Apple MacBook Neo review: Can a Mac get by with an iPhone’s processor inside?
- Thread starter JournalBot
- Start date
The thing that I find really interesting and that a lot of people don’t give a nearly enough ink on is that they’ve gotten OSX to run on an iPhone processor. Let that sink in for a minute when we can’t even get dual booting on an iPad Pro lol.
I’m a serious note though it is fascinating that they’ve got this processor to run OSX as well as it is running it and what makes me want to buy this versus the M1 MacBook Air is the likelihood of future supports will be significantly longer for the Neo than the M1 air as of this date.
I feel like next year‘s iteration (or whenever they use the A19 pro) Will be the laptop that they were really intending, but couldn’t hit the price point.
I think I will end up buying this particular laptop nearly because it fits the used case that I have in mind: my disabled brother needs something portable, good enough for basic tasks, will last awhile and he loves apple OSX.
I’m a serious note though it is fascinating that they’ve got this processor to run OSX as well as it is running it and what makes me want to buy this versus the M1 MacBook Air is the likelihood of future supports will be significantly longer for the Neo than the M1 air as of this date.
I feel like next year‘s iteration (or whenever they use the A19 pro) Will be the laptop that they were really intending, but couldn’t hit the price point.
I think I will end up buying this particular laptop nearly because it fits the used case that I have in mind: my disabled brother needs something portable, good enough for basic tasks, will last awhile and he loves apple OSX.
Upvote
-9
(21
/
-30)
I wonder if the throttling behavior is thermal, or if it's just conservative in firmware with boost times because it started as a phone chip. Curious if a thermal pad mod would keep it above M1 consistently where it slows down to below it here, or it's hard limited to boost 1 for seconds, boost 2 for a minute etc.
Upvote
10
(10
/
0)
It seems they really wanted to hit the $599 price point. I presume they had their reasons based on market research. But I agree, an A19 with 12 GB would have removed the biggest complaint against this machine.
Upvote
24
(25
/
-1)
I love that someone at Apple was millennial enough to come up with "Hello, Neo." for the introduction page, and someone else was millennial enough to approve it. I imagine a lot of people shopping for this laptop have never seen The Matrix, but it certainly gave me a smile.
Upvote
35
(36
/
-1)
Yes, and that person would probably be able to set the “looks like” resolution to 1440p and be quite happy with the space and readable text. It wouldn’t be retina perfect but we have already established that this is not the market of demanding customers.
Upvote
10
(10
/
0)
Much like the original MacBook, I don’t get it, it’s not for me, and it will probably be the most common laptop you see for the next 10 years.
Upvote
11
(22
/
-11)
I'm also wondering if they wanted to hit this MSRP to give discounters an opportunity to sell through that channel to non edu customers and occasionally provide a deal. It's not uncommon to have the base iPad show up for $299 - $329 for example.
Upvote
9
(9
/
0)
This I think will mirror the XR to 11 and 16e to 17e value propositions
A subtle seeming "speed bump" update actually raises the value tremendously, and A19 Pro with 12GB would make it almost no compromise for even more people
But what /is/ the A19 Pro with 12GB doing in a monitor instead of this lol. I guess it's entirely because of the cost of the unit dwarfing the cost of the A19 plus lower yield on that and needing a tiny fraction the chips for a very expensive monitor.
Upvote
15
(15
/
0)
Sometimes you want an aspirational laptop, something that sits on your desk most of the time, but which you do occasionally schlep somewhere because you're going out of town or need a change of scenery. For me, that's the base 16" M5 MacBook Pro (I don't own one, but I aspire to).
Sometimes you want a laptop that's definitely going with you to a lot of places. You're not going to wipe the keyboard every time you close it. You don't need to run ProTools or do big Xcode compiles with it, but an iPad just isn't going to cut it.
You can get four of these for what you'd pay for one "aspirational" machine. I'm glad I'm not living a life anymore where I need something like this (and I have an M1 MBA anyway), but I love that it's there if that changes.
Sometimes you want a laptop that's definitely going with you to a lot of places. You're not going to wipe the keyboard every time you close it. You don't need to run ProTools or do big Xcode compiles with it, but an iPad just isn't going to cut it.
You can get four of these for what you'd pay for one "aspirational" machine. I'm glad I'm not living a life anymore where I need something like this (and I have an M1 MBA anyway), but I love that it's there if that changes.
Last edited:
Upvote
24
(24
/
0)
Apple does have some non-trivial MDM systems, which are also used for large iPad deployments.
I've seen some comments from people in Education that with their discount the base model really is a viable Chromebook competitors, especially if they also have a fleet of iPads.
Upvote
24
(25
/
-1)
Well, iPhone and iPad CPUs were the same, and the dev kit was literally using the iPad CPU, and iPads are using the same CPU as entry level macs, with the iPhone CPU being kind of shrunk down. Also iOS and macOS are very similar under the hood, once you remove the difference in UI framework, and the extra restrictions / sandboxing on everything.
Upvote
27
(27
/
0)
I wonder if they could design future A-series SoCs to use 20Gbps USB 3 instead of 10Gbps, but for a future Neo, they could cut that down to 2x 10Gbps USB 3 instead? It'd be a minor bump on the iPhone Pro for speeds, and means they wouldn't need to add support for an arguably unnecessary port. Although, I assume to implement that on a Neo, it would require the use of a hub controller on the board.
Upvote
7
(7
/
0)
Counterpoint: those (early core-based or late PPC G4s) were decently powerful relative to other computers in schools and more powerful than your average low-end/cheap Pentium M and Celeron Windows laptops of the day.
The neo is a significantly more down-market product vs any of those past Apple laptops. Apple is so ubiquitous now that I don't think they can hurt their brand with clunkier, cheap computers... but going this low-end is still new territory for them.
Upvote
9
(11
/
-2)
I hear you, but this aint it. The lack of TB ports means you can't hook into a good docking station to switch to desktop usage for the standard set of accessories you want to use.
At this point, and foreseeably in the future as long as future A2X chips are i/o constrained, this won't change.
Its firmly in the lightweight laptop category and really won't get out of it. Which is where Apple wants it in the lineup.
Upvote
-13
(4
/
-17)
This is an interesting product to me. There's a lot of talk about "intended audience," but as someone who works with college students (and is familiar with their computing habits and woes), a few things stand out.
As a device for middle and high school students, it's fine. It's also fine for many college students, except those that go into fields where suddenly they find themselves needing to buy a new computer because this one is not up for the task of their course work. We're not expecting "pro" level machines at this stage but the RAM, ports, and slow SSDs, all point to issues today, let alone in a few years.
Granted this is an issue with Windows laptops as well, but in the past we could always say " basically any MacBook will do" and this changes that equation.
It also changes the expectation around lifespan. Even if it can adequately be used for coursework today, what about in three years as the machine itself ages and the student is—presumably—working on more complex projects.
Again, I agree it's fine for many use cases, but I know from experience that many buyers will not go into purchasing this as clear-eyed about their needs as the reviews imply.
Students aside, it also feels like a knock against Macs being seen as aspirational products. Not so much in terms of the "high end" or "premium" branding, but rather the aspirational idea of what you one day might do with it. Sure you may not be a video editor, photographer, or music producer TODAY, but buying that MacBook meant that if you decide to go down that road in the future, you already have one of the most important tools to get started.
This might seem silly, but I can't tell you how many students I have met over the years that show up with a MacBook and Logic ready to start learning how to make music with it.
As a device for middle and high school students, it's fine. It's also fine for many college students, except those that go into fields where suddenly they find themselves needing to buy a new computer because this one is not up for the task of their course work. We're not expecting "pro" level machines at this stage but the RAM, ports, and slow SSDs, all point to issues today, let alone in a few years.
Granted this is an issue with Windows laptops as well, but in the past we could always say " basically any MacBook will do" and this changes that equation.
It also changes the expectation around lifespan. Even if it can adequately be used for coursework today, what about in three years as the machine itself ages and the student is—presumably—working on more complex projects.
Again, I agree it's fine for many use cases, but I know from experience that many buyers will not go into purchasing this as clear-eyed about their needs as the reviews imply.
Students aside, it also feels like a knock against Macs being seen as aspirational products. Not so much in terms of the "high end" or "premium" branding, but rather the aspirational idea of what you one day might do with it. Sure you may not be a video editor, photographer, or music producer TODAY, but buying that MacBook meant that if you decide to go down that road in the future, you already have one of the most important tools to get started.
This might seem silly, but I can't tell you how many students I have met over the years that show up with a MacBook and Logic ready to start learning how to make music with it.
Upvote
2
(13
/
-11)
The iPad Pro have Thunderbolt support. Perhaps we'll get in a few year a thunderbolt capable iPhone whose CPU will happen to also go in the Neo refresh.
An interesting question is, how is the boot loader locked / unlocked, since the chips are likely identical out of the fab.
Has apple designed the A18Pro with the goal of putting it in computers, or have all their iPhone chips been capable of iDevice locked boot and mac unlocked boot, for a few generations already, by default ?
I feel it might not cost a huge amount of Silicon to make the two ports be Thunderbolt, and that the model success can probably justify designing the iPhone chips to support this.
Upvote
-5
(3
/
-8)
Are the "A Series" chips really that much cheaper than the "M Series" chips?
I'm curious on the economics of it. Is it per-unit costs, or being able to shut down the M1 line (or use up those chips?). Or the Logistics of having a consumer for the old "A series" chips that allows better economies of Scale as they plan out, and pay for the iphone Chips.
If they had used an "M2", would the price have gone up $50? or $100?
I just wanted to be able to boost the memory to 16GB
I'm curious on the economics of it. Is it per-unit costs, or being able to shut down the M1 line (or use up those chips?). Or the Logistics of having a consumer for the old "A series" chips that allows better economies of Scale as they plan out, and pay for the iphone Chips.
If they had used an "M2", would the price have gone up $50? or $100?
I just wanted to be able to boost the memory to 16GB
Upvote
11
(11
/
0)
What specifically would be beyond the capabilities of this laptop but would work on a 16GB macOS laptop? Obviously I can contrive a working set that will thrash an 8GB device, but I can contrive such a working set for any given capacity. I would like to know what is this widespread workload that emerges regularly in higher education.
Upvote
25
(28
/
-3)
To me, from the perspective of an individual buyer, long term success of the Neo line will depend on how often Apple refreshes it and how much they’re giving customers back in terms of trade-in value. If one could get the Neo II in a year or two for effectively half price after a Neo I trade in, I can see this really being the only MacBook most people will ever need.
Upvote
11
(11
/
0)
Honestly, anyone here is not the target audience for the Neo. And Neo buyers are highly unlikely to be running zoom calls on a 4K external monitor that costs more than the laptop itself. Or slicing 3D models. The author spends 90% of the review focusing on detailed performance metrics (that are useful if reviewing a high performance laptop) and is obscuring the forest with the trees. It’s a high quality low cost laptop that blows the equivalent windows 11 and chromebooks out of the water. End of story.
Upvote
74
(80
/
-6)
RickRoyLeonPrisZhoraRacha
Ars Scholae Palatinae
Base iPad Pros, iPad and iPad Air have the same 8GB memory. And Apple's "unified" system manages it fairly well. If you need more to do more, you are not the fit for the Neo. If you use an iPad/pro/air for daily work like email, web, photos, music, shopping, but don't use touchscreen much (using a Magic Keyboard case), then this is for you. Now its US$700, not US$600 if you want want touchID to unlock and double the storage. Still, $700 is not unreasonable. Would 16GB be preferred? Absolutely, but it cuts into the MacbookAir sales. I know many that waited to replace a touchbar MacbookPro for the new M5 MacbookAir. Touchbar was not practical and actually failed. And ram is important when you have dozens of open browser tabs, and other apps, kept open.
I wonder how this Neo fairs with Zoom or Teams, along with MS apps (notorious for memory). I think using a lite version of Photoshop, or perhaps Apple's future integration of Afinity apps will have a more efficient competitor to Adobe's dominance (Adobe apps take up alot of resources, even Acrobat DC being open, Mail open, and browser... can slog a MacbookAir M4).
With economy in turmoil, RAM and storage prices increases, this could be a winner for those not wanting an iPad cost with cover/keyboard but also a stepping stone to Apple's future dependence and security.
Speaking of that, how many of our parents or elderly that need computers, have Windows and the massive worry of malware, updates, and just endless vulnerabilities on that platform? Not saying the Mac is 100% secure, but I think for most, this might be a viable alternative than spending $1500 or more on a new PC to just have Windows 11. And you don't get office apps.
Speaking of productivity, you will have Pages, Keynote and Numbers. Understand that when a new version comes out, you will need to pay to upgrade (difference than updates). Also, apps like LibreOffice does not work on A-processors (only supported on the M-silicone). So if you need Office compatibility, and thus Pages can open, edit, save Word files as either .doc/.docx or pages files.
If I was to need a small, Mac notebook, for travel and not heavy work (4K edits, music productions, lots of collaborations, etc), or something for a teen or parent to use, this could be a starter for a few years while they get accustomed to Mac OS. But you need to verify that all the apps they need will run on this device. Otherwise, you might be better with the MacbookAir M5 13" ... that is from US$700 to US$1300 for having more cores, bandwidth, 16GB ram and 1TB storage. Also, the M5 13" Macbook Air is same weight.
I wonder how this Neo fairs with Zoom or Teams, along with MS apps (notorious for memory). I think using a lite version of Photoshop, or perhaps Apple's future integration of Afinity apps will have a more efficient competitor to Adobe's dominance (Adobe apps take up alot of resources, even Acrobat DC being open, Mail open, and browser... can slog a MacbookAir M4).
With economy in turmoil, RAM and storage prices increases, this could be a winner for those not wanting an iPad cost with cover/keyboard but also a stepping stone to Apple's future dependence and security.
Speaking of that, how many of our parents or elderly that need computers, have Windows and the massive worry of malware, updates, and just endless vulnerabilities on that platform? Not saying the Mac is 100% secure, but I think for most, this might be a viable alternative than spending $1500 or more on a new PC to just have Windows 11. And you don't get office apps.
Speaking of productivity, you will have Pages, Keynote and Numbers. Understand that when a new version comes out, you will need to pay to upgrade (difference than updates). Also, apps like LibreOffice does not work on A-processors (only supported on the M-silicone). So if you need Office compatibility, and thus Pages can open, edit, save Word files as either .doc/.docx or pages files.
If I was to need a small, Mac notebook, for travel and not heavy work (4K edits, music productions, lots of collaborations, etc), or something for a teen or parent to use, this could be a starter for a few years while they get accustomed to Mac OS. But you need to verify that all the apps they need will run on this device. Otherwise, you might be better with the MacbookAir M5 13" ... that is from US$700 to US$1300 for having more cores, bandwidth, 16GB ram and 1TB storage. Also, the M5 13" Macbook Air is same weight.
Upvote
-16
(3
/
-19)
Upvote
0
(0
/
0)
iPhone numbers dwarf the numbers of everything else, and the chips have a lower silicon surface too.
So your wafers cost less because you make more of them, and each gaffer gives more chips, and the chips are simpler, so have a better yield (especially since these are the 5 GPU cores instead of 6, they are probably chips that are binned and not going to phones).
Add the fact that this is last year's phone, so they probably have a good reserve of chips as the sales slow down, and this might be on an older process.
Upvote
36
(36
/
0)
Thermal throttling will always be based on temperature. A Macbook will remove extra heat faster than an iPhone, so it will always be able to produce more energy use than an iPhone, and run at higher performance than an iPhone at the same temperature. There's no need for a firmware update. You may have different parameters depending on the battery size.
Upvote
-17
(4
/
-21)
Wtf is the Libre Office doesn't work on A18 Pro thing ? Pretty sure this is either a dumb processor name parsing bug, or just bad doc reading and that it will work fine. The A18 Pro and the M4 use the same underlying CPU micro-architectures.
(The M1 was literally A14X renamed)
Upvote
21
(23
/
-2)
It's the 8GB. I've run 'the forbidden configuration' (macOS in a VM) and with 8GB, once macOS starts running the file indexing etc. it's already just beginning to 'swap' (it uses a compressed swap system first, before it goes to physical swapping). That's before I have the VM actually doing anything. I won't say macOS has been getting bloated, but it has not been getting any slimmer over the last several years and the RAM usage has increased a bit. Unless Apple puts macOS on a diet, It wouldn't take much at all in a future macOS version for it to be like "Yeah, it runs on the Neo, but it's dead slow due to constant swapping".
Upvote
4
(10
/
-6)
Wildly off topic but, what a coincidence (almost did a spit-take) as we just got an Acer N60-640-EB23 and it is an amazing, wonderful, living-room-TV PC. Silent as a church mouse and runs every game we've tried at full beans 4k. Husband was waiting for the steam cube for too long and not wanting another playstation.
As a long time mac user (except for wretched work-provided dell precisions) I am really loathe to get another apple product after this 2021 mbp. For all everybody complains about windows 11, it's really nice for me. On the work-dell, as well: No goofy workarounds like windows 10 had for network settings or registry edits or trip to the IT office to make the dspace rti work again. I must be the only person who actually likes windows 11. Gah! (I would put "runs macos tahoe" in the "ugly" column)
Last edited:
Upvote
-14
(7
/
-21)
Based on the benchmarks, it looks like it compares similarly to the original M1 MacBook Air which is 5 years old at this point. The M1 was a huge leap forward at the time so maybe the usability of that machine is even longer than typical, but I would be shocked if this machine has the typical 8-10 year usefulness. But at this price point, that's to be expected.
Upvote
9
(9
/
0)
Great article, thanks. Exactly the info I was looking for about the Neo. In my mind the tl;dr basically says to me that this should be priced at $449 to be considered generally useful. Somewhat better than a Chromebook, not better than a midrange x86 laptop from HP or Dell (aside from the screen maybe).
Otherwise it seems to me that you get more for your money getting a refurb M1 at ~$400 and could do a lot better with a refurb M2 at the $599 price point.
Otherwise it seems to me that you get more for your money getting a refurb M1 at ~$400 and could do a lot better with a refurb M2 at the $599 price point.
Upvote
-3
(5
/
-8)
I should have premised in my comment and I’m glad you addressed that, more a frustration of me wanting to carry around one device more than anything. Ultimately I do understand why they wouldn’t want to do that but I just found it fascinating that the neo is a viable option that will be that much more interesting once the processor is ultimately updated.
Upvote
3
(3
/
0)
I had to LOLOLOLOL at the big glass of tea next to the keyboard. I’m looking forward to the Reddit “HELP!” posts.
Upvote
-2
(2
/
-4)
I'd expect it's entirely down to RAM. Everything else about this will age better than most Windows laptops in it's price range, but most of those laptops are shipping with 16GB which for once means they'll probably age better.
Upvote
5
(8
/
-3)
Good point. I learned the hard way to mostly avoid first generation Apple products, the M1 MBA being the exception; mine with 8GB RAM still runs well after 6 years.
Upvote
7
(8
/
-1)
You know what I've tried to find in tech journalism, and had a hard time finding, but would be amazingly useful, is a guide to the best refurbished laptops. Laptops from say the last 3 years, which might have been quite expensive at release, but now could be had for like 1/2 as much money.
Yes, I can try to find old reviews of some of the better mid-range and high-range laptops from say 2 years ago, and then go look for those refurb. . . but that's a lot of work, and the kind of thing such a guide from a site like Ars, could really help a lot of people from doing the exact same homework.
And such a guide could also warn users away from deals that LOOK like good deals, but maybe some particular make/model isn't as good of a deal as it appears, because of high failure rates of the internal ssd or gpu or whatever.
Yes, I can try to find old reviews of some of the better mid-range and high-range laptops from say 2 years ago, and then go look for those refurb. . . but that's a lot of work, and the kind of thing such a guide from a site like Ars, could really help a lot of people from doing the exact same homework.
And such a guide could also warn users away from deals that LOOK like good deals, but maybe some particular make/model isn't as good of a deal as it appears, because of high failure rates of the internal ssd or gpu or whatever.
Upvote
8
(9
/
-1)
The Neo is positioned more for people considering iPad+keyboard ($349+$299=$649) rather than those considering a MacBook Air.
Upvote
15
(16
/
-1)
The Neo supports one screen at up to 3840×2160 at 60 Hz output, so that should work.
MacBooks with M-series Apple silicon support multiple screens and higher resolutions.
Be aware that a typical widescreen 3440×1440 screen has about half the pixel density of a "Retina" display.
While Windows and Linux typically use subpixel text rendering to make text sharper, MacOS does not.
Apple instead opted to double the total pixel density on all their screens.
Therefore text in MacOS on that screen will look a little less sharp than text in Windows.
Upvote
9
(9
/
0)
Yeah, I chuckled my way through this review.
I get why it was done that way, but it bears no resemblance to the way it’ll be used in real life.
Upvote
21
(24
/
-3)
That doesn't make sense.
The MacBook shipped with 8GB RAM as default until 2025. If "any MacBook" was really good enough for kids in class to start using Logic, then the majority would have been bringing in base model MacBook Airs with 8GB RAM until just last year.
That's literally this laptop. No reason why 8GB RAM would suddenly be "years of college work" for music/video students up to 2025, but suddenly not this year.
Upvote
40
(43
/
-3)
This is the perfect laptop for elementary/highschool kids, grandparents who just email and look at pics of their grandkids, and other day to day people who aren't power users. This is just like in the automotive world where 99% of the people don't go barreling down twisty backroads, racing people at stoplights, and just commute to school/work and back and pick up groceries. It's a daily driver laptop for everyday non-power use.
Upvote
30
(32
/
-2)