More modular design makes MacBook Neo easier to fix than other Apple laptops
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Surprised but very pleased by the thinking going in to this device.
My now mom managed to make a 2007 macbook last for 12 years, then she got a basic refurbished macbook air on my advice. Wish this had been around then. If they keep the product line around this is such an easy recommendation.
My now mom managed to make a 2007 macbook last for 12 years, then she got a basic refurbished macbook air on my advice. Wish this had been around then. If they keep the product line around this is such an easy recommendation.
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Hallelujah. Especially with no backlight this should at least allow the keyboard to be a genuinely cheap FRU.
My erstwhile colleagues in educational IT are probably celebrating as I write this.
My erstwhile colleagues in educational IT are probably celebrating as I write this.
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Repairable, low cost, direct competition to Chromebooks. This is taking direct aim at the educational space, specifically elementary education.
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Seems sales are good too from talking to a clerk today. I went to a shop to look at one today, and the Citrus one was on display that i got to play with for about 5 minutes. I am very impressed with what Apple has made, the build quality seems from a first glance to be better than i imagined. The screen looked great as well. It is an easy computer to recommend to the casual average user.
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It’s weird to see Apple becoming a leader in both affordable devices and repairable devices.
Sure, there’s others out there doing each better, and a couple small builders doing affordable and repairable; but 2015 me would think I had lost my mind if I said Apple was either.
Sure, there’s others out there doing each better, and a couple small builders doing affordable and repairable; but 2015 me would think I had lost my mind if I said Apple was either.
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It would be nice to see a side-by-side comparison with the Framework 12 running Linux.
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I really do wonder if this was an intentional design choice or just a happy side effect of making it cheap? No need for an oddly shaped battery filling every nook and cranny if you are going with a small battery for cost purposes. Hopefully it was a choice and we will see this in other Mac Laptops when they eventually get design refreshes.
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If anything this reaffirms Apple's intent in the Neo being an education fleet laptop first and foremost.
They're really aiming for the Chromebook's proverbial throat with this product.
They're really aiming for the Chromebook's proverbial throat with this product.
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macosandlinux
Ars Praefectus
As they clearly have the education market (as part of the buyers) in mind, this makes sense for repairability and costs (that edu buyers will look into before a purchase).
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This is a very positive development, but the cynic in me thinks this isn't done for virtuous reasons - a low cost product like this probably has a significantly smaller profit margin than what Apple usually gets, which means they can't afford to have unrepairable parts on a machine they may have to repair or replace under warranty. A single $220 top case replacement would likely wipe out the profit of multiple Neos.
Still, I am glad to see it. I know the target demo is probably mostly students, but this looks like a good product for my retiree parents, who absolutely won't notice any of the features that this is missing compared to the higher-end models.
Still, I am glad to see it. I know the target demo is probably mostly students, but this looks like a good product for my retiree parents, who absolutely won't notice any of the features that this is missing compared to the higher-end models.
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I wouldn't hold my breath on the repairability of the Neo spilling over to any of their other products. This is clearly very intentional for that model specifically, given its target market.
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Good job Apple, definitely the right call for this product and their intended market. Now please just figure out how to bring these "innovations" back into the rest of your lineup and the rest of us will be thanking you big time. Heck even just the elimination of adhesive would be a big win
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I think I’ve read this [p]rebuttal far more than the crticism.
Anyway, I don’t ask for a lot in the way of portability that my phone can’t handle, so I finally upgraded to a desktop battlestation. No regrets there, but someday the laptop that I have undocked once a month for the past eight years will go south (again!) and it’s nice to know there will be a model that suits me for the next several years.
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I watched a disassembly video of the Neo last night and it was one of the easiest to disassemble laptops I had ever seen, though possibly not of the keyboard?
The video did not show keyboard removal; and many older style business-class laptops had very accessible keyboards.
I was suitably impressed! This looks like a machine that can individually be kept in perpetual use, as long as it's usable, for as long as parts can be recycled or otherwise sourced.
The video did not show keyboard removal; and many older style business-class laptops had very accessible keyboards.
I was suitably impressed! This looks like a machine that can individually be kept in perpetual use, as long as it's usable, for as long as parts can be recycled or otherwise sourced.
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It's definitely laying the ground to enter as Google might be getting out. They've stated outright that they want to move away from ChromeOS into a 'thicker' OS, meaning a full OS with android app installs, etc.
"Rick Osterloh, took to the stage to provide some details. He referred to the operating system as “bringing Android to the PC market” and confirmed a partnership with Qualcomm on this new platform." (from Wired).
And that would undermine the very simple low end deployments that Chrome now features in so heavily.
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What do you think the Venn diagram of the intended audiences for these two computers looks like?
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Spent time today doing what I bought the Neo to do. Backup files off a SD card of my Leica camera to the Neo desktop and transfer them to an external large capacity SSD and it was very quick.
Found out that the Thunderbolt 5 OWC external SSD could not be seen by the Neo but earlier USB-C versions would work.
Found out that the Thunderbolt 5 OWC external SSD could not be seen by the Neo but earlier USB-C versions would work.
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I noticed the same when I saw Dave2Ds video. Just by looking at it, it looked far more modular than usual for an Apple device. I hope this is going to be a trend going forward with Apple.
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Yeah. I’d have to imagine that’s a big reason why this is much more repairable than other recent MacBooks.
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That’s a myth propagated by those that don’t like Apple, or how Apple’s choices have influenced the market. In general, Apple has not been worse than Pixel or Galaxy on iFixit scores and occasionally better.
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I think they could afford this with the Neo since it didn't have to be especially light and thin. In fact it's thicker and weights as much as an Air despite having a much smaller battery.
The 12" MacBook from 2015 was significantly lighter and more compact despite having a bigger battery than the Neo, but it was very tightly integrated and much less repair friendly. Horses for courses.
For what it is aimed at this certainly is a good thing.
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Yes, that is how many of us would like to interpret this. The Neo is not for me (I am able to justify why I just ordered an M5 Max), but if the Neo serviceability design represents where Apple is going for the next big MacBook Pro redesign then that is going to be good news for everyone.
I own an Apple PowerBook G3 FireWire (2000), the kind with the two modular bays (you want another battery? hard drive? CD-ROM? Swap 'em in and out) and the easy-to-remove keyboard providing access to RAM and hard drive. The price of that extreme modularity was an extremely flimsy enclosure that bent and creaked, since there were so many big holes in its plastic case around metal frame. And the cost of the removable keyboard was that it clattered on its mount points as I typed because it was fastened by a plastic screw.
But the appeal of that modularity is the same appeal of the Framework laptop today. I haven’t touched a Framework but it sounds like their enclosure is much more robust, while providing even better modularity than the PowerBook G3. I hope Apple is able to find some kind of middle way that lets the future MacBook Pro be more modular while not compromising the extremely solid build quality of current MacBook Pros.
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I think that's an apples-and-oranges comparison.
I priced out a Framework 12 with similar-ish specs to a Neo, and it was half again the cost.
I'd go with the Framework, but that's because it suits my preferences and uses better.
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It would be nice to see a side-by-side comparison with the Ubiquiti UDM Pro running OpenWRT.
/s
/s
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That's not a given, Thunderbolt does not imply a USB fallback, that entirely depends on the chip inside that SSD enclosure.
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Ooh, now this is making me interested…I’ve gotten into retro PPC era Macs as a hobby, and while not the easiest things in the world to take apart, they’re not that bad. Might wait to pick up a Neo secondhand to tinker with now
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In particular, if it's an NVMe drive, it may rely on Thunderbolt's PCIe tunneling for faster/direct access to the host machine rather than just acting as a USB mass storage device.
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They're going to have to work on MDM to get there, ideally a first party solution.
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Similar story here. Mom used a 2007 until it died in 2018, replaced that with a base Intel MacBook Air (8/256), and although using one of those embarassingly weak Intel MBAs would be a legitimate form of torture for any of us geeks here on Ars including me*...she has no complaints whatsoever, since all she does is web/YouTube.
So when it's time to replace that 2018 Intel MBA, the Neo will be a substantial upgrade for her...if she even notices. Heck, by the time that happens the Neo might be on the A19 and have 12GB RAM!
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You have to read the specs of the drive you're using. It's safe to assume that all "Thunderbolt" enclosure interfaces also support USB, but it is not a given. Same going the other way.
There is tremendous user confusion about where Thunderbolt and USB are the same or different, seen many users read about the Macs advertising all their Thunderbolt ports and don't understand that those are also USB ports so they think the Mac doesn't have any USB ports.
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