“Pained by having let you down”: Sonos apologizes for app failures
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The whole experience with being pushed into an app update I didn't want, that removed features I needed really sucked.
I ended up on the support page where there's an option to email the CEO. That seems appropriate, I didn't need someone to tell me to turn it off and on again, I needed someone in management to know how badly this had gone, and maybe say something that showed they understood why this sucked for their customers. It... uhh... doesn't go to the CEO. It goes to someone in support who is worse than average in selecting canned responses.
We need a name for companies that pretend to be friendly and open and nice, but actually just throw customer feedback in the trash.
I ended up on the support page where there's an option to email the CEO. That seems appropriate, I didn't need someone to tell me to turn it off and on again, I needed someone in management to know how badly this had gone, and maybe say something that showed they understood why this sucked for their customers. It... uhh... doesn't go to the CEO. It goes to someone in support who is worse than average in selecting canned responses.
We need a name for companies that pretend to be friendly and open and nice, but actually just throw customer feedback in the trash.
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THANK YOU for writing this article and calling attention to this. I've been pulling my hair out trying to get my system to do everything it used to do.
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Let me guess. The old app was developed with Xamarin.Forms which went end-of-life right around then. They put off the rewrite as long as they could, but were forced to ship something before it became literally impossible to deploy even an emergency update to the old version because it couldn't target a new enough version of iOS/Android.
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I would love to know what drives this need to "refresh" (re-invent a worse wheel) in the mobile app space.
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All I know is I didn’t know what # my volume was after the update which let me tell you can be quite irritating when 15 will wake the sleeping children in the other room while 13 won’t but I don’t which it is.
Thankfully only took about a month to put that back in.
As a side note; still bewildered by the lack of remote that came with my arc soundbar considering the cost.
Thankfully only took about a month to put that back in.
As a side note; still bewildered by the lack of remote that came with my arc soundbar considering the cost.
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I suggest, "CORPORATION". Since that seems to be the SOP for entities doing that kind of thing.
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The most damning thing about the new Sonos app: my spouse hated using it so much, they switched to using the "casting" features in other music apps.
I wonder if seeing a drop in app usage had anything to do with this admission?
I wonder if seeing a drop in app usage had anything to do with this admission?
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Off topic, but at first glance I read the title as "Sonic apologizes for app..." and I was thinking "finally!"
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It's good that they aren't taking the ultra-smarmy "you just don't understand the improvements..." position; but it's frankly weird how they are all talking as though needing to periodically ship whatever broken redesign is on the table is some kind of law of the universe, of which they are the heartbroken victims, rather than shipping with regressions being a choice in all but some fairly dramatic security fix or platform shakeup situations.
If there isn't an employee at Sonos who isn't sad about having let customers down; why didn't they just...not...ship the "few steps back" build?
If there isn't an employee at Sonos who isn't sad about having let customers down; why didn't they just...not...ship the "few steps back" build?
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And yet despite completely screwing over all their customers, did a single member of Sonos upper management refuse thier massive bonus and stock option… of course not!
“ As Chief Executive Officer at Sonos Inc, Patrick Spence made $5,190,714 in total compensation. Of this total $550,000 was received as a salary, $71,858 was received as a bonus, $4,568,856 was awarded as stock. This information is according to proxy statements filed for the 2023 fiscal year”.15 May 2024
“ As Chief Executive Officer at Sonos Inc, Patrick Spence made $5,190,714 in total compensation. Of this total $550,000 was received as a salary, $71,858 was received as a bonus, $4,568,856 was awarded as stock. This information is according to proxy statements filed for the 2023 fiscal year”.15 May 2024
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This must have cost them revenue. And now they need to make it back. Expect them bricking more sonos systems sooner, to force customers to upgrade. Or maybe a monthly fee for all the proper features in the app. $49.99 for 1 year of Sonos Pro!
Id run like hell.
Id run like hell.
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Do you want to leave your mark on the product in a way that makes you look like a promotable go-getter with vision; or do you want to be one of the losers doing maintenance on the legacy(read 'more or less complete') products that customers actually like?
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I guarantee you there are at least a handful of talented Product managers who weren't listened to... who screamed NO NO NO at the UX team and some gleamy eyed people pushing a prestige project so they could get a promotion and a pat on the back from the higher ups.
The best way to learn discipline and to fix the problem from a botched job like this is to immediately axe the upper middle management people who put the "ship it" approval on this who were inevitably telling the higher ups how great it would be. You know who they are. They're always there, pushing for stuff to happen by a deadline instead of with quality because of some imaginary timeline that's important (to their bonus). Those yes wo/men? Can them, and fix your culture of yes men, which is how this junk almost always happens.
Those people they didn't listen to ? yea they're sitting there with a smile on their face quietly: "I told you so". If they're smart they won't smirk too loudly, but they'll go home at night knowing they were right.
The best way to learn discipline and to fix the problem from a botched job like this is to immediately axe the upper middle management people who put the "ship it" approval on this who were inevitably telling the higher ups how great it would be. You know who they are. They're always there, pushing for stuff to happen by a deadline instead of with quality because of some imaginary timeline that's important (to their bonus). Those yes wo/men? Can them, and fix your culture of yes men, which is how this junk almost always happens.
Those people they didn't listen to ? yea they're sitting there with a smile on their face quietly: "I told you so". If they're smart they won't smirk too loudly, but they'll go home at night knowing they were right.
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Prompting the Zen riddle, "When is a reply not a response?" (Or vice versa. Beyond a certain level of sleaze, language becomes too blunt an instrument. We need a new branch of mathematics to adequately deal with mid-21st BS.)
Whoever or whatever composed that atrocity has a bright – or at least conspicuous – future running the White House press office.
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It's far worse, in all kinds of ways. Things that used to just work now require deliberate actions, and there's just no reason for it.
Here's a basic example: I have Sonos speakers in three separate homes/buildings on different Wifi networks. On the old app, it would just recognize the Sonos speakers on the Wifi network my phone was on. With the new app, every time I go from one to the other, I have to open the app and then take the action of "joining" the system on that network. Every time I change location. It's the same three "systems" I keep going between. Yet, I have to "join" every time I go from one place to another.
Here's a basic example: I have Sonos speakers in three separate homes/buildings on different Wifi networks. On the old app, it would just recognize the Sonos speakers on the Wifi network my phone was on. With the new app, every time I go from one to the other, I have to open the app and then take the action of "joining" the system on that network. Every time I change location. It's the same three "systems" I keep going between. Yet, I have to "join" every time I go from one place to another.
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This is a clear failure of management. Who approved the redesign for release? They were either pressured to do so or are unqualified to be making that kind of decision. A minor issue could be debatable, but this release was an obvious a disaster. This should have been immediately obvious to anyone even remotely qualified to be making product decisions.
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I still can't connect my system together (have not tried in a couple weeks). Pretty angry about the entire thing and will never recommend to anyone.
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Meh. They can go fk themselves. Pretty clear the new app is setup to push ads and collect data.
The latest fu a few days ago where I went to use it in the morning after successfully using it the night before and just having it crash and then crashing in the background so bad that my phone recommended disabling it was so dumb. Why? Because the app can't tell you it needs to update, or update itself. I manually figured out later that there was an update that hadn't auto downloaded yet.
Anyone know of any good alternatives? I've been meaning to do research and see if there is a more self hostable solution.
The latest fu a few days ago where I went to use it in the morning after successfully using it the night before and just having it crash and then crashing in the background so bad that my phone recommended disabling it was so dumb. Why? Because the app can't tell you it needs to update, or update itself. I manually figured out later that there was an update that hadn't auto downloaded yet.
Anyone know of any good alternatives? I've been meaning to do research and see if there is a more self hostable solution.
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Been reading the Sonos drama on Reddit since the beginning - first time seeing this theory
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The whole point of the Arc is using the ARC connection from your TV to control the volume. Of all the problems with Sonos lately this isn't one.
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Could be wrong. I’m new to the Sonos drama and have never owned any of their products. It was just my first thought based on my experience with being a cynical, jaded developer.
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Yes, thanks for the article. I would like to see more explanation of how this happened, but I suppose that would involve singling out groups within the company as responsible, maybe their corporate culture can't tolerate it. The screwup was so fundamental, especially the loss of access to home music libraries, that it's hard not to assume that their pre-release testing was indifferent and unsystematic. "Our captive users will love everything we do!"
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So, it's been broken for months, and it's going to stay broken for (at least) months more.
But we've got existing code for a version that wasn't broken available, because we were shipping it before we released the broken version.
Hey, I've got a solution! Pull the new app until it's "ready" (or forever) and ship the old one in the meantime? Do I win?
Seriously, why is "put the old one back" not the very first step of fixing the problem?
But we've got existing code for a version that wasn't broken available, because we were shipping it before we released the broken version.
Hey, I've got a solution! Pull the new app until it's "ready" (or forever) and ship the old one in the meantime? Do I win?
Seriously, why is "put the old one back" not the very first step of fixing the problem?
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The most annoying thing about replies like these is this paragraph. Not only are they not answering anything in your email, but they are going for maximum annoyance by insinuate that they have and pretend that they were helpful.
But I’m sure they measure the quality of support by the number of follow up questions they get, so I guess that this one is a win…
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"takes courage to rebuild a brand’s core product from the ground up, and to do so knowing it may require taking a few steps back to ultimately leap into the future."
Courage would be one of these execs to show up at someone's house effected by this and getting an earful. Or better yet, a tap on the head from the clue by four.
If your physical product needs an "App" to function I don't buy it.
Courage would be one of these execs to show up at someone's house effected by this and getting an earful. Or better yet, a tap on the head from the clue by four.
If your physical product needs an "App" to function I don't buy it.
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Wirecutter posted an update a few days ago saying they no longer recommended Sonos as the best system. If that partially triggered this sudden humility I have to wonder just how far up their own asses they are.
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Thats a bit subjective to the individual cases, but in broad strokes: A constantly evolving security environment means any app that accesses my network needs to regularly be updated. This sometimes means needing to update the UI to justify your costs to an executive.
Design is as much fashion as function. As much as I hate to suggest it, a significant enough consumer base will look toward the age of your design (logo, layout, ect) when considering competing apps. With a brand like Sonos, an old design can imply less functionality or reduced development or an impending drop of app development, as we've seen with so much tech. all of which can impact purchasing decisions. (see: The need to refresh the tech on cars mid model, the need to refresh logos with 'modern' design) You might not thin kit matters, but studies suggest they matter to enough people to affect the bottom line.
Most apps aren't built off bespoke code. On top of the use of standard libraries, many apps are built by devs using framework dev environments. A common cross platform one, xamarin.forms, went end of support life this year. A lot of companies were forced to rebuild apps with a new framework, and a rebuild is almost always coming out the other end less optimized and less robust functionality even with an ideal year long beta. The code base loses momentum. And its expensive, so many companies did not prioritize these builds until forced to. The result is a bunch of half finished rebuilds that become the refresh.
There is also the thing that many companies were sold on using mobile apps over mobile formatted webpages so these companies could harvest that data for the promises of big analytics. Many companies are questioning the dev spend on bespoke apps now that the promises of big data analytics have failed to strap a rocket to their backs. Some apps will stay, the app format provides direct value to the company, but the day of everyone having apps are coming to an end. Some devs, looking to save their job, or executives protecting their turf/job, may be selling the c-suite on a refresh recently in a "this app is definitely valuable, we just need to redesign the UX to improve engagement".
TL; DR: Capitalism. in various ways, at various levels, Capitalism.
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Feature parity seems like the minimum requirement for a new version of an app?!?
I normally use the Apple Music app to play through my Sonos speakers, but just tried the Sonos app … and it won’t even play! Looks a lot messier than it was previously too, although that’s a lesser evil than its inability to play a song.
Can they not give customers an option to rollback to a previous working version?
I normally use the Apple Music app to play through my Sonos speakers, but just tried the Sonos app … and it won’t even play! Looks a lot messier than it was previously too, although that’s a lesser evil than its inability to play a song.
Can they not give customers an option to rollback to a previous working version?
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Because the old app, at least on iOS, has been broken for years - requiring owners of older Sonos products to re-configure their components with each "bug fix and enhancements" release. Sticking with the old app would mean Sonos couldn't ship their latest headphone product - where the money is. It's been obvious for years that the only happy iOS users were the ones who had just bought newly released components and that legacy owners' complaints were ignored. I've deleted the official app and now use SonoPhone. It's not pretty and has some issues but it doesn't force me to upgrade and break the last Sonos components I'll pay for.
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Sleep timers and all the other things seem nice to get fixed at some point. That's neato. But what about the incredibly slow EVERYTHING in the new app? It takes me up to a minute to mostly find my three speakers and actually put on a radio channel in my kitchen.
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If they know their app will take a few steps back for many (or here, apparently, most) people, they could have put out their new app, while allowing people to continue to use the older version as well. They don't need to disable the old app to allow installing a new app. Likewise, if they don't force updates to the new "few steps back" app, people could continue to run the older version if they need the missing features.
I've had examples of both of these cases. Sideloading an older app version when the new app sucked because it was laggy and broke things, and also running two versions side-by-side, to get both the new features, or the missing features, depending on which was important. It doesn't have to be an either/or situation, that's a choice Sonos made.
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