonist]

For tabletop of for video games? For tabletop, mage the awakening is a pretty crunchy system that covers a lot of ground. It's got all the cool bells and whistles. Reaching for extra effects at the risk of failure or backlash. Adding symbolically appropriate elements to your casting for bonuses. Scrutinizing spells to learn who cast it. Casting the spell slowly as a long ritual for bonus dice. Casting as a team to accomplish something no individual could pull off alone. Clear rules for how things scale - more subjects, more effect, longer duration, etc.. Rules for spending personal resources to boost a spell (willpower and mana). D&D magic isn't very good at that stuff.

Fate on the other hand generally is pretty narrative and light. Unknown Armies just drips with flavor. I'm going to assume PbtA games generally handle it with more flavor. GURPS probably does too, but I don't know that system. Shadowrun I think has rules for burning yourself out, but it's been a while since i skimmed that.

D&D spells and magic are generally written so that spells Just Work. You declare that you are going to cast Fireball, check the box, and it happens. People can roll to resist, but generally you're going to get 8d6 damage in a whatever foot radius. There's comparably few decisions to make here. You can upcast for a few extra dice, and one class has a very small set of metamagic options, but that's it. All that cool stuff I mentioned that Mage does? Not really here.

Sort of related to the above, the spells tend to be very static and very bespoke. There's not really much support for creating your own spells. There's kind of a formula for damage by spell level, though the official spells don't always follow it. There's maybe some guidelines for causing effects like Charmed or Prone, but if it exists it's in the DMG somewhere as an optional ruleset. The game doesn't really give you a lot of options for being creative with new spells. You can't really be like "I'm a wizard, I should be able to disarm the angry farmer" unless you have like that very specific spell (which I don't think has a canon spell effect to do before 5th level Telekinesis)



The AC system is also extremely weird in that you can beat their AC by 15 and then roll a two for damage. It also tends to get weird at higher levels where you get hit all the time anyway. It's not a good system. Pathfinder 2e I think is better while still keeping the spirit of D&D. Other systems just combine the attack into a single roll, because having them as two is clumsy.



The rest system forces the story either into some dissonance, or into a very specific pacing. If you don't have time pressure, the characters can blow their resources and throw the whole balance out of whack. It creates problems like the five minute adventuring day. It creates problems where short-rest and no-rest classes are hard to balance against long-rest classes. Turns out most players in real life only do like one or maybe two big encounters per day, and it turns out when the wizard uses 5 encounters worth of resources at once they tend to win. But the other characters that are short-rest based don't have that option, and then feel bad.

There are other ways to have story beats than the long-rest cadence D&D does.



More options than most RPGs? Are you kidding?

What does a rogue get to pick at 2nd level, 5th level, 7th level, 9th level, 11th level? Nothing.

The levels where you get choices tend to be pretty narrow in scope. Pick a subclass. Pick an ability score to improve (but probably just your main one), or maybe a feat. Feats are pretty limited though.

Compare to, say, CofD where you can buy stuff directly with XP. Compare with Fate where you can free form upgrade your aspects, or improve skills. Hell, even compare with 3rd edition where you could build towards some wacky prestige class combinations.

I hear what you are saying, but ultimately it seems like your main complaint is that video game D&D isn't as freeform as tabletop RPGs. And while that's semi-valid, games like MtA and FATE would translate pretty poorly to a video game medium without some massive rein-ins (much like D&D).

So swinging back around, what video games have magic systems you would consider "good"? Because while tabletop has far more freedom, they're not to direct topic at hand here.

 

[J.King]

It's the company behind the launcher and the product that is the launcher that are sticking points for me. I don't resent competition, I resent a non-competitive entry that sits on games like Smaug instead of competing on differentiating on features, functionality, price, or uniqueness like GOG's DRM-less downloads and standalone installers.

One of the reasons I shop exclusively with GOG is that they don't get in your way. You can use Galaxy or not. You can install a game from your library on someone else's computer and not worry about it mucking with your installation at home (or their account, if they have one). I feel like I'm treated fairly.

It does limit what I can buy and play, but I have more games than I have time for already, so that's hardly a problem for me.

 

[aliksy]

I hear what you are saying, but ultimately it seems like your main complaint is that video game D&D isn't as freeform as tabletop RPGs. And while that's semi-valid, games like MtA and FATE would translate pretty poorly to a video game medium without some massive rein-ins (much like D&D).

So swinging back around, what video games have magic systems you would consider "good"? Because while tabletop has far more freedom, they're not to direct topic at hand here.

You probably could do something like Mage: The Awakening in a video game. You probably couldn't do full Creative Thaumaturgy, but you could definitely do it as like

edit: i can't get markdown to work here
- choose your practice
- Some of the effects would have to be limited. Instead of Life: Ruling being able to make someone do anything, you'd have to limit it to like "disable, buff, control" or whatever. Flavor them appropriately so the Life:Ruling Disable is they fall asleep and Mind:Ruling: Disable is they go catatonic, or whatever.

• choose your spell factors
• choose your reaches
• choose your yantras
• spell willpower/mana

With some UI work like saved combinations or rotes, it would likely work fine. Even if you weren't doing Mage: The Awakening exactly, you could have those sort of decision factors as part of spellcasting.

You could also do something like how I think Shadowrun works, where you have more choices about how much force to put into the spell. The old sega genesis version of Shadowrun had that. You could build more of that. Build out from that about how much risk are you willing to take on instead of "The spell fires. Check off your spell slot." Hell, even 3e had more tactical depth with spellcasting provoking and getting hit could interrupt the spell.

Dragon's Dogma also has an interesting model where the biggest spells are slow. Yes, yes, having the wizard do nothing but channel for four turns would be boring in a turn based game. Probably don't do that. But you could have a system where spell effects ramp up. Maybe one turn of channeling does a small effect, and on turn two you can cash it in for a moderate effect or keep channeling to open more options. Now you have a whole new chunk of tactical play around when do I keep channeling vs when do I just fire it, can my team keep me safe another turn? (I kind of hacked this into D&D 5e once by introducing a trio of spells for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd level. Each did a slightly-less-than-their-level's worth of stuff, but if the target had been hit by the previous spell in the sequence the spell instead did extra stuff. It was kind of cool, but probably needed another balance pass)

Pillars of Eternity Cipher class is also pretty interesting. You need to build up charges by hitting stuff, and then you can spend the charges for spells. Higher level spells cost more. You could expand on that more and it would be interesting.

Divinity Original Sin 1 and 2 were also pretty okay. I didn't like how your level was the biggest deciding factor, more so than your tactics, but the spell system was fine. Some interesting interactions like making someone wet and then electrocuting them for a bigger stun. It's a bit gimmicky, but it's deeper than D&D magic tends to be.

There's a lot of room to make magic more interesting than 5e's "Check the spell slot box. The spell happens as described"

 

[LGonARS]

Because it’s not very good, particularly compared to the original which is the metric it is measured against. Maybe later it’ll get there, but right now it’s only just recently improved to become mostly playable mess.

I played precious little that came out this year. Generally, most larger titles I will wait a year or two for a price drop or sale. Of the 2023 titles I’ve played, none of them I particularly thought of as my personal game of the year. They are:

Age of Wonder 4, which is a mostly ok RTS.

Advanced Wars: Reboot Camp, A rehash of the GBA games

Baldurs Gate 3, a game I cannot deny the quality of, and I did love Act 1, but never finished because Act 2 did nothing for me.

Probably the game I would give it to is Vampire Survivors. It’s the only game I have ever chased 100% completion of and they keep updating the damn thing. For as simple of a game it is, it has swallowed up an inordinate amount of my time.

If you like the Advance Wars games, may I recommend to you Wargroove 1 and 2?
https://wargroove.com/

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62nqJxq3E-4

 

[uberculex]

I refuse to believe that blizzard polish is even a thing. They've not had a well polished experience since SC2.

 

[GremioIsDead]

Anyone got any recs for a PS5 couch coop suitable for a six year old? We’ve played through It Takes Two and SackBoy and would like something new. Bonus if it supports 3 players.

Haven looks too mature, right?

Download the Trine collection.

Pixeljunk Shooter is fun too!

 

[cbreak]

Shouldn't Diablo IV be on the worst games list? It was trash at launch and it isn't much better today. It seems to have been designed to simply waste someone's life, the game is all about the grind - and that isn't particularly rewarding.

And don't forget that upgradidng all gear to max level can easily cost several tens of thousands of real-life $. I'll stick with Diablo 3 for my diablo urges...

 

[adrianovaroli]

People don't like having multiple store fronts on their computer, just like people don't like multiple streaming service fronts. People don't want another account to manage.

This is in fact normal

You mean like how people in fact do have a combination of Netflix, Apple TV+, Amazon Prime and HBO? Those people? I mean I get it, it's not nice, but I hardly see people dismissing streaming TV like gamers apparently do with the EGS.

 

[HiroTheProtagonist]

You probably could do something like Mage: The Awakening in a video game. You probably couldn't do full Creative Thaumaturgy, but you could definitely do it as like

edit: i can't get markdown to work here
- choose your practice
- Some of the effects would have to be limited. Instead of Life: Ruling being able to make someone do anything, you'd have to limit it to like "disable, buff, control" or whatever. Flavor them appropriately so the Life:Ruling Disable is they fall asleep and Mind:Ruling: Disable is they go catatonic, or whatever.

• choose your spell factors
• choose your reaches
• choose your yantras
• spell willpower/mana

With some UI work like saved combinations or rotes, it would likely work fine. Even if you weren't doing Mage: The Awakening exactly, you could have those sort of decision factors as part of spellcasting.

You could also do something like how I think Shadowrun works, where you have more choices about how much force to put into the spell. The old sega genesis version of Shadowrun had that. You could build more of that. Build out from that about how much risk are you willing to take on instead of "The spell fires. Check off your spell slot." Hell, even 3e had more tactical depth with spellcasting provoking and getting hit could interrupt the spell.

Dragon's Dogma also has an interesting model where the biggest spells are slow. Yes, yes, having the wizard do nothing but channel for four turns would be boring in a turn based game. Probably don't do that. But you could have a system where spell effects ramp up. Maybe one turn of channeling does a small effect, and on turn two you can cash it in for a moderate effect or keep channeling to open more options. Now you have a whole new chunk of tactical play around when do I keep channeling vs when do I just fire it, can my team keep me safe another turn? (I kind of hacked this into D&D 5e once by introducing a trio of spells for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd level. Each did a slightly-less-than-their-level's worth of stuff, but if the target had been hit by the previous spell in the sequence the spell instead did extra stuff. It was kind of cool, but probably needed another balance pass)

Pillars of Eternity Cipher class is also pretty interesting. You need to build up charges by hitting stuff, and then you can spend the charges for spells. Higher level spells cost more. You could expand on that more and it would be interesting.

Divinity Original Sin 1 and 2 were also pretty okay. I didn't like how your level was the biggest deciding factor, more so than your tactics, but the spell system was fine. Some interesting interactions like making someone wet and then electrocuting them for a bigger stun. It's a bit gimmicky, but it's deeper than D&D magic tends to be.

There's a lot of room to make magic more interesting than 5e's "Check the spell slot box. The spell happens as described"

You make some very good points, thank you for enumerating. I guess I'm just so used to the "D&D magic sucks" with zero elaboration that my instinct is to jab back.

 

[GloatingSwine]

Washington State is my jam, so I’m looking forward to playing Alan Wake 2 when it comes to Steam.

Not buying on Epic Game Store, not even for Alan Wake 2.

Since the game is published by Epic you may be waiting some time.

 

[aliksy]

You make some very good points, thank you for enumerating. I guess I'm just so used to the "D&D magic sucks" with zero elaboration that my instinct is to jab back.

Thanks for responding civilly. Pretty rare on the Internet!

 

[Kesh]

You probably could do something like Mage: The Awakening in a video game. You probably couldn't do full Creative Thaumaturgy, but you could definitely do it as like

edit: i can't get markdown to work here
- choose your practice
- Some of the effects would have to be limited. Instead of Life: Ruling being able to make someone do anything, you'd have to limit it to like "disable, buff, control" or whatever. Flavor them appropriately so the Life:Ruling Disable is they fall asleep and Mind:Ruling: Disable is they go catatonic, or whatever.

• choose your spell factors
• choose your reaches
• choose your yantras
• spell willpower/mana

With some UI work like saved combinations or rotes, it would likely work fine. Even if you weren't doing Mage: The Awakening exactly, you could have those sort of decision factors as part of spellcasting.

Yeah, you'd have to gut the magic system down to Rotes, which makes it pale in comparison to the TTRPG.

 

[RoninX]

You probably could do something like Mage: The Awakening in a video game.

Tangentially related, I'd love to see Matt Wagner's Grendel as a first-person, story-and-character-driven, action-packed video game.

 

[PhaseB]

How is Baldurs Gate not an Indi game?

Baldur's Gate 3 is an indie game in the same way the Cyberpunk 2077 is an indie game...

 

[el_oscuro]

Note that none of these are available on Linux. This isn't intended as a complaint, just to save people time checking, since Ars sometimes omits listing Linux/SteamOS support when it is available.

I'm currently playing Starfield on a new System76 machine. And the only glitch it had affected all other Proton games as well. I tried to install it on a second drive mounted on /usr/local/games and nothing would start. But everything (including Starfield) worked perfectly if I installed them in the default location under $HOME. Apparently that drive restriction is not specific to Proton - according to my daughter who works for Bethesda, many of these same games require installation on the C: drive on Windows.

 

[Ilikebundy99]

Lost a lot of respect for Ars Technica when I saw Diablo IV on that list.

 

[slymenstra hymen]

One of the reasons I shop exclusively with GOG is that they don't get in your way. You can use Galaxy or not. You can install a game from your library on someone else's computer and not worry about it mucking with your installation at home (or their account, if they have one). I feel like I'm treated fairly.

It does limit what I can buy and play, but I have more games than I have time for already, so that's hardly a problem for me.

Yeah, I recently bought BG3 on GOG instead of Steam specifically because they don't get in your way. I didn't want the same issues I had with Skyrim on Steam popping up where Steam would force updates and break all your mods. If there was a Do Not Update option for Steam I probably would have got it from there, but since they want me to jump through hoops to keep the game install stable I went with GOG.

 

[malor]

Yeah, I recently bought BG3 on GOG instead of Steam specifically because they don't get in your way. I didn't want the same issues I had with Skyrim on Steam popping up where Steam would force updates and break all your mods. If there was a Do Not Update option for Steam I probably would have got it from there, but since they want me to jump through hoops to keep the game install stable I went with GOG.

I went the other way, because I'm assuming (which may be stupid) that the game will eventually have Workshop support. Modding via Workshop is just really pleasant and low-hassle, and it's been a strong attractant for me back away from GOG. If I think I'm going to want to mod something, I'll typically buy it on Steam first.

Of course, while it's quite likely that Larian will release mod tools, there's no guarantee it will support Workshop. I may end up buying the GOG variant too, if the Steam version ends up sucking for the reasons you mention. But the game is so good that I don't really mind buying it twice.

 

[darkowl]

While I can understand the sentiment, I hope Kevin got to the Ashtray Maze level, because that was absolutely badass.

I don't really understand the hype around this. If you take away the fancy build in and out effects of bits of wall appearing and disappearing and moving around, it's an incredibly linear series of corridors with only a little bit of vertical movement here and there. It's not even a maze, you just move from one area to another, with the illusion that areas you could have walked down are closed off and moved around you. The wall animations are very competent, to be sure. And Poets' music is always a delight. But the actual "maze" itself? Extremely underwhelming.

 

[malor]

I don't really understand the hype around this. If you take away the fancy build in and out effects of bits of wall appearing and disappearing and moving around, it's an incredibly linear series of corridors with only a little bit of vertical movement here and there. It's not even a maze, you just move from one area to another, with the illusion that areas you could have walked down are closed off and moved around you. The wall animations are very competent, to be sure. And Poets' music is always a delight. But the actual "maze" itself? Extremely underwhelming.

It's different when you're actually playing it. And it's called a maze because it is a maze, one you can't pass through, until you find the cassette player with the soundtrack.

 

[vlam]

Baldur's Gate 3 is an indie game in the same way the Cyberpunk 2077 is an indie game...

Yes. Both made by independent studio not owned by a larger conglomerate of studios (ala Activision, Ubisoft, Sony).

They are quite literally indi.

 

[malor]

Yes. Both made by independent studio not owned by a larger conglomerate of studios (ala Activision, Ubisoft, Sony).

They are quite literally indi.

I don't think of either Larian or CDProjekt as being indie; they're big, professional outfits that do their own publishing. They're just not behemoths.

And BG3 is so enormous that a truly small studio couldn't have hoped to tackle it.

 

[aliksy]

Yeah, you'd have to gut the magic system down to Rotes, which makes it pale in comparison to the TTRPG.

This is increasingly off topic but for the four of us who know mage the awakening:

Even if you codified a lot of effects into specific spells, being able to pick your yantras, choose willpower or mana costs, choose your spell factors, choose what to do for paradox, you'd still have a more interesting and deeper magic system than DND.

But I think you could probably get pretty far by coding stuff you can do for each practice, and but you'd probably have to special case a lot of it. And probably don't go to 5 point effects. Still, DND magic is like all special cases so there's precedent.

But this is a sad dream because awakening is I think a dead game line. Ascension might have money behind it still, but I don't like it as much as awakening.

 

[vlam]

I don't think of either Larian or CDProjekt as being indie; they're big, professional outfits that do their own publishing. They're just not behemoths.

And BG3 is so enormous that a truly small studio couldn't have hoped to tackle it.

Independent doesn't mean small. Independent means solo. Larian is solo.

 

[apoclypse]

Games on EGS are in a lot of cases cheaper than on Steam.

I haven't seen that to be true. Right now Hogwarts Legacy even on sale on EGS at $35 is more expensive than Steam at $29. Control Ultimate edition even on sale is $19.99 on EGS, $9.99 on steam. DNF Duel is $49.99 on EGS, $19.99 on Steam. Deus Ex: Mankind Divided is $29.99 on EGS, $4.99 on steam. Hell previous exclusive Final Fantasy 7 Remake Integrade is still $69.99(!) on EGS, Steam has it at $34.99.

This winter sale alone Steam games are much lower cost than EGS. Significantly so. I have yet to see a game on EGS that was significantly cheaper than Steam, at most I've seen $5-10 bucks and when the game goes on sale on Steam, its usually way lower in price than EGS. Whatever smoke Tim was pushing about their revenue share being only 12% being good for the market, maybe for developers, but as a consumer EGS is not more cost effective than steam. Far from it from what I'v seen.

 

[apoclypse]

You mean like how people in fact do have a combination of Netflix, Apple TV+, Amazon Prime and HBO? Those people? I mean I get it, it's not nice, but I hardly see people dismissing streaming TV like gamers apparently do with the EGS.

The difference is that there is no real benefit to EGS. You can run Fortnite and maybe a few exclusives but the barrier there is actually arbitrary. Netflix, Disney etc are siloing you in from the start, you have no choice what you get in the service, you can't pick and choose what you get in the service. You get whatever you get from Netflix or Disney. With EGS, I can just wait a few months and get the game on Steam often cheaper and never have to deal with EGS.

Look I was a proponent for EGS when it first came out because I too don't like monopolies even if they are relatively benign like Steam is, but EGS has not stepped up to the plate. There is nothing compelling to the service. Games aren't actually cheaper, services are worse than Steam, the storefront and software is not good, and Epic seems to be more concerned with locking in exclusive to drive traffic than actually improving the experience. I had a lot of hope for the store. I thought if anyone could actually challenge Steam, Fortnite Moneybags Epic could, but here we are.

 

[el_oscuro]

Yeah, I recently bought BG3 on GOG instead of Steam specifically because they don't get in your way. I didn't want the same issues I had with Skyrim on Steam popping up where Steam would force updates and break all your mods. If there was a Do Not Update option for Steam I probably would have got it from there, but since they want me to jump through hoops to keep the game install stable I went with GOG.

Steam actually does have that - I used to use it for KSP for those exact same reasons. Right click on the game and select "betas". You should be able to select a different version of the game, i.e.:

Spoiler

 

[malor]

Steam actually does have that - I used to use it for KSP for those exact same reasons. Right click on the game and select "betas".

That's dependent on the game publisher offering multiple versions in branches. If they don't explicitly go out of their way to do that, you can't stop a game from being auto-updated.

 

[ddean]

ToTK was really, really good. But I don't own a Switch; I bought a copy that's still sitting there unopened, and played it on Ryujinx, one of the two main Switch emulators on the PC. It ran superbly. I played it purely vanilla, to be safe, but there are mods to increase the frame rate from 30 to 60fps on the PC. Those might be tempting, now that it's been out awhile, and the bugs are probably squashed.

My overall experience was quite smooth, though not flawless. It crashed on me twice during cutscenes (in like 150 hours, so not often at all), and the frame generation would often be choppy until shaders for a given area had compiled. They're saved to disk, so once you've gotten through the initial jank in a new area, it's smooth, even on subsequent launches. Post-compile, the framerates were rock solid, which I gather is better than what happens on real hardware. I haven't tried there, but it sounds like some areas stay choppy permanently on the actual hardware, where they're only sluggish for 10 or 20 seconds on your first visit with the PC.

Oh, and then sometimes shaders need to be recompiled after an emulator or video driver update, but the recompile happens at launch. So it can take a bit to start playing on the PC, but then any area you've already visited will be smooth.

I'm sure Nintendo would be unhappy with me, but by God, I paid for the game, so I feel zero guilt about doing so on different, somewhat superior hardware. I recommend the experience to others.

I own a Switch and bought the game and then discovered Ryujinx with ToTK mods (60 FPS in particular) plus upscaling to 4k. I will never go back to the Switch version because emulation on the PC is such a better experience (obviously less portable though). Nintendo really needs to come out with better hardware to run their current games if emulation does a better job.

 

[Tridus]

I don't think of either Larian or CDProjekt as being indie; they're big, professional outfits that do their own publishing. They're just not behemoths.

And BG3 is so enormous that a truly small studio couldn't have hoped to tackle it.

So you're redefining "indie" to mean "small" and then using that to claim that Larian doesn't qualify. Despite the fact that they've perennially faced the indie problem of "if this game isn't a success we are out of business."

 

[malor]

So you're redefining "indie" to mean "small" and then using that to claim that Larian doesn't qualify. Despite the fact that they've perennially faced the indie problem of "if this game isn't a success we are out of business."

No, I'm definining "indie" as "studios that can't self-publish."

 

[eldakka]

I just have a harder and harder time playing these games that are constantly showing you what parts of the game you don't have that cost additional money.

This in-your-face give-me-more-money mechanism infuriates me.

I purchased TW:Warhammer II, and the campaign screen I think it was, where you select what campaign/world you wanted to play, had more greyed-out 'buy the DLC to unlock' campaigns than were available to play with the standard edition. Having the odd subtle hint is fine - it's just advertising - but having all the DLC features present but greyed out on the same option screen with a 'buy DLC to unlock this feature' as available optoins infuriated me to the point where I immediately quit the game and got a steam refund for it.

That was the first Total War game I didn't buy - I've bought and played every one until that point, and it's also the last Total War game I've tried.

 

[Kevinpurdy]

While I can understand the sentiment, I hope Kevin got to the Ashtray Maze level, because that was absolutely badass.

I did, and I appreciated it. I have friends who tell me I’m nuts for not just turning on the accessibility/difficulty helpers and catching the rest of the story. I just wanted to move on at that point; maybe to Elden Ring, if I have the timing right. I have since watched the relevant cutscenes/ending on YouTube, like a cheater, and overall think of it as a ridiculously cool game.