2025 VW Jetta GLI: It’s got power, but driving poetry takes a back seat
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So go and buy a Honda Civic Si (or Hybrid) and call it a day?
Out of curiosity, are the GLI's on independent or beam rear axles for this generation? Unfortunately, VW's level of investment in the Jetta really is made evident by not bothering to evict the capacitive controls.
On a side note, I feel like I'm noticing Ars's automotive reviews taking on a slightly spicier tone lately. I think I like it, particularly the mild-but-present enthusiast bent. Maybe I'm imagining things though.
Out of curiosity, are the GLI's on independent or beam rear axles for this generation? Unfortunately, VW's level of investment in the Jetta really is made evident by not bothering to evict the capacitive controls.
On a side note, I feel like I'm noticing Ars's automotive reviews taking on a slightly spicier tone lately. I think I like it, particularly the mild-but-present enthusiast bent. Maybe I'm imagining things though.
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228hp / 270kW , those numbers do not maek sense.
228kW are about 310Hp
270HP are a little less than 200kW
228kW are about 310Hp
270HP are a little less than 200kW
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probably but also:
or Elantra N
or Mustang Ecoboost (let me explain)
or Subaru WRX
They're all surprisingly in the same sub $35K MSRP range
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228hp is 170kW, so that looks like a typo on the kW side.228hp / 270kW , those numbers do not maek sense.
228kW are about 310Hp
270HP are a little less than 200kW
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That was a complaint I had with the manual in the GTI as well - the gear ratios were super tall in 1st and 2nd which made it a little less fun to wring out compared to shorter, tighter gear ratios in the Golf R. I think they did that because it means one less shift to 60 (so faster 0-60 times) and you can keep revs lower in higher gear for efficiency reasons. As for the complaint about the gearbox itself, I honestly don’t get it - its not the sportiest gearbox I’ve had, but its not mush - gear changes are pretty direct, i don’t think the throws are that bad, but I usually put a short shifter on my cars anyway, and this might sound dumb, but its incredibly forgiving and easy to drive in traffic. The clutch is light, the torque band is pretty flat and wide, its hard to lug, and outside of it being close to the limit on torque (if you tune, plan for a sportier clutch replacement), its good. I much prefer it to the WRX, Elantra N, older BMWs, and at least when it was still around, the Focus ST. I can see an argument for the Elantra N over the GLI, but I don’t see the same for the Civic SI. The SI is significantly slower and its better than the prior gen, but a ton of rev overhang if you’re beating on the gearbox. I don’t think with modern emission requirements you can do much to fix that (maybe an electric turbo). I recommend the GLI to anyone who wants a sporty sedan that decently sized - its affordable, has some decent electronics, and with summer tires it can handle well.
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I almost bought a GLI some years ago.
I like the idea but the transmission issues that Volkswagon at least used to have steered me away; along with the sedan form factor which I don't like.
Not bad cars from what I could tell. Comfortable enough and all that.
I like the idea but the transmission issues that Volkswagon at least used to have steered me away; along with the sedan form factor which I don't like.
Not bad cars from what I could tell. Comfortable enough and all that.
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Aren’t wide ratios commonly used with manual transmissions in less powerful vehicles to help with takeoff? Back in the day, GM used to have both wide and close ratio transmissions for the same model of car - which trans you got depended on how much power the engine made.
In any case, I’m glad there’s still new manuals out there. Truth is I’m not capable enough a driver to benefit from the DCT’s advantages anyway, and I enjoy rowing my own.
In any case, I’m glad there’s still new manuals out there. Truth is I’m not capable enough a driver to benefit from the DCT’s advantages anyway, and I enjoy rowing my own.
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"Now, you might well argue that the manual's third gear gives a higher top speed in-gear than the DSG automatic's. And that's 100 percent true. But it's also irrelevant when you have three (or four!) more gears left to go in the transmission."
It gives a higher top speed in 6th gear and better highway mileage.
It gives a higher top speed in 6th gear and better highway mileage.
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I know there is a joy to be had with manual shifting but I'm now getting to the age where I drive slower than Morgan Freeman behind the wheel of a Chrysler Royal Sedan. Circumstances led me to buy a new vehicle sooner than I anticipated (I was kinda holding off for electric), and I was very pleased to find an 3 litre 8-speed automatic which trundles round town beautifully
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I've got a MK7.5 GLI, same drivetrain. The 1-3 gears are pretty tall, which makes it harder to stoplight race but 4-6 work pretty well on the highway.
Not sure about the new fascia, seems a little too rounded-off to me. But, mine is getting up there in years and miles and it's still a contender for my next ride.
Not sure about the new fascia, seems a little too rounded-off to me. But, mine is getting up there in years and miles and it's still a contender for my next ride.
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I cross shopped the Civic Si and the GLI, I tote a family around so the cavernous trunk and backseat won me over.
My son has a Fit, that thing is so good in it's own way.
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You’ve unintentionally provided the best commentary on the state of manual transmissions. They have become so rare that some people don’t even associate the word manual with a car anymore.
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There's a lot to be said for that.
I had a Mk1 Rabbit pickup with a GTI powertrain that was amongst the quickest cars to 45-50 that I've driven on the street. Then I would shift into third and fall into this gulch of acceleration then climb again.
Second gear in that beast was a whole lot of fun. Run up to about 4500 in first, slam that ropy shifter back into second and that car would march. It was great for smoking Camaros and Mustangs at stoplights ... for a bit ...
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The Fit would be a great car with an Acura badge on it and about 100% better materials used.
I owned an 08 and rode in newer and they're just cheap tin-boxes.
I guess they don't sell em anymore so it's mute but just another good small car failed imo.
Maybe they're better in Europe or Jpn I dunno.
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/me looks at his MK 6 and the headliner that detached itself from the roof over the back seat two days ago
I guess it's time I stop thinking of my 2012 GTI as a new car.
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Picked up a 2025 GLI about a month ago, but the automatic variant and really enjoying the drives! Biggest complaint is any of the models pushed out after Jan 1, 2025 don't have the Beats audio because they (VW) lost their contract with them. The stock Jetta speakers are garbage and the ~$500 credit that they give you won't cover much for a decent audio system in an otherwise fun car.
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No mention of VW's plummeting quality and reliability?
I had a Jetta back when they stuffed VR6's in them but won't touch VW today.
I had a Jetta back when they stuffed VR6's in them but won't touch VW today.
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It would have been nice to see a list of ratios in the article. Here it is, manual is the first column, automatic second.
Transmission Gear Ratios:1
1st 3.77 3.40
2nd 2.09 2.75
3rd 1.47 1.77
4th 1.09 0.93
5th 1.10 0.71
6th 0.91 0.76
7th 0.64
Reverse 4.55 2.90
Final I 3.24 4.17
Final II 2.62 3.13
…and TIL what having two different final ratios means, but the VW specs don’t indicate which gears/output shafts are on which final ratios. One Redditor says the manual has 5 and 6 on the second final.
And hmm, the DSG alternates between output shafts, so you can’t simply directly compare its gear ratios, and Jim’s comparisons of ratios in the article don’t make sense.
Transmission Gear Ratios:1
1st 3.77 3.40
2nd 2.09 2.75
3rd 1.47 1.77
4th 1.09 0.93
5th 1.10 0.71
6th 0.91 0.76
7th 0.64
Reverse 4.55 2.90
Final I 3.24 4.17
Final II 2.62 3.13
…and TIL what having two different final ratios means, but the VW specs don’t indicate which gears/output shafts are on which final ratios. One Redditor says the manual has 5 and 6 on the second final.
And hmm, the DSG alternates between output shafts, so you can’t simply directly compare its gear ratios, and Jim’s comparisons of ratios in the article don’t make sense.
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They've always been electrical nightmares.
Went to HS with a guy who's whole family was VW for life. Boy they had massive amounts of issues but they held fast to their love of VW.
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I just rented a Jetta-Sport for a week and I loved it. The only drawback (and it's a big one) is that the climate controls suck. There were only two options: too warm or too cold. On a warm summer day it would have been nice to just bring in fresh outside air at the same temperature. However, the car would only 1. Blow warm air (warmer than the outside air) or 2. Blow A/C very cold air. The temperature settings on the dashboard seem to be a placebo-stat that do nothing. They didn't turn off the heat completely, or warm up the A/C air to a comfortable temp. I drove around with the windows open to stay cool but avoid turning on the A/C.
The car did drive very nicely.
Android Auto worked wonderfully and connected well.
(Note to Chevrolet, the Chevy Malibu Android Auto doesn't appear to have a volume control and it shouts directions at you. I liked the car otherwise.)
The car did drive very nicely.
Android Auto worked wonderfully and connected well.
(Note to Chevrolet, the Chevy Malibu Android Auto doesn't appear to have a volume control and it shouts directions at you. I liked the car otherwise.)
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VW said they were bringing back buttons for HVAC 3 years ago.
2025 EU Spec VWs have buttons for HVAC.
North American cars do not.
This is just the tip of the iceberg. EU spec VWs get dual injection which prevents carbon buildup. I would love to see Ars cover the differences between NA and EU VWs. It's shocking and depressive how much more poorly VW treats NA.
2025 EU Spec VWs have buttons for HVAC.
North American cars do not.
This is just the tip of the iceberg. EU spec VWs get dual injection which prevents carbon buildup. I would love to see Ars cover the differences between NA and EU VWs. It's shocking and depressive how much more poorly VW treats NA.
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Don't they all treat Euro different?
Ford/GM make good small cars over there right? Not here.
It's the issue that Americans will not buy nice small cars; they'd rather get a bigger car even if it's not as nice for the same price. It's all size here and no sizzle.
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Which strikes me as bullshit; the GTI is a well-sorted, great driving sport compact right off the dealer lot. This is a solved problem in VW-land. There is no reason for this to be any less sorted than the GTI.
Whatever fun is gleaned from the stick, it would seem to me the feel and huge gaps would sap it. I know car guys love them some manuals, but I've driven extremely good manuals and very mediocre ones, and the mediocre ones did not offer any more fun than a DSG.
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What, besides personal preference, would make an American buyer want a small car because it's a small car? There's no incentive to avoid heavy taxes on larger vehicles or larger displacements, there are precious few urban environments a Golf could snake through and a Jetta couldn't, and parking is ubiquitous.
And it's not like Europeans are purists about this kind of shit. I know a number of Europeans who emigrated to the US and they drive the same Rav4s and CR-Vs as the rest of the American masses.
I feel like this is half-assed enough, and there's enough really good competition, that I couldn't tell anyone to buy this over a Civic Si or Hybrid, or even an Elantra N.
VW's reliability and quality is not lower now than it was in the MKIV days, homie.
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With that gearbox, is VW trying to provide themselves cover to drop the manual entirely?
If they make the next GLI auto-only they can point to the 0.1% take rate on manuals from this generation and say "it just didn't make sense, plus the DSG is so much faster anyway*".
Between this and yesterday's Miata RF review, it seems like we really can't have nice things!
*Because we geared the manual badly.
If they make the next GLI auto-only they can point to the 0.1% take rate on manuals from this generation and say "it just didn't make sense, plus the DSG is so much faster anyway*".
Between this and yesterday's Miata RF review, it seems like we really can't have nice things!
*Because we geared the manual badly.
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I had a new MKIV back in the day. The couple problems I remember having were the sunroof not closing and the turbo to intercooler hose popping off on one end. I do remember reading reports of plastic power window gears breaking, but I never had that problem.
edit: Oh, they also replaced part of my front suspension due to a recall on badly welded parts.
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I beg to differ. The Elantra N fits in the same GLI space while the Si is less powerful. The 'stang and WRX are much less practical than the Si, GLI, or N.
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I suspect you're right about 1 less shift to 60. But it also reminds me of the "EPA" transmission I had in my 81 Rabbit diesel. The 4-speed I had used the same stump-puller 1st as the 5-sp (which carried a significant upcharge that I should have found the money for), and 4th in my car was actually slightly higher than 5th. With the other 2 gears splitting the range the 5-sp had 3 in, the gaps were pretty huge.
Supposedly, that was to get slightly better fuel economy in EPA tests with the diesel. The EPA rating for the diesel 5-sp was a little lower than with the 4-sp, so perhaps it was a better match for the emission/mpg test cycles. What it really meant was that I nearly got top speed in 3rd rather than 4th (definitely, if climbing any noticeable hill). 4th was a good cruising gear (50 mpg+) on levelish freeways at 70, but the engine was only able to get up to about 1/2 speed before aero drag stopped it (at about 75, downhill with a tailwind, by test). Minimum speed to shift from 3rd to 4th was 45-50 mph, normal speed for shift was around 60. Accelerating onto the freeway required redline in each gear (go until the limiter hits). And under some circumstances, it was simply impossible to upshift, e.g. some driving in SF where I would be on the governor (essentially rolling coal, though that concept was not yet known in the era - so much for meeting PM10 regs) in 1st at about 20 mph but would lug down to stall if I shifted to 2nd.
Yeah, comparing a 40-year-old, 50 hp 1.6L diesel to a modern, 200ish hp 2L gas engine. Very different in nearly every other way. And while the beast served its purpose at the time (long-distance commuting until I could move to a place near a commute bus line - with all its faults, it was a comfortable and easy to drive car, with amazing handling for something as low-end and skinny-tired as it was), I kept it for maybe 6 years before my requirements changed. With a few minor side trips, it's been Toyotas ever since. But the complaint about the transmission ratios sure sounds familiar.
EDIT: I guess you could call the transmission I had a 3-sp+OD. Which would make this Jetta 3-sp+3-OD?
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Manufacturers have done this for years. My 2004 Mazda 3 hatchback had a ludicrously tall 2nd gear just to avoid a 3rd shift in an attempt to game the 0-60 statistic. This is what happens when marketing has too much control over the engineering side of the house.
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Such a contrast to the Mazda Miata review yesterday. Miatas are known for their fabulous, smooth shifters. A real shame the only red Miata at the dealership is an automatic.
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Last VW with a manual transmission I drove was one of my family's air cooled classic Beetles. They were great cars in many ways, but the slanted H pattern manual transmission was really difficult for me to learn. In fact, I didn't master a manual transmission until I had the opportunity to drive a 3 on the tree International truck. On the other hand, every Japanese manual transmission vehicle I have ever driven has been easy to shift and gave me the feeling that I was getting the maximum possible performance out of the engine. Makes me wonder if there's something in the organizational culture at Volkswagen about not making a performant and pleasant manual transmission.
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I cried into my whiskey when Honda stopped making the Fit. When I finally got one (manual, thank you very much) I can't imagine giving it up. Another inch of ground clearance would be good for winter, but that thing is incredibly awesome for everything.
Though I do somewhat enjoy the gearing on my husband's 5-speed Corolla. A bit tighter, but damn is that clutch hard to push down. Hope that's just age.
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Indeed, see "Subaru Crosstrek" - instead of offering a manual now, they have "Sport" with a 2.5L (last manual had 2.0) engine and CVT.
A "sport" version of this car would pretty much be the opposite of what they badged.
I am in fact, an older man, and I am fully aware I am yelling at clouds.
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Correction.
The GLI's engine is not the Gen 4 EA888 engine (241hp) currently used in the MK8 platform GTI
The GLI remains that Gen 3 EA888 from the 2019-2021 GTI that the GLI is based on.
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