Fuel efficiency, EVs, and charger funding all cut by Trump’s orders

DaiMacculate

Ars Praetorian
404
Subscriptor
No, it really doesn't. People aren't changing in their 5 Series or E class for a Model 3 or Model Y, they're trading up from Hondas and Toyotas.

10 years ago the Model S could claim to be a luxury vehicle, today it's an antiquated fossil and they sell a handful of them, versus 1.7 million Models 3 and Y. And there's nothing luxurious about either of those two. You really need to update your priors.
Yeah, the Model 3 is essentially the Taurus of our time, ubiquitous at nearly every stoplight when you can spot them behind the giant trucks.

And yeah the build quality issues are well known, even if I didn’t care about politics I decided to lease an Ioniq 5 instead of a Tesla because I trust Hyundai more with the basics of assembling a car correctly.
 
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36 (38 / -2)

Sajuuk

Ars Legatus Legionis
12,866
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So you think that the Dems should be going for the racist, anti LGBT vote?
It's also just an absolutely bullshit premise to begin with.

Maybe the Democrats will learn to focus on actual issues instead of purity tests and identity politics designed to shrink the tent as much as possible.
Purity tests and identity politics? Kamala wouldn't even talk about queer people while literally parading "good" Republicans around on stage. What a fucking joke.
 
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34 (42 / -8)
Why wouldn't the United States want to try to set the world standard in every technology that it possibly could and breathe clean air? Keep on ceding that all the jobs, new economic opportunities and screw it what's the point anymore. It's only going to get more stupid and fast
because money, specifically old money and the systems they've established that allow them to keep their lead and continue exploiting/expanding/influencing.
 
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12 (12 / 0)

mozbo

Ars Tribunus Militum
1,867
Anyone ever see Gundam 00?

Opening Gist - the world develops mostly clean power. (space based solar that goes down space elevators tot he ground from a giant orbit solar ring - hey its Gundam anime deal)

But all the oil based countries refused to get on board and participate becasue oil was their income and power source... basically whole world leaves them behind and they become 3rd world collapsed failed states...

This really feels like the US is teeing itself up to race into that notional future as a failed state and be left behind.
There's no "feels like" about it. That IS what's happening.

Except there's a giant military with nukes in the picture.

Gundam had it wrong. It's much much worse.
 
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18 (18 / 0)

deus01

Ars Praefectus
3,305
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He's banking it on hurting smaller startups and other manufacturing than his company. He thinks that his business can survive with fewer competitors after this.
Elon knows that selling cars doesn't matter because his wealth is derived from Tesla's shareprice and now he can just as much fraud as he wants to prop that up. Teslabots? Sure. Robotaxis next year? Of course.
 
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28 (30 / -2)

deus01

Ars Praefectus
3,305
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No, but more people stayed home or voted for Trump than the alternative and now we are where we are.

Five million people who voted for Biden in 2020 did not show up for Harris. But at least 75 million people did stand up and say no to Trump.
Fascism financed by Tesla drivers
 
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5 (14 / -9)
I’m entirely convinced that history will look back at tomorrow as the day the American car industry got killed.
There's gonna be a lot more dead than the car industry. When these clowns get through the economy will be a stinking pile of shit, our military will be in chaos, women will be chattel again, our children dumb as rocks, discrimination acceptable policy and workers no more than serfs.
The electorate bought and handed the rope they'll hang by to their executioners.
The American Great Experiment is dead,dead,dead.
 
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33 (34 / -1)

wallinbl

Ars Legatus Legionis
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I'm not entirely sure there actually are any real winners in this election. Short term, perhaps a few individuals in their perceived goals (dictators et. al. hindered by a rule based world order). Long term, big picture? I don't think even they will be better off.
Billionaires, without any doubt, will wind up better off. Removing constraints, restrictions, controls, protections, etc will increase the power imbalance.
 
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36 (36 / 0)

DaiMacculate

Ars Praetorian
404
Subscriptor
It's also just an absolutely bullshit premise to begin with.


Purity tests and identity politics? Kamala wouldn't even talk about queer people while literally parading "good" Republicans around on stage. What a fucking joke.
It’s like early 2017 all over again, angry people on the left and right ends of the Dem Party’s tent screaming that we could have won if only we had kicked out the other group entirely.

The reality is we lost for a dozen different reasons or more, and only some of them could be easily controlled. It can neither be wholly credited to brilliant Trump strategy or Democratic incompetence, and that’s way harder to reckon with. It’s much easier, emotionally, for people to identify who is at fault (The DNC! Donors! Loud Leftists Existing!) than to reckon with it being something complex and affected by factors that couldn’t all be controlled or countered.

I don’t have an easy answer either but I know abandoning people or trying to actively kick them out of our tent isn’t going to solve anything. I would suggest to anyone who wants 2026 to go better that they get involved with their local Democratic Party. It’s going to be filled with a bunch of old people with ideas you may hate, but guess what that’s where we build out our bench of new candidates and the volunteers to support them. If you want a better Democratic Party go build it. That’s a lot harder than complaining about it on the internet though.
 
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57 (57 / 0)
Elon no longer sees Tesla as an EV car company, so he doesn't care.
No. He cares, but this helps him.

Some people want electric cars. Almost no one else can build electric cars profitably. If they aren't forced to make them they might just give up, meaning he has less competition.

Trump is also anti China, and China is the place which can make profitable EVs.

Trump is removing all of his EV competition.
 
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11 (11 / 0)
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Zubenelgenubi

Smack-Fu Master, in training
54
From the (currently, for now) sane side of the 49th, I can't help but think "maybe we really should be building a wall"

That's followed by "hey, maybe Canada should see if Washington and Oregon and California want to join us?"
Can you, pretty please, include Michigan in the invite too?

I know trump won here, but all of our statewide elected officials are Democrats, and Democrats have a majority in our state Senate and Supreme Court, so there’s still hope for us.
 
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2 (6 / -4)

graylshaped

Ars Legatus Legionis
67,723
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With nothing to base it on but my own gut and a love for Sci-Fi... i have this nagging belief he plans to send volunteers first then when they run out, prisoners and the indebted. They'll be the new indentured servants on Mars, where if they don't do what their told he cuts off the water, or air.

....
Ah ha! Hence among the first few EOs was returning to private prisons. At least they are up to tic-tac-toe levels of game theory.
 
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11 (11 / 0)

Oldnoobguy

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From the (currently, for now) sane side of the 49th, I can't help but think "maybe we really should be building a wall"

That's followed by "hey, maybe Canada should see if Washington and Oregon and California want to join us?"
How about an extra city like Chicago? Please...pretty please? We got good pizza, hot dogs and Italian Beefs!
 
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4 (7 / -3)
From the (currently, for now) sane side of the 49th, I can't help but think "maybe we really should be building a wall"

That's followed by "hey, maybe Canada should see if Washington and Oregon and California want to join us?"
I’m in Washington (the Trumpish side, unfortunately), and I’d join Canada in a heartbeat. My wife and I had a serious conversation last night about which countries we could move to. My wife and her family are first generation immigrants, and even though they did everything “the right way”, I have no doubt that eventually the Nazis in power will attempt to deport them as well. Trump’s unconstitutional executive order could affect my nephew if (or when) he tries to make it apply retroactively. That would be an unconstitutional ex post facto law, but he doesn’t care about such things as constitutionality.

This is only the second day. Things will get worse.
 
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32 (33 / -1)

fenris_uy

Ars Tribunus Angusticlavius
9,088
Yes, by telling them Joe's Infrastructure Act will save their jobs. Neither Kamala, Joe, or any of their surrogates told the racist, anti-LGBT vote they would make their lives better. Not once. Yet the racist chuds would be less angry if their jobs at Carrier hadn't been sent to Mexico (under Trump), or if they didn't see "influencers" making six digits talking about piffle on TikTok (also under Trump, Libs of TikTok).

We had job growth every single month of Biden's last two years, he never said it to the racists; every time Joe opened his mouth it should have started with "we created x jobs this month." Clinton famously told the boatbuilders their jobs weren't coming back after NAFTA and promised we'd retrain them. What did Biden famously say to the displaced, angry racists? Meanwhile, Joe's creating more American factory jobs than any world-leader since Hitler.

Instead, Joe and Kamala just didn't talk to the bitter, angry white mob. And 20 million people that voted for Scranton Joe stayed home. Just like movies, politicians have to have a four-quandrant strategy and the Dems had a one-quadrant strategy. Yes, the racists and anti-LGBT are wrong. Yes, you still need to be their President. We'll talk for years about Kamla avoiding Rogan and the impact it had, but it's clear that Kamala just didn't have any strategy for the Rogan crowd, at all. They all voted. The Call Me Daddy and Vote Save America crowd didn't vote.
Kamala and Joe kept telling people that they laws would help them keep their job.

https://time.com/6343967/bidenomics-is-real-economics/

They also said that it's bad to hate others based on their race, sexuality or gender.

Those people though that being able to hate others was more important than keeping their jobs.
 
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48 (51 / -3)
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DrewW

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We had job growth every single month of Biden’s entire term.
You are right Zubenelgenubi, "White House Press Secretary Karine Jean-Pierre said the Biden-Harris administration was the only administration to gain jobs every month."

Please join your local dems and become their spokesperson. They need help taking credit for all the winning.

This should have been the slogan, T-shirt, and Kamala Harris' new neck tattoo - "More US Jobs Every Month."
 
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21 (21 / 0)
No. He cares, but this helps him.

Some people want electric cars. Almost no one else can build electric cars profitably. If they aren't forced to make them they might just give up, meaning he has less competition.

Trump is also anti China, and China is the place which can make profitable EVs.

Trump is removing all of his EV competition.
Trump is 'anti-China'? So you fell for it. He's got all kinds of investments there as well a his wife. Musk's Tesla sales in China manufactured cars are 30% of all sales. Trump isn't anti anything. His whole motivation is what is good for him and his ultra rich buddies. Everything else is just distraction. If something gets in his way, that's just something to steal from, or ignores the law or sues it, or ruins the leadership. Anti-china? Nonsense. He talks a game and the idiots swallow it whole. A smooth running propaganda machine is what put MAGA in power.
 
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45 (45 / 0)

numerobis

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This is why China is already beating the US in solar technology, and it's why they'll end up beating the US in EV technology if Trump continues his petty tantrums.
That ship sailed long ago. China accounts for about two thirds of plug-in cars made globally, along with most of the batteries, and is the leader in refinery capacity for the necessary minerals.

It also has battery manufacturers, which the U.S. basically doesn’t. There’s factories in the US but they are run by manufacturers in East Asia (China, Korea and Japan). Japan is falling well behind, and Korea is struggling to compete; the U.S. isn’t even in the game.

It would be hard for the U.S. to lead when it has half the EV market share of Europe and a quarter of China’s. Domestic manufacturers don’t have a market to try out EVs in and then export them.
 
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21 (21 / 0)
I'ma be honest, I read your comment as "Arsians" all the way through and was wondering how the heck you came by that information. (Besides, y know, a poll with a statistically significant number of responses.)

It's disheartening that anyone voted for Trump, but especially confusing that first and second generation immigrants voted for him, or anyone with non-western-european skin tone. Y'all realize he hates you, right?
Lots of first gen immigrants feel they're getting stiffed by anyone who doesn't follow the immigration process. They see stories about how people just show up and get housing or food and wonder why it took them years and thousands of dollars to get in.

So they vote with the misguided notion that it'll help get their family in faster or even just "I did it, why can't they?" Many times they'll also align on other issues like anti-abortion stances, anti-LGBTQ, or lowering taxes so it's not a simple single issue vote either.
 
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greenghoulie

Seniorius Lurkius
26
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We don’t need personal EVs! WE NEED GOOD PUBLIC TRANSIT!!!!!!
Maybe both?

I recognize the sentiment, but the US, for better or worse, is a country of sprawl. The last mile suffers if we put all of our efforts into serving those that are within traditional public transit regions (areas which also happen to correlate with greater cost housing). I would love to ditch all private car-based transportation and turn all parking lots into public parks, but even if it were practical, it will take time. People will continue to buy cars - let's ensure those cars are doing the least harm while we create other avenues for public transportation, specifically serving those areas that are middle and lower income.
 
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4 (9 / -5)
We don’t need personal EVs! WE NEED GOOD PUBLIC TRANSIT!!!!!!
We're too fucking dumb to do anything but sit in traffic in our tanks and occasionally move enough to get in wrecks and kill each other. Even the kids get chauffered to school in private tanks when buses are right there, which is why they have to start at 7. We're also trying to do some business emails and eat breakfast while driving, and complain about the traffic to no end, when we could be relaxed and actually productive and not murdering each other on the way.

We are smart, we are smart, s-m-r-t! I mean s-m-a-r-t! Someone said we each need to do advocacy but it's too late for that, we've become an entire nation that's sticking our fingers in our ears and yelling to drown out any speck of rational communication. We're so, so fucked.
 
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18 (21 / -3)
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fenris_uy

Ars Tribunus Angusticlavius
9,088
Can you send me a link to a video where they sent that? This is a link to a "Bidenomics" story, which was political malpractice. Inflation was at a record high so they rolled out "Bidenomics." It would be as if the Rolling Stones next album after Altamont was called "Straight to the Point." No where did Biden say, "You vote for me, and the IRA will keep your job in Flint, MI."

Here is Trump lying, but saying he will end DEI to keep automaker jobs, in Michigan. Most of the sentences have overt lies, the weave makes it hard to follow, the border isn't making Michigan jobs go to Sonora, defund the police is a canard, but he did promise that woman he'd keep her job, "if you vote for Trump, everything is going to be taken care of."

Send me the same clip from Biden, where he promises one person electing him will save their job.
People listen as US President Joe Biden speaks about Bidenomics at CS Wind on November 29, 2023 in Pueblo, Colorado. CS Wind, the largest wind turbine tower manufacturer in the world, recently announced they were expanding operations as a direct result of the Inflation Reduction Act

From that article that you didn't click.

Both of them talked about the jobs created by the IRA and CHIPS act in the campaign trail and the debates.
 
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36 (37 / -1)
Maybe both?

I recognize the sentiment, but the US, for better or worse, is a country of sprawl. The last mile suffers if we put all of our efforts into serving those that are within traditional public transit regions (areas which also happen to correlate with greater cost housing). I would love to ditch all private car-based transportation and turn all parking lots into public parks, but even if it were practical, it will take time. People will continue to buy cars - let's ensure those cars are doing the least harm while we create other avenues for public transportation, specifically serving those areas that are middle and lower income.
How many people really commute on routes that are impractical for public transit? Everyone says that, but no one shows evidence that, for example, 30% of commuters are traveling from a town of 10k to a city 40 miles away or anything like that. What is the actual typical commute distance and how many people take that route? If it's so sparse what causes the ridiculous traffic everywhere?
 
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-5 (9 / -14)

numerobis

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You are right Zubenelgenubi, "White House Press Secretary Karine Jean-Pierre said the Biden-Harris administration was the only administration to gain jobs every month."

Please join your local dems and become their spokesperson. They need help taking credit for all the winning.

This should have been the slogan, T-shirt, and Kamala Harris' new neck tattoo - "More US Jobs Every Month."
Telling people who aren’t doing well that actually they’re doing great is going to win their votes how?

Radical centrists keep losing by telling people that their pain isn’t real. That leaves room for someone to come in and provide a simple and wrong solution, which is how the populists are advancing worldwide in elections.
 
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-14 (11 / -25)

Bash

Ars Scholae Palatinae
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et tu, Ars? There is no EV mandate.

Yeah I'd love to see an explanation on how Trump's "EV mandate" propaganda ended up in the title of an Ars Article. I think it should be titled Zero-Emission Vehicle mandate and care should be taken that it is only referring to California, such as:

California’s air pollution waiver and Zero-Emission Vehicle mandates are banned by Trump​

The current title may be more concise but is very incendiary in the current political atmosphere and appears to be heavily in the MAGA camp since "EV Mandate" is a dishonest term frequently tossed about by Trump.
 
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19 (19 / 0)