HDR gaming coming to every PS4 via firmware update next week

You won't need to buy the new PS4 Pro to get HDR compatibility.

Read the whole story

 

[iOSecure]

Do PC gamers have HDR already?

 

[mikesmith]

Considering the similarity of the xbox one's hardware to the PS4's I'll bet MS could enable the same feature on their originals with just a firmware update, too. They probably figured they'd be able to sell new systems to the same people that already own them and that Sony would be complicit in the attempt to fleece the fan base.

 

[robododo]

Hardly any televisions support Dolby Vision. HDR10 appears to be the emerging dominant standard.

In addition, would Dolby demand royalties? I can't see Sony bothering with that over a fw update.

 

[Sufinsil]

But no 4K support on the PS4 Slim for streaming or discs, which the One S can do.

 

[euskalzabe]

How is this possible? I thought you needed HDMI 2.0a for HDR compatibility.

 

[a5ehren]

iOSecure[/url]":2t7lwa9g]Do PC gamers have HDR already?

Kind of? There aren't any HDR desktop monitors that I know of, though.

 

[robododo]

mikesmith[/url]":1m7yvtx4]Considering the similarity of the xbox one's hardware to the PS4's I'll bet MS could enable the same feature on their originals with just a firmware update, too. They probably figured they'd be able to sell new systems to the same people that already own them and that Sony would be complicit in the attempt to fleece the fan base.

Keep in mind the PS4 is significantly more powerful. The XB1S has a small GPU clock speed bump. This was reportedly done in order to support the wider gamut .

My guess is that there's no HDR on XB1 because of GPU power. Also, HDMI 2.0a/HDCP2.2 support may be a factor (I honestly have no idea how they can "backport" HDR onto the PS4).

 

[Meegul]

iOSecure[/url]":3rd2f7oi]Do PC gamers have HDR already?

If HDR is just 10-bit color, then yes, for a long time. But I'm not too sure about the specifics of the technology.

 

[andre_elias]

I guess I'll need a HDR TV…


PS: off-topic, I like the new Ars design with the picture of the author, it's nice to put a face to the names.

 

[scottwsx96]

Forgive my ignorance, but Valve Software released Half-Life 2: Lost Coast in 2004, and that game supported HDR at that time.

Why is it that we need special displays in order for HDR now?

 

[UN1Xnut]

I'm really interested in the technical side as I was under the impression that the OG PS4 only had the original 10Gbps spec of the HDMI 1.4/2.0 PHY, which tops out at like 24 FPS 2160p w/ 10-bit 4:2:0 when you have HDR metadata. 10Gbps can't even do non-HDR 2160p60 w/ 8-bit 4:4:4/RGB color as it doesn't have enough bandwidth (4:2:0 works though).

I have heard, however, that the HDMI chip in the PS4 is a custom DSP job from people in a position to know such things and I guess the chip in the OG PS4 can be pushed to do 18Gbps of HDMI 2.0b?

I'm also curious on the object-based audio side with Atmos and DTS:X to see if there's any kind of channel and/or bitrate limitation. Might even be a complete lack of support like the Phat PS3 and bitstreaming TrueHD/DTS-HD.

Though not explicit mentioned, I'm going to assume Rec. 2020 and DCI-P3 color space will all be there on all hardware revisions, regardless of resolution, provided the display conveys support in the EDID data. Probably some OS-level 3D LUT color mapping too, but who knows.

 

[Rommel102]

daunda70[/url]":20zokj3r]I like that Sony did this but people need to understand that a HDR firmware update is not the same as TRUE HDR that is built into the machine. I own a Samsung TV (2015 model before HDR became the hot new thing) and it received a firmware update for HDR but it will not give you TRUE HDR. Not all of the features will be available.

Not all the features will be utilized because it is just a firmware update and not built into the TV (or gaming console) straight from the factory. The PS4 PRO will (when used with a TRUE HDR TV) give you the HDR color the way it is supposed to be. But it was still cool for Sony to offer it to everyone.

So the OG PS4 and PS4 slim will offer not-quite-real HDR, and the PS4 Pro will over not-quite-real 4K. Got it.

 

[jasonmicron]

andre_elias[/url]":3006mfkt]PS: off-topic, I like the new Ars design with the picture of the author, it's nice to put a face to the names.

They've always been there - at the bottom of every article - even in the previous design. But yes, I agree, I do appreciate the larger picture and better placement.

 

[rabish12]

scottwsx96[/url]":32svvfw2]Forgive my ignorance, but Valve Software released Half-Life 2: Lost Coast in 2004, and that game supported HDR at that time.

Why is it that we need special displays in order for HDR now?

Different HDR.

 

[Spazzles]

scottwsx96[/url]":31stp4ho]Forgive my ignorance, but Valve Software released Half-Life 2: Lost Coast in 2004, and that game supported HDR at that time.

Why is it that we need special displays in order for HDR now?

Software HDR is still limited by the physical constraints of your display technology. Most monitors and TVs have a 1000:1 contrast ratio, even though they may say something like an 8000:1 "dynamic" contrast ratio; that would be, it can display 8000 different levels of per-pixel brightness, but it'll only be able to do 1000 different levels for any particular frame / scene.

Hardware HDR aims specifically to expand that range.

 

[KAL1989]

robododo[/url]":3k2iysdg]

mikesmith[/url]":3k2iysdg]Considering the similarity of the xbox one's hardware to the PS4's I'll bet MS could enable the same feature on their originals with just a firmware update, too. They probably figured they'd be able to sell new systems to the same people that already own them and that Sony would be complicit in the attempt to fleece the fan base.

Keep in mind the PS4 is significantly more powerful. The XB1S has a small GPU clock speed bump. This was reportedly done in order to support the wider gamut .

My guess is that there's no HDR on XB1 because of GPU power. Also, HDMI 2.0a/HDCP2.2 support may be a factor (I honestly have no idea how they can "backport" HDR onto the PS4).

The GPU power isn't really the major factor in the support of HDR, it is really in the HDMI spec to support wider colours. A firmware update from Sony on the PS4 cannot make non HDR content and games HDR supported and the lack of HDMI 2.0 will likely limit full HDR10 compatibility.

The best Sony can do is really just to adjust the colour profile output on the PS4 should there be any hardware limitations.

Just a bit of extra note. Many budget 4k TVs have features that create the illusion of HDR, but none of them meet the spec of HDR10 or Dolby Vision. Odds are, they are tweaking the colour profile. This is likely just marketing speak by Sony much like those TVs that claim to support it but don't.

 

[Rommel102]

rabish12[/url]":jlrj1av4]

scottwsx96[/url]":jlrj1av4]Forgive my ignorance, but Valve Software released Half-Life 2: Lost Coast in 2004, and that game supported HDR at that time.

Why is it that we need special displays in order for HDR now?

Different HDR.

Yeah, HDR TV isn't HDR Photo: Half Life 2 was using a custom photo-style HDR.

 

[TheLastOfUnchartedS]

Sufinsil[/url]":3uw2lurc]But no 4K support on the PS4 Slim for streaming or discs, which the One S can do.

For which, you need a 4K TV, considering not everyone has one. On the other hand, anyone with a ps4 and standard HDR capable TV can get benefited from this feature.

 

[daunda70]

Rommel102[/url]":1bah73qu]

daunda70[/url]":1bah73qu]I like that Sony did this but people need to understand that a HDR firmware update is not the same as TRUE HDR that is built into the machine. I own a Samsung TV (2015 model before HDR became the hot new thing) and it received a firmware update for HDR but it will not give you TRUE HDR. Not all of the features will be available.

Not all the features will be utilized because it is just a firmware update and not built into the TV (or gaming console) straight from the factory. The PS4 PRO will (when used with a TRUE HDR TV) give you the HDR color the way it is supposed to be. But it was still cool for Sony to offer it to everyone.

So the OG PS4 and PS4 slim will offer not-quite-real HDR, and the PS4 Pro will over not-quite-real 4K. Got it.

HDR has become the real push.
Read up on it. You will see how the media pushes 4k but the experts push HDR.

 

[rabish12]

TheLastOfUnchartedS[/url]":125voqne]

Sufinsil[/url]":125voqne]But no 4K support on the PS4 Slim for streaming or discs, which the One S can do.

For which, you need a 4K TV, considering not everyone has one. On the other hand, anyone with a ps4 and standard HDR capable TV can get benefited from this feature.

"Standard HDR-capable TVs" aren't exactly common (or cheap) either.

 

[Rommel102]

TheLastOfUnchartedS[/url]":2azfx2b0]

Sufinsil[/url]":2azfx2b0]But no 4K support on the PS4 Slim for streaming or discs, which the One S can do.

For which, you need a 4K TV, considering not everyone has one. On the other hand, anyone with a ps4 and standard HDR capable TV can get benefited from this feature.

Eh, all of the 1080p sets with HDR are just as new as the 4K sets, only a year or 2 max. So yes, it is possible that some folks that just recently bought a TV got HDR but not 4K, but it is hardly a huge universe.

 

[Deleted member 1]

Rommel102[/url]":2hifyjyj]

TheLastOfUnchartedS[/url]":2hifyjyj]

Sufinsil[/url]":2hifyjyj]But no 4K support on the PS4 Slim for streaming or discs, which the One S can do.

For which, you need a 4K TV, considering not everyone has one. On the other hand, anyone with a ps4 and standard HDR capable TV can get benefited from this feature.

Eh, all of the 1080p sets with HDR are just as new as the 4K sets, only a year or 2 max. So yes, it is possible that some folks that just recently bought a TV got HDR but not 4K, but it is hardly a huge universe.

I would say the sub-set of people with non-4k TVs that are HDR compatible is smaller then the subset of people with 4K TVs.

Just like the even smaller subset of HDR 4K TVs.

 

[Spazzles]

UN1Xnut[/url]":i1zlvlln]I'm really interested in the technical side as I was under the impression that the OG PS4 only had the original 10Gbps spec of the HDMI 1.4/2.0 PHY, which tops out at like 24 FPS w/ 10-bit 4:2:0 when you have HDR metadata. 10Gbps can't even do non-HDR 2160p60 w/ 8-bit 4:4:4/RGB color as it doesn't have enough bandwidth (4:2:0 works though).

I have heard, however, that the HDMI chip in the PS4 is a custom DSP job from people in a position to know such things and I guess the chip in the OG PS4 can be pushed to do 18Gbps of HDMI 2.0b?

I'm also curious on the object-based audio side with Atmos and DTS:X to see if there's any kind of channel and/or bitrate limitation. Might even be a complete lack of support like the Phat PS3 and bitstreaming TrueHD/DTS-HD.

Though not explicit mentioned, I'm going to assume Rec. 2020 and DCI-P3 color space will all be there on all hardware revisions, regardless of resolution, provided the display conveys support in the EDID data. Probably some OS-level 3D LUT color mapping too, but who knows.

This is fantastic info. I was having difficulty looking up the details; I'm very interested in knowing more about the custom DSP chip. Any directions you could send me in?

 

[Abulia]

euskalzabe[/url]":3p846dtm]How is this possible? I thought you needed HDMI 2.0a for HDR compatibility.

Color (heh!) me confused as well. Is Sony patching HDMI 2.0a ports with every legacy PS4 as well?

Ars not really asking the seemingly obvious technical questions here.

 

[hallon]

Rommel102[/url]":39giwy6w]

rabish12[/url]":39giwy6w]

scottwsx96[/url]":39giwy6w]Forgive my ignorance, but Valve Software released Half-Life 2: Lost Coast in 2004, and that game supported HDR at that time.

Why is it that we need special displays in order for HDR now?

Different HDR.

Yeah, HDR TV isn't HDR Photo: Half Life 2 was using a custom photo-style HDR.

A common jpeg photo stores a range of brightness values that can be displayed at the same time on common monitors. HL2 stored more brightness values than could be displayed at the same time. When players were in a brightly-lit area, the higher brightness values could be distinguished, and lower brightness values appeared black. The reverse was true in dimly-lit areas.

 

[danbert2000]

Spazzles[/url]":21jyuu5m]Software HDR is still limited by the physical constraints of your display technology. Most monitors and TVs have a 1000:1 contrast ratio, even though they may say something like an 8000:1 "dynamic" contrast ratio

This isn't really true for any HDR capable display out there. OLED screens have much better native contrast, as do VA LED screens like all the modern Vizios. If you check the Rtings.com page that talks about contrast, you can see that most modern displays that would ship with HDR support are 3000:1 and higher rather than 1000:1. Check out the table on this link:

http://www.rtings.com/tv/tests/picture- ... rast-ratio

Also, HDR definitely helps a TV display varied scenes much more accurately, but the technology relies on hardware features like OLED or local dimming to actually display the expanded range. A TV with local dimming and SDR content will look better than a TV with "HDR" support but no new backlight technology. 10-bit panels are also a big part of the equation.

 

[junktrunk]

TheDarkerPhantom[/url]":1x4i46y1]

Rommel102[/url]":1x4i46y1]

TheLastOfUnchartedS[/url]":1x4i46y1]

Sufinsil[/url]":1x4i46y1]But no 4K support on the PS4 Slim for streaming or discs, which the One S can do.

For which, you need a 4K TV, considering not everyone has one. On the other hand, anyone with a ps4 and standard HDR capable TV can get benefited from this feature.

Eh, all of the 1080p sets with HDR are just as new as the 4K sets, only a year or 2 max. So yes, it is possible that some folks that just recently bought a TV got HDR but not 4K, but it is hardly a huge universe.

I would say the sub-set of people with non-4k TVs that are HDR compatible is smaller then the subset of people with 4K TVs.

Just like the even smaller subset of HDR 4K TVs.

Agreed. We just bought a 4K HDR TV earlier this year, and judging by at least Samsung's lineup, they don't even offer HDR on non 4K TVs. In fact, HDR is not even offered on all but their highest-end 4K TVs (e.g. the higher end section of the SUHD lineup). It's possible other manufacturers took a different approach (maybe Sony) but judging by how much shelf space in 2016 shifted from 1080p to 4K I think most were focusing first on resolution rather than additional contrast.

I'm looking forward to finally having some content that can make use of it...

 

[AM16]

HDR (High Dynamic Range) us a feature for Ultra HD films and TVs.

To my knowledge, PC games support a slew of other technologies that accomplish or emulate the same, provided you display has a good contrast ratio. On TVs, only newer ultra expensive 4K ones will support it, as far as I know.

 

[MrTom]

With all the confusion of HDR and other 4K offerings that's why there has been a new labeling system to put on TVs. HDR should have been in all TVs from the get go, ever since the 1st 4K TV was sold. But you know how it is, manufacturers just wanna make the cheapest possible and get it out as fast as possible. The lack of standards on labeling let this all happen. Everyone sees a 4K TV and say yummy, lets get it! But then try and watch 4K material and can't see much difference because of the lack of displaying all the benefits of 4K. But I'd say the market needed all those suckers buying up all those "4K" TVs. This led to lower prices and a more widespread adoption of 4K. Now we're ready for the "real" 4K hardware.

 

[StilesCrisis]

Sufinsil[/url]":jlfabmte]But no 4K support on the PS4 Slim for streaming or discs, which the One S can do.

Streaming support could easily come in a software update.

Disc support is probably going to be irrelevant, to be honest. I say this as the owner of about 500+ movies on Blu-ray (and maybe 100 more on DVD); I don't know anyone who is seriously contemplating rebuilding their movie library with UHD Blu-rays. The handwriting is on the wall--streaming is the future.

 

[OmegaPoint]

euskalzabe[/url]":2b87w00e]How is this possible? I thought you needed HDMI 2.0a for HDR compatibility.

Even more confusingly, if Sony do mean proper HDR (as used by UHD Bluray) it should also only be possible over HDMI at 2160p (4K), assuming I'm reading my TV's manual and this FAQ right: http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_2 ... q.aspx#145

Though 4K and HDR support for TV is not always simple so it might be there is some combination that would work at 1080p.

 

[JamesHulsmann]

So I see the gaming and tech press are still taking the needed salt when listening to Sony and throwing in a vault.

At what point do you actually start taking ALL of these companies with the salt that actually required?


Sony says 4K about some games that will only upscaled, Xbox One S styled, and no one says boo about it - but it is more than to take MS with a pound of salt when THEY talk about 4K-native.

Sony claims HDR is coming to ALL PS4's, but no one asks about how that is being achieved - but instead talks smack about how HDR on Xbox starts with the S moving forward, leaving current owners behind.

I could go on, for years this have been true ("three times more powerful than xbox 360") - but I think you get the point. Apparently Apple, Sony and sometimes Nintendo can basically say whatever they want. Amazon, Google and MS and everyone else should only be so lucky (an no, the companies whose claims are easily accepted HAVE NOT earned it, not by a long shot - in fact, quite the opposite).

 

[xcodemustdie]

scottwsx96[/url]":31f4vl25]Forgive my ignorance, but Valve Software released Half-Life 2: Lost Coast in 2004, and that game supported HDR at that time.

Why is it that we need special displays in order for HDR now?

I can't remember the exact method that game used but most/all games that use HDR will use the high definition range in the pipeline, but right at the end it converts that final high definition range picture to a low definition range picture ,because most monitors/GPU's actually only display 8 bits per plane, so in effect you're losing some of the color/brightness range

 

[UN1Xnut]

 

[computertheque]

MrTom[/url]":2m6jjgft]With all the confusion of HDR and other 4K offerings that's why there has been a new labeling system to put on TVs. HDR should have been in all TVs from the get go, ever since the 1st 4K TV was sold. But you know how it is, manufacturers just wanna make the cheapest possible and get it out as fast as possible. The lack of standards on labeling let this all happen. Everyone sees a 4K TV and say yummy, lets get it! But then try and watch 4K material and can't see much difference because of the lack of displaying all the benefits of 4K. But I'd say the market needed all those suckers buying up all those "4K" TVs. This led to lower prices and a more widespread adoption of 4K. Now we're ready for the "real" 4K hardware.

4K was a rushed format change because 1080p 3D tvs didn't move like the industry banked on. They needed a new push to keep sales momentum, which 3D ultimately failed at providing.

The trickle of "complete" features sets for 4K tvs is the result.

 

[reallynotnick]

Is there a list of HDR compatible games? Or is nothing going to be in HDR come the update?

 

[Brandon B]

robododo[/url]":15qeshmr]Hardly any televisions support Dolby Vision. HDR10 appears to be the emerging dominant standard.

In addition, would Dolby demand royalties? I can't see Sony bothering with that over a fw update.

Vizio and LG are supporting DV. Samsung and Sony are not.

Also, Dolby's licensing model only requires royalties on displays. Not sources.

 

[samred]

Abulia[/url]":avijav04]

euskalzabe[/url]":avijav04]How is this possible? I thought you needed HDMI 2.0a for HDR compatibility.

Color (heh!) me confused as well. Is Sony patching HDMI 2.0a ports with every legacy PS4 as well?

Ars not really asking the seemingly obvious technical questions here.

Sorry, it's been a busy day at Ars Orbital. While we're still awaiting an official Sony response, this is an interesting question, and I'm working on something about it.