Good Omens S3 trailer sets up a blessed conclusion

mpat

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They're taking about the Moriquendi. However, if they actually knew about the mythology, this is merely all elves born in middle earth who did not manage to reach Valinor after the end of the third age. It would make 0 sense for them to be melanistically different from any other elf.
Oh, those guys. So the complaint is that Tolkien called them dark elves? Because they’re just plain elves except without the education and culture that the elves in Valinor developed. Heck, the ones in Lothlorien are even ruled by a Noldor Queen who grew up in Valinor (Galadriel). They’re hardly a distinct people by the Third Age, and certainly not a distinct race like in Norse mythology.

(Ignoring the fact that all we know of dark elves in Norse mythology is based on the writings of one guy in the Middle Ages and even he isn’t 100% clear, so we’re mostly guessing)
 
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Oh, those guys. So the complaint is that Tolkien called them dark elves? Because they’re just plain elves except without the education and culture that the elves in Valinor developed. Heck, the ones in Lothlorien are even ruled by a Noldor Queen who grew up in Valinor (Galadriel). They’re hardly a distinct people by the Third Age, and certainly not a distinct race like in Norse mythology.

(Ignoring the fact that all we know of dark elves in Norse mythology is based on the writings of one guy in the Middle Ages and even he isn’t 100% clear, so we’re mostly guessing)
Dark Elves and Dwarfs were used interchangeably in Germanic folklore anyway. Elves, Fairies and Dwarfs all weren't clearly differentiated until the 19th century.
 
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mpat

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Dark Elves and Dwarfs were used interchangeably in Germanic folklore anyway. Elves, Fairies and Dwarfs all weren't clearly differentiated until the 19th century.
Maybe. It isn’t clear.

The Norse clearly believed that the world around them was full of creatures that they couldn’t see. If you do the whole ”world tiers in Yggdrasil” thing and put the elves on the top tier with the Aesir and Vanir, you need some elves on our tier to explain why the fog dances on the moor and whatever. Hence dark elves, as the dwarves live underground and in mountains. But I can guarantee that 99% of people alive back then didn’t think this much about the details of cosmology. I don’t think I have seen any mention of the skin color of dark elves in Norse or Germanic mythology anyway.

Fairy as a word comes from Latin, not any Germanic root, in any case. It appears to have been mostly applied long after any Germanic religion was long dead, and is more commonly used in connection with Celtic myths.
 
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Maybe. It isn’t clear.

The Norse clearly believed that the world around them was full of creatures that they couldn’t see. If you do the whole ”world tiers in Yggdrasil” thing and put the elves on the top tier with the Aesir and Vanir, you need some elves on our tier to explain why the fog dances on the moor and whatever. Hence dark elves, as the dwarves live underground and in mountains. But I can guarantee that 99% of people alive back then didn’t think this much about the details of cosmology. I don’t think I have seen any mention of the skin color of dark elves in Norse or Germanic mythology anyway.

Fairy as a word comes from Latin, not any Germanic root, in any case. It appears to have been mostly applied long after any Germanic religion was long dead, and is more commonly used in connection with Celtic myths.
The local folk traditions just didn't pop into existence from nowhere. They devopled in isolation from a common Indo European orgin. Theres a plausible argument that the Persian Peri comes from the common the same Indo European root word as Fariy. Piskies, Spriggans, Knockers of Cornish mythology are described as faries, elves or dwarves. Gnomes and Kobolds are the German version of the same idea. Cornish is Britonic language and from entirely different branch of the Indo European language tree but the idea of spirts with specific roles predates the separation of those languages. The Norse Draugr has a cognate word in old Persian Dauga because of the Indo European orgin.
 
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KobayashiSaru

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I was a huge Gaiman fan. Read the Sandman in high school, collected all the graphic novels, then found Neverwhere and voraciously consumed his novels and collections from there.

He was a regular visitor to Madison, WI where I live (he lived in Menomonee Falls during his marriage previous to Amanda Palmer and raised his children there). He would also come to town for a lot of events such as regional conventions and book events. He also had a following in the local goth and kink communities and it didn't take long before his reputation as someone who wielded his notoriety as a way to feed his sexual proclivities with fans and frequently toed (or possibly crossed) the lines of consent and power dynamics became something of an open secret. This was almost two decades ago. That cooled my enthusiasm for his work but after the full story came out a few years ago I got rid of all his stuff and washed my hands. He's a predatory piece of shit and I don't need a fucking court record or official judgement to feel this way.

The courts tend to favor men, especially wealthy and influential men who can afford legal backing over "nobody" victims, especially young women. Going out of your way to defend someone like that while citing a total misreading of the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" which doesn't apply at all to these sorts of things just makes you a piece of shit as well in my book. Especially if you are doing this to shit on people who are simply expressing their discomfort and disgust with the man and the "allegations". I'm a sexual assault survivor. Don't fucking tell me how I should feel about it with your pseudo-intellectual posturing and rape apologia.
 
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Happy Medium

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I was a huge Gaiman fan. Read the Sandman in high school, collected all the graphic novels, then found Neverwhere and voraciously consumed his novels and collections from there.

He was a regular visitor to Madison, WI where I live (he lived in Menominee during his marriage previous to Amanda Palmer and raised his children there). He would also come to town for a lot of events such as regional conventions and book events. He also had a following int he local goth and kink communities and it didn't take long before his reputation as someone who wielded his notoriety as a way to feed his sexual proclivities with fans and frequently toed (or possibly crossed) the lines of consent and power dynamics became something of an open secret. This was almost two decades ago. That cooled my enthusiasm for his work but after the full story came out a few years ago I got rid of all my stuff and washed my hands. He's a predatory piece of shit and I don't need a fucking court record or official judgement to feel this way.

The courts tend to favor men, especially wealthy and influential men who can afford legal backing over "nobody" victims, especially young women. Going out of your way to defend someone like that while citing a total misreading of the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" which doesn't apply at all to these sorts of things just makes you a piece of shit as well in my book. Especially if you are doing this to shit on people who are simply expressing their discomfort and disgust with the man and the "allegations". I'm a sexual assault survivor. Don't fucking tell me how I should feel about it with your pseudo-intellectual posturing and rape apologia.
Exactly agree. Innocent until proven guilty is a legal standard so governments don't conclude guilt without a trial. It is still entirely my and others' rights to feel disgusted with what Gaiman has been repeatedly and more specifically, very convincingly, accused of by multiple women. Be disgusted by the extremely imbalanced, effectively abusive, power dynamics Gaiman has admitted to abusing to push women into sexual relationships (relationships between babysitter and their world-famous employer are NOT free of intrinsic coercion). And dislike of reading/watching/listening to his works because of that.

And quite honestly, F those people who equate not watching his friggin TV show with unjust imprisonment. I'm sure you also think Elon's lawsuits against advertisers withdrawing their ad-buys was unlawful impingement on his freedom of speech. If I don't like you, for any reason, nobody can force me to purchase or use your stuff. I don't have to have a court verdict to make that decision.
 
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jhesse

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I used to drink in the French House in Soho back in the 90s, he already had the reputation of not being safe in taxis then.
I've been watching the fallout in the fandom (which is 99% fan-girls, if the Good Omens convention I got dragged along to a few years ago is any indication...) from this, and the revelation of that previously not-reported reputation was a shock to the fandom at large.

They have not, and will not, forgive him.

(This whole thing read like bad 50-shades-of-gray dreck. Come on, Neil... the babysitter? Absolute disappointment.)
 
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Frobbotzim

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debating what to do about the other books of his that I own.

If they've only monetary value, perhaps consider unloading them and forwarding the proceeds to RAINN.

If sentimental, for my part, I have resleeved a copy of Stardust in a Geek Love jacket, and there it'll hide so long as I have a shelf for it.

Fwiw, probably can't but nevertheless wouldn't do anything about the Gaiman quote inscribed inside my wedding band, disgusted though I am by him. Nick Cave concisely said a thing that I've thought on quite a bit:

I endeavour to seek beauty wherever it presents itself. In doing so, I am reluctant to invalidate the best of us in an attempt to punish the worst. I don’t think we can afford that luxury.

Another generation should someday fall headlong into Gaiman's stories as we once did. May he see few gains from it.
 
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If they've only monetary value, perhaps consider unloading them and forwarding the proceeds to RAINN.

If sentimental, for my part, I have resleeved a copy of Stardust in a Geek Love jacket, and there it'll hide so long as I have a shelf for it.

Fwiw, probably can't but nevertheless wouldn't do anything about the Gaiman quote inscribed inside my wedding band, disgusted though I am by him. Nick Cave concisely said a thing that I've thought on quite a bit:



Another generation should someday fall headlong into Gaiman's stories as we once did. May he see few gains from it.
Gaiman makes a fortune from his uncredited work as a Hollywood script doctor. He has been doing that job for decades. His parents where the leaders of the scientology movement in the UK and that network got him an in to Hollywood in the 80s. Gaiman's name won't appear in the credits but he won't be short of work.
 
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Frobbotzim

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Gaiman's name won't appear in the credits but he won't be short of work.
Yeah, sometimes you tell people that when you find yourself crashing parties, "oh, um, Katzenberg just pulled me in for a thing, hush-hush, like, " and sure, that's nice for him. And life's consequences are varied. I've appreciated William Shockley's work nearly every day for many decades now despite his side hustle as a eugenicist. His death was lonely and uncomfortable. Was that too much justice, considering? And will it be enough for Gaiman years hence?
 
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Faceless Man

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If they've only monetary value, perhaps consider unloading them and forwarding the proceeds to RAINN.

If sentimental, for my part, I have resleeved a copy of Stardust in a Geek Love jacket, and there it'll hide so long as I have a shelf for it.

Fwiw, probably can't but nevertheless wouldn't do anything about the Gaiman quote inscribed inside my wedding band, disgusted though I am by him. Nick Cave concisely said a thing that I've thought on quite a bit:



Another generation should someday fall headlong into Gaiman's stories as we once did. May he see few gains from it.
I've lost a lot of respect for Nick Cave there, if only because he thinks there's something artistic about Kanye West's work.

And no, I'm not joking. The man is a hack with very little talent who has managed to make a shit-tonne of money somehow.
 
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Frobbotzim

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hack with very little talent who has managed to make a shit-tonne of money somehow.
Right? Cave wasn't starting the Kanye Appreciation Society when he shared that track on Desert Island Discs but he wasn't doing that twat any harm either, and yes, I get that it's a song that one of his dead sons listened to with him and so on, but... I'm hanging on to the assertion that Cave's remarks on art and the artist in that passage are transcendent, and are as lyrical in their clarity as any piece of music he's ever written.
 
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fab rat

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Be disgusted by the extremely imbalanced, effectively abusive, power dynamics Gaiman has admitted to abusing to push women into sexual relationships (relationships between babysitter and their world-famous employer are NOT free of intrinsic coercion). And dislike of reading/watching/listening to his works because of that.

Fully agree with this sentiment. One of the more damning parts of the story (to me) was the way Amanda Palmer is alleged to have reacted when informed of what Gaiman had been up to - more or less rolling her eyes and saying "oh, again?"

Had to write her off as well. A shame, I used to love the Dresden Dolls.
 
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